Cage Aggression Due to Feeding Practices

I was at work yesterday and one of my co-workers took the ball pythons out of their cage and took them into the back to feed them. While I was in the back and she was feeding (they actually ate for once, but I might add that later when I looked in the feeding log she had wrote down that she fed one of them 4 pinkies! Ugh!) I just said "Petsmart's way of feeding is so strange to me." She asked me what I meant and I mentioned that I fed in the cage. She then replies, "Oh no, you shouldn't do that. It makes them cage aggressive." I politely told her that no, that is a myth and whether you feed in the cage or outside the cage has no influence on cage aggression. She says, "I have to respectfully disagree." I then told her that I keep ball pythons and that I don't have any snakes that are cage aggressive BECAUSE I feed in the cage. I have one or two that are just cage aggressive anyway (Thriller my pastel, though he is improving a lot, and my corn snake who has been cage aggressive since day 1) She says, "Well then I think you are just lucky then." I told her that many breeders that I have spoken to do not experience cage aggression either even if they feed in the cage.

So I figured I'd take a poll here and see how many people actually experience ANY cage aggression. Please, please, please fill this out the way I write it because I want to compile all the data and possibly print it out to show my co-workers.

Hobbyist or Breeder:
# Snakes in Collection:
How often do you handle your snakes:
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?:
# of snakes with cage aggression:
F/T P/K or Live?:
Tank/Tub:

Hobbyist or Breeder: Steven (PurplePython)
# Snakes in Collection: 2
How often do you handle your snakes: 3-4 times a week each
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?: Inside cage
# of snakes with cage aggression: 0
F/T P/K or Live?: Live
Tank/Tub: Tanks currently

Quote:

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Originally Posted by PurplePython

Hobbyist or Breeder: Steven (PurplePython)
# Snakes in Collection: 2
How often do you handle your snakes: 3-4 times a week each
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?: Inside cage
# of snakes with cage aggression: 0
F/T P/K or Live?: Live
Tank/Tub: Tanks currently

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Oops, guess I should have done that differently. Hobbyist or Breeder means are you just keeping snakes or do you breed them as well? Thanks for the reply!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jay_Bunny

I was at work yesterday and one of my co-workers took the ball pythons out of their cage and took them into the back to feed them. While I was in the back and she was feeding (they actually ate for once, but I might add that later when I looked in the feeding log she had wrote down that she fed one of them 4 pinkies! Ugh!) I just said "Petsmart's way of feeding is so strange to me." She asked me what I meant and I mentioned that I fed in the cage. She then replies, "Oh no, you shouldn't do that. It makes them cage aggressive." I politely told her that no, that is a myth and whether you feed in the cage or outside the cage has no influence on cage aggression. She says, "I have to respectfully disagree." I then told her that I keep ball pythons and that I don't have any snakes that are cage aggressive BECAUSE I feed in the cage. I have one or two that are just cage aggressive anyway (Thriller my pastel, though he is improving a lot, and my corn snake who has been cage aggressive since day 1) She says, "Well then I think you are just lucky then." I told her that many breeders that I have spoken to do not experience cage aggression either even if they feed in the cage.

So I figured I'd take a poll here and see how many people actually experience ANY cage aggression. Please, please, please fill this out the way I write it because I want to compile all the data and possibly print it out to show my co-workers.

Hobbyist or Breeder:
# Snakes in Collection:
How often do you handle your snakes:
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?:
# of snakes with cage aggression:
F/T P/K or Live?:
Tank/Tub:

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NOTICE: If you have multiple snakes and some get live, some get f/t, some get p/k, please make note of how many snakes get each. Also, adding a new question...

Mouse/Rat/Other: (please specify if other and if you feed both rats and mice and how many snakes get each)

Hobbyist or Breeder: Both
# Snakes in Collection: 17
How often do you handle your snakes: Daily for some, weekly for others
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?: Always feed in their own home.
# of snakes with cage aggression:None
F/T P/K or Live?: Live only Rats and asf's
Tank/Tub: Tubs

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jay_Bunny

Oops, guess I should have done that differently. Hobbyist or Breeder means are you just keeping snakes or do you breed them as well? Thanks for the reply!

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oops sorry. Just a hobbyist for now.

Thank you both for participating. I hope I get many responses. If I get enough, who knows, maybe I might try and take on Petsmart's policies on how they house and feed their snakes. :D

Hobbyist or Breeder: hobbyist
# Snakes in Collection:2
How often do you handle your snakes:2-3 a week sometimes more/less
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?: outside
# of snakes with cage aggression: 0
F/T P/K or Live?: live
Tank/Tub:tank
the younger one(8 mths) is on med mice once a week, the older one(5 yr) is on med/lg rat once or twice a month

I consider myself a hobbyist breeder. I do have a business, but it's just for fun. I a have over 60 snakes in my permanent collection. They are mostly corn snakes, but I do have eight ball pythons and a couple of boa constrictors. With that many snakes, the majority of them do not get handled daily, but most of them get handled at least once a week. For the most part, I prefer to feed outside of the cage, because it eliminates any mess that might end up in their cages and any chance of them injesting aspen shavings with their meals. However, half of my ball pythons, as well as one of my boa constrictors, are shy feeders, who just seem to eat more reliably if I allow them to eat in their cages. So they get special privileges. I use both tanks and rack tubs for housing. Out of all of my whole collection, I only have one snake that I consider to be aggressive. He is a yearling corn snake, who always eats outside of the cage. He strikes and bites whether food is involved or not.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by wendhend

I consider myself a hobbyist breeder. I do have a business, but it's just for fun. I a have over 60 snakes in my permanent collection. They are mostly corn snakes, but I do have eight ball pythons and a couple of boa constrictors. With that many snakes, the majority of them do not get handled daily, but most of them get handled at least once a week. For the most part, I prefer to feed outside of the cage, because it eliminates any mess that might end up in their cages and any chance of them injesting aspen shavings with their meals. However, half of my ball pythons, as well as one of my boa constrictors, are shy feeders, who just seem to eat more reliably if I allow them to eat in their cages. So they get special privileges. I use both tanks and rack tubs for housing. Out of all of my whole collection, I only have one snake that I consider to be aggressive. He is a yearling corn snake, who always eats outside of the cage. He strikes and bites whether food is involved or not.

