SUPER AGGRESSIVE BP....how do you deal with it?

Ok, I was not going to post this until my girl settles in and calms down, but I really don't think she will. I have had ball pythons, boas, caimans, monitors, iguanas......you name it. I am very anal and I make sure my temps are good with the right food, humidity, and space for my snakes.

To start, I built a melamine rack (until I can afford a nicer rack...Animal Plastics, Freedom, etc.). I have Sterlite 41q tubs (34" x 18" x 6"). The sides; 34" are melamine so the tub provides plenty of closed space for security for my BP's. I have 3" Flexwatt going across the back, about 8" from the back and the very back is pegboard. I have a Helix regulating the temps and newspaper substrate. My hot side is right around 90-92 and my cool side is 80-81. I have the water bowl in the middle, a little more towards the cool side and humidity is 50-60%.

So, 10 days ago I received 3 normal 900 gram BP females. They were sent USPS overnight and when they arrived, I handled them for about 3 minutes making sure they were ok. I had to put them in glass tanks because my Helix got delayed while in transit to me via UPS. The breeder I bought them from said I should feed them because he had not fed them for 2-3 weeks since he knew he would be shipping them. I opened the tank to move a a hide box over (haven't even defrosted the rats yet) and bam, the largest female struck me. I didn't think anything of it, she had a rough trip being overnighted and was hungry. I fed her an hour later one small, 60g rat. She sat at the tank waiting for me to open it for 2 days straight so I gave her another 60g rat.....ate it no problem.

Two days after I got them, my Helix came in and I established good temps, humidity, etc. The breeder said NONE of his BP's ever struck and that was unlike her. So, I got them in the racks and all seemed fine. I bought 3 female pastels and 1 male bumble bee the next day and they settled in fine......my fiesty normal girl sat at the front of the tub in strike position for those 3 days. Then Tuesday, I fed them. My female normals struck the F/T rat the second I started putting it in the tub. She ate it no problem and sat waiting for more.......so, I gave her another small F/T rat. She ate it and went to the heat for two days, so I thought everything was fine and she was settling in. Well, Thursday morning, she came off the heat and is in strike position again......she's been there for 2 days. When I open the tub, she flys out very aggressively. She is always ready to jump out and is never in a ball. My pastels and bee hang out on the hot and cool side and come to the front every now and again. When I open the tubs, they sit there and watch me......change water or whatever. My normal girl won't even let me open the tub 3 inches before she is 6 inches out looking at me in strike position.

I love that she eats so great and she will be 1500 grams in 2-3 months at this rate. I just hate that she is so hard to check on, change water, change newspaper, etc. Why is she so aggressive? Should I get a hook so I can poke her nose to get her back in the cage when I check on her? I don't care about getting bit, a little blood never hurt anyone, but I would rather not get bit! Any advice? Thanks in advanced for anything you can tell me, this site is great and helping me take care of my BP's better each day.

First of all, shipping snakes via USPS is illegal...

It can take quite a while for a new snake to settle in. Up to a month for them to feel confident that you are not trying to harm them and that they are safe in their enclosure.

You can hook train her if you would like but if dealt with correctly, this behavior can be suppressed.

I am not doubting that it will take her a little while to get acclimated to her new environment at all, but she is not balled up, not in the back away from the opening of the rack, and she is sitting in strike position the whole time. She comes out 2 seconds after I open the rack 3 inches. She does not seem timid, nervous, or agitated at all. It just seems like she is really hungry and aggressive all the time. When I put the digital thermometer on the shelf outside her rack, she moves her head and follows my hand. Last night, I went in the snake room to get my wallet that I left on my desk next to the rack. I used a flashlight so I didn't have to turn the light on and bother them. All of a sudden, I hear a thump and another thump. I flash the light toward her tub and thump, she strikes again. I know the heat/light can cause that, but man, she did it three times in 5 seconds and I was 5 feet away. Again, I know that all snakes settle in differently, but I have never had a snake so aggressive. All 6 of the other BP's show no signs of being anything like her, accept when I feed them (which is good). Do you think her aggressive behavior will go away in a month after she gets acclimated and a full belly of rats consistently? Sorry my posts are so long.

I'm no expert, but I would expect her to chill out as time goes on. What's worked for me before with any aggression is just blowing at the snake which doesn't hurt but causes them to pull back a bit. Though the only aggression I've had experience with was due to hunger.

Have you handled her outside of the tank yet? I would assume not, since she's still new, but if so I'm curious about her temperament.

If her previous owner wasn't feeding her enough then she is probably just hungry. Once you get her eating consistently that behavior should stop.

I don't consider these animals "aggressive" at all. They are either very hungry or very scared, but not aggressive.

I sure hope she does. The previous owner kind of seems shady, now that I have been in contact with him. I will continue to give her plenty of food and the right environment. I think you are right, she seems HUNGRY all the time. She has had 4 small rats over the last 10 days and is still NOT satisfied. Hopefully one medium (100-120 gram) rat will satisfy her every 7 days. I don't think I can get close enough to blow in her face, she would probably get too close to my face....she has NO fear. Thanks for the advice.

My Albino was very skiddish and struck at EVERYTHING that moved. After 3 bites he started to settle down. Now he's just a little jumpy when I first take him out, then he's fine. I think yours will settle down the same way.

Sounds to me like she's been seriously underfed for a while.

Ever seen a starving dog? When they are offered food, they'll gorge until they vomit, then gorge again. They simply cannot get used to the fact they don't need to stuff themselves anymore. It can take weeks of consistent feeding and patience to re-train these dogs. I'm wondering if she's not experiencing something similar?


I got myself a big new female last sunday, and while she's not aggressive, you can tell they did not feed her well. She is extremely food oriented, to put it politely. I do believe she'd eat until she burst if I'd let her. She just can't seem to get enough to eat. I'm going to try going bigger with her this coming feeding day, because the smaller rats that work for everyone else she thinks are m&m's or something.

As far as what to do about her lunging at you, if it's necessary to open her tub for maintenance or whatever, have yourself a big old plastic or wooden spoon or spatula, the bigger the better, and have it ready to insert between you and her if she lunges. Even if she hits it, it won't hurt her, and seeing an object like that she doesn't recognize might just convince her to back off a bit.

Gale

Hi,

I agree on the shady.

He shipped USPS and didn't feed for three weeks because "he knew he'd be shipping them"

You have had them only 10 days and have moved them to different tanks already - be happy they are eating. :)

Use a hook or a water bottle and touch the top of her head gently when you are going in the tank to do anything instead of feeding if she is in strike position. That should make her draw back and snap out of feeding mode hopefully.


dr del

I would FEED HER! As much as she will eat once a week and when she is full she will calm down.

Besides her being hungry I would put a towel around her tub so she can't see anything. Do that for a week, maybe without seeing any movement she'll settle down. Of course, feed her normally, but keep that towel up so she can't see you walking around in the room.

When I bought my black pastel, he was the same way. Of course, I put him by himself to quarantine, but every time I went in there he would strike. I completely covered his enclosure so he couldn't see anything. He's settled down a lot now. Of course, he was just a wee one. But, it can't hurt right?

I have a 08 female that is really spunky. I say just spunky because although she is always ready for a meal and gives the impression she will strike she has yet to strike. I find that the more I handle her for short periods of time the more she calms down. I would keep her well fed and handle her as often as you can once you have her used to her bin. I have a feeling his last owner did not handle too often. Good luck

Yeah, the seller said he was going to ship using Ship Your Reptiles. I never received a tracking number and then the box showed up the following morning USPS. He emailed me after he shipped them saying that he had not fed them for 2-3 weeks so they should be hungry. When I pulled them out of the bag, I did handle them for a little bit and they were all fine.....docile and just happy to be out of the box. The seller seemed like a good guy but I am only going to deal with people with good reputations or local breeders from now on.

I am extemely grateful she is eating. I did not expect any of them to eat when I received them and then again a week later with such appetite. I am going to change her water and substrate tonight so after that, she will be left alone until the next feeding, Tuesday. I will keep all the advice in mind......just this morning, I went to her tub and opened it an inch and she was right there, trying to squeeze out.

Before you call her aggressive, I would evaluate her attitude when she's NOT expecting food to come flying in. And yes--get a hook! Some of my breeder females get this way at this time of the year--I call it the 'feeding season', that follows the breeding season, lol. A hook works great as a simple tap-stick to defuse a snake looking for food, or you can just use it to move a snake that simply WON'T come down out of that mode.

If you can use a tap stick on her and get her out of feeding mode, and pick her up and handle her normally without having her take any potshots at you, then I would say she's not aggressive, she's just hungry.

An aggressive BP will strike at you defensively when you open the bin--not looking for food, just to make you go away. They hiss, too.

I know I am jumping to conclusions after reading some of your posts, its just she has tried to bite me three times in the last week......connecting on one attempt. I figured she would have been full after two 60+ gram rats in one feeding and four small rats within 8 days. I guess maybe not. She is not scared at all by any means though. I will keep her nice and fat and hopefully she calms down. Since I did handle her day 1 with no problem, I would think she could calm down.

Where would you suggest I buy a hook from? Any particular models? We have a reptile show in Arlington, TX at the end of July, do you suggest I wait to buy one until then or order one somewhere online? Thanks.

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Originally Posted by dr del

Use a hook or a water bottle and touch the top of her head gently when you are going in the tank to do anything instead of feeding if she is in strike position. That should make her draw back and snap out of feeding mode hopefully.


dr del

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i keep reading about this in posts and i was just wondering if someone could explain to me how tapping them on the head makes them realize its not feeding time? or is it something you have to do consistently until they learn the tap means something?

If you got bonked on the head every time you went into a certain restaurant, would you wanna eat there?

At least I think that's how the theory works. It basically just knocks them out of feeding mode. Eventually you shouldn't have to do it, as they won't automatically be in feeding mode.

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Originally Posted by thetonyage

i keep reading about this in posts and i was just wondering if someone could explain to me how tapping them on the head makes them realize its not feeding time? or is it something you have to do consistently until they learn the tap means something?

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Its almost like when a dog starts to fixate on something and you know they're about to lunge so you give them a correction and it snaps them out of it. Not sure why it works, but it does.

My guys never strike at me but I can tell when they think it's feeding time. I just give them a tap or pick them up from behind and they snap right out of it.

Well for one, keep in mine ball pythons are NOT a snake that loves to be held. Their to be admired through their Tub/Tank. They tolerate handling to an extent before they stress out or get aggressive.


Feeding and keeping them content will help keep them more settle but not always. Keep in mind its a snake, their not meant to be held for out pleasure, respect them as they are and you should be good.

Tap = touch. They do not mean "bonk" on the head. Touching the snake with anything will often snap them out of hunting/feeding/defence mode.

I however have one that I simply don't deal with lol. One of my younger girls strikes at everything that moves. If you are holding her she will strike at your hands and arms. Even your face if you are silly enough to let her get that close. Meanest BP I have ever seen. So I just feed her ravenous little self as often as possible and leave her be.

I dunno. I would never touch a snake on the head, at least out of respect. The blowing thing only serves to distract them, not present any sort of danger.

I agree with the covering him up idea, at least for a week or so. The 4 meals he's eaten should be enough for a while, and assuming the environment is adequate, I would just leave him be for some time. I'm sure he'll be happier without all the attention.

Hi,

Wouldn't the blowing on him thing have a higher chance of triggering a strike - our breath is quite warm after all. :confused:

I know any kind of heat signature near my little lunatics on feeding day has a high chance of getting struck at.

Ball pythons are notoriously headshy - touching it on the head will usually trigger the animal to withdraw its head and make it defensive rather than be either aggressive or in feeding mode.

One question I meant to ask earlier - does the OP breed his own rodents and are they in the same area as these new arrivals? Just to rule out pre-scenting in an animal that previously only ever got that before feeding.


dr del

First, I would verify the temps in the enclosures. A hot cage may cause agression. She is hungry, that too can cause agression. She has been shipped via USPS which means the content of the package was not known to the employees handling the box. They probably threw the box around, not knowing it held snakes, that too may cause agression.

So, what I'm saying is that your snake's past 2-3 weeks hasn't been a very pleasant experience.

I would feed it, and then leave it alone. Someone else said to cover the enclsoure, this is a good idea. Take away any and all stimulus.

Are you sure you are feeding the appropriate sized rodent to your snake? By feeding too small could cause your snake to always want more.

One question for you. If you remove the snake from it's enclosure, does the snake calm down? Maybe it's just a case of cage agressioin. Working with the snake over the next few months should take care of this problem.

Work with gloves if you are afraid of getting tagged. Welder's glove work well, but any heavy canvas glove will work.

Good Luck!
Jim Smith

PS Do you feed live or F/T? Maybe convert to F/T, this could decrease the agressiveness too.

I just think I have been had by a bad breeder. After he shipped them he told me a lot of things that would have made me NOT buy from him.......like he had not fed them in 3 weeks, he said he was sending them by "Ship Your Reptiles" and then sends me a USPS tracking code (bad code), etc. I bought 3 normal 900 gram girls from him and the other two are semi-aggressive too. I have had BP's, boas, rainbows, and plenty of other herps and this one is just a nut.

My temps are 90-92 on the Sterlite 41q tub (34 x 16 x 6). On the cool side, it stays right at 80 solid. I have 8 oz glass water dishes and newspaper substrate. I spay a water bottle stream on the inside side of the tub, front and back for humidity, which is about 60% at first and after about a week, goes down to around 50%.......but the middle of the tub should be around 60% with the water there. They are in my office and NOBODY but I go into there, usually once in the morning to check on them and 2-3 times in the evening. I bought 3 other BP's from a local reputable breeder and all three of his snakes are nice, normal BP temperments. I have only handled them putting them into the tubs. I have been giving all of them privacy to settle in. I also bought another 900g female from another reputable breeder in Iowa shipped overnight. He was great to deal with and his girl has been just like my other 3 that have not been aggressive.

Just before I typed this post, I went to change the fiesty ones water......I took a golf club (rubber end not the club end) with me to just barely touch her head to get her out of strike position.....as soon as I opened the tub, she came out and I softly touched her head......she struck the rubber grip 2 times and kept coming out. I touched her head again and she again struck it with ferocity. I gently pushed her body toward the back of the tub and she struck again, then she turned the other way. I took the water dish and she started back toward me. I took the clean water and put it back in the tub, with the rubber club in between the water dish and her.

I am willing to just take a loss on these girls and ship them back to the shady breeder I got them from. I am a complete dumbass for buying from someone that had no reputation. I know he is getting rid of at least one of these girls because she is aggressive. To me, its just easier NOT to have to deal with her, buy a hook, worry that my wife cannot help me take care of them when I am out of town, etc. I know they, or she can probably calm down but I have also read about many other aggressive girls that have not. I really do not care about the aggression so much, but why deal with it if I don't have to on some normal girls? I would rather buy some good, normal, sub-adult girls from a reputable breeder looking to make room in his racks for morphs or babies. I know a lot of you won't agree. I really am a patient person and maybe I am just blowing off some steam to y'all.

lve had snakes that just dont calm down, a female bp especlally. She couldnt get used to the scent of my cats and she would work herself up to the polnt that she would hlt the tub wall over and over agaln. l rehomed her. as soon as l dld she was calm and acted just llke a normal bp.

do you have any other klnd of pets that would create a responce llke thls?

You could just throw a hand towel over her when you need to get in the tub.

I have a feeling it will just take time and a lot of good meals for her to calm down.

Also, ship your reptiles won't even ship snakes anymore. The only way to ship snakes is fedex, and you need to be certified before you can ship. So shipping them back to him LEGALLY might prove to be more complicated.

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Originally Posted by cinderbird

lve had snakes that just dont calm down, a female bp especlally. She couldnt get used to the scent of my cats and she would work herself up to the polnt that she would hlt the tub wall over and over agaln. l rehomed her. as soon as l dld she was calm and acted just llke a normal bp.

do you have any other klnd of pets that would create a responce llke thls?

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Dude, what is up with using the "l"(lowercase L) as an "I". :confused: :rofl:

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Originally Posted by Kaorte

Dude, what is up with using the "l"(lowercase L) as an "I". :confused: :rofl:

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x2...:confused:

I've got a Lesser who is aggressive too. I was cleaning her enclosure today and placed her on the table next to the rack. She reared up like a viper and was ready to envenomate me. I wish I had a camera with me. She had half her body off the table, in the classic "S" shape strike position. I let her strike at me a few times, then I covered her head. Then she starts in with her hssing. I then reach over and pick her up. She's fine by this point. I can hold her, let her crawl over over my arms with no issues. She's a great eater, so I don't really care. No one in the house is willing to hold her. I've never been bit by her AFTER, I've calmed her down. She has struck at me a number of times. At first I was letting her strike and bite me. I thought she'd get the message that she can't eat me, but she never has gotten that memo. So I don't let her bite me any longer. I get a kick out of her striking at me because she really does act like a viper. Maybe one day, I'll remember to take a camera in while I'm cleaning cages.

Jim Smith

I have 3 dogs and they are not allowed in the snake room. I don't know what else could trigger her to be like that. Like I said, I love that she is a great eater (so far) and a huge part of me would take a MEAN good eating breeder anyday over a calm picky eater. Maybe she will settle down, maybe not. I could understand settling down if she only struck when I went into the tub, but she comes from the back to the front the second I come in and gets into strike position.....then strikes of course.

As far as shipping, I will figure it out. I will have to do some research on how to get certified someday anyways. I know I can probably send it Delta or even have a local breeder ship if I pay them a fee.

There's a thread in general or somewhere on how to get certified. You basically mail them a demo package, minus snake, then wait for approval.

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Originally Posted by rj1204

I have 3 dogs and they are not allowed in the snake room. I don't know what else could trigger her to be like that. Like I said, I love that she is a great eater (so far) and a huge part of me would take a MEAN good eating breeder anyday over a calm picky eater. Maybe she will settle down, maybe not. I could understand settling down if she only struck when I went into the tub, but she comes from the back to the front the second I come in and gets into strike position.....then strikes of course.

As far as shipping, I will figure it out. I will have to do some research on how to get certified someday anyways. I know I can probably send it Delta or even have a local breeder ship if I pay them a fee.

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So, she's a good eater, and hopefully, a good looking snake. You want to send her back because she's aggressive? Is this the only reason? I would say, give it a few months. She could calm down. If not, just deal with the aggression. If she's going to be a breeder, maybe she'll quiet down after she's bred.

Cool her down to 88 degrees and see if she calms down a llittle bit. She could have been kept at a lot cooler temp and she's not used to the temps you now have her at.

Maybe ask the breeder what substrate she was kept on and change to that substrate.

It's up to you if you want to return the snake, but i would try to work it out first.

Good Luck!
Jim Smith

I actually read that sticky on becoming Fed Ex certified just a little bit ago and will probably get that done for future shipments anyways.

So, I have been thinking about my 2 normal girls (one semi-aggressive and the other really aggressive) all day. Obviously BP's can be picky eaters and that seems to be the most common problem amongst owners. My fiesty girls seem to be great eaters and if they do stay on the aggressive side, I don't think I will have to worry too much about them not eating! Also, the breeder I bought them from doesn't seem 100% reputable and I'm not sure I trust making another transaction of any sort with him. I got them to get a good start on breeding and I think they will be good for just that.

I made a hook using my King Cobra five wood golf club and screwed a rubber coated hook on the end......wrapping it in electrical tape where the hook meets the club. So, long story short, I am going to just work with them (the one female mainly). Hopefully she calms down once she sees that she is getting food consistently and has a nice home. I will check on her two times a week......Tuesday is feeding day and Saturday/Sunday is cleaning day. I am just going to use the extra tubs/rack I have and just move her into a clean tub. All my racks are within a degree of each other. Thanks for all the advice. It is good to hear that I am not the only one with a possible mean girl and that there is hope she could settle down and become handlable!

Lol, ghetto hook.

She seems really nasty, but she could just be mad about something or other. I'd give her a chance too. Keep a pair of thick gloves around, especially for your wife.

I've had a few snakes that were just like that. I agree that you have to get them out of the aggressive mode. If i opened up the tub, and just slowly reached in, then they would strike. You almost have to intimidate them, as stated earlier, by getting them to snap their heads back. I do this by fearlessly reaching in, grabbing, and pulling them all of a sudden right out of the tub. Doesn't hurt the snake (just their pride), and seems to work well for me.

Since I posted this thread, I put newspaper over her cage so she could have some privacy and calm down. A few days later, I checked on her and she was in the back of the tub on the heat. I fed her on Tuesday and when I opened the tub, she stayed in the back for about 5 seconds and slowly came towards the front (she could smell the rat). She fed just fine and went back to the heat, where she has been for the last 2 days. Hopefully she is settling in.

When I clean her tub out this weekend, I will probably pull it out, pick her up in the front with my hook, and pick her up in the middle with my hand. I also may just pull her tub all the way out, put a towel over her head, and just pick her up. I don't care about getting bit but prefer not too!

One other thing for the OP to think about since you think the breeder is kind of shady -- you might want to sex the snakes yourself or get it done by a reputable breeder/vet. If everything else about the breeder has been questionable, I probably wouldn't trust their sexing either!

Just my $.02