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Do you feed F/T, P/K, or Live?
Do you feed Mice/Rats/Other? (if you feed more than one kind of feeder, how many eat mice, how many eat rats, and if you feed another kind, how many eat that.
And what % of your snakes live in tanks and what % live in tubs? (sorry but I'm collecting all sorts of data that "may" influence aggression.)

Thanks for replying!

Anyone else want to fill out the little form? Posting in the poll is great, but I really want all the data I can get for this kind of thing. I can post up the results later. :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jay_Bunny

Do you feed F/T, P/K, or Live?
Do you feed Mice/Rats/Other? (if you feed more than one kind of feeder, how many eat mice, how many eat rats, and if you feed another kind, how many eat that.
And what % of your snakes live in tanks and what % live in tubs? (sorry but I'm collecting all sorts of data that "may" influence aggression.)

Thanks for replying!

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1. I feed exclusively frozen / thawed to the corn snakes and boas. Only a couple of my ball pythons will take frozen / thawed, though, so the others get live for now. I'm trying to convert them.

2. The boas only eat F/T rats. The corns mostly eat F/T mice, except for occasional F/T rat pinkies for the subadults and occasional F/T baby chicks for the large adults. The ball pythons mostly eat rats, but the smaller ones sometimes get live mice. The frozen / thawed feeders get occasional chicks.

3. I have 12 snakes in Reptile Basics racks with tubs, and I hope to obtain more of those soon. The rest are in glass tanks. The one aggressive snake I have lives in a glass tank.

Thank you Wendy for your input on this! :D

I have several ball pythons..I feed all in their cages..very rarely do I have cage aggression if any at all.

Hobbyist or Breeder: Hobbyist
# of Snakes: 18 and more on the way. (not breeding yet)
Frequency of Handling: 3 times per week.
Do You Feed Inside or Outside the enclosure: in cage.
F/T, P/K, Live: Live and F/T
# of Snakes with Cage Aggression: 1 ( but I dont think it has anything to do with feeding in his cage.
Tank/Tub: Rack system.:gj:

My 1 bp gets a live large mouse in her tank weekly. I have had no cage aggresion at all. I switched to a small rat yesterday & after striking at it once & missing she wanted nothing to do with it. I have no place to house the rat so now I will try f/t in a few more days. Be great if she takes it.:D

Hobbyist or Breeder: hobbyist
# Snakes in Collection: 2
How often do you handle your snakes: 1-2 times a week
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?: in cage
# of snakes with cage aggression: 0, zero, none, nada
F/T P/K or Live?: F/T
Tank/Tub: 1 in each

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jay_Bunny

Hobbyist or Breeder:
# Snakes in Collection:
How often do you handle your snakes:
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?:
# of snakes with cage aggression:
F/T P/K or Live?:
Tank/Tub:

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Andrew .. BAM Reptiles
28 ( including 3 emeralds )
every few days give or take
100% fed in cage
0 ( including the emeralds, who i can remove with my bare hands )

cage aggression from in cage feeding a total myth. dont let her get you down, if i understood your post correctly, she works at petsmart or something which makes you a total idiot almost 100% of the time, since im sure she doesnt actually own any snakes

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BAMReptiles

Andrew .. BAM Reptiles
28 ( including 3 emeralds )
every few days give or take
100% fed in cage
0 ( including the emeralds, who i can remove with my bare hands )

cage aggression from in cage feeding a total myth. dont let her get you down, if i understood your post correctly, she works at petsmart or something which makes you a total idiot almost 100% of the time, since im sure she doesnt actually own any snakes

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Do you feed F/T, live, or P/K?
Do you house them in tubs, tanks, or both? (if both, how many live in tanks, how many in tubs?)

Well I'm not a total idiot, hahaha. I work at Petsmart too and not everyone there is an idiot. Some of us really do care about the animals and know a lot. We are just not allowed to apply our knowledge. Petsmarts policies do not allow us to.

I don't have everyone's info in for those classified as Breeders, but I have all of Hobbyists info in. Here are the results for those classified as hobbyists.

Hobbyists: 5

Total # of Snakes: 25
Avg # of Snakes in Collection: 5
Total # of Snakes with Cage Aggression: 1
% of Snakes with Cage Aggression: 4%
% of Live Feeding: 60%
% of Live Fed Snakes: 24%
% of F/T Feeding: 40%
% of F/T Fed Snakes: 76%
% of P/K Feeding: 0%
% of P/K Fed Snakes: 0%
Avg # of days/week, snakes are handled: 2/week
% of Snakes Fed in Cage: 92%
% of Snakes Fed Outside Cage: 8%
% of Snakes Housed in Tanks: 24%
% of Snakes Housed in Tubs: 76%

So far out of 25 snakes, only 4% experience any kind of cage aggression (1 snake) I hope I have all this info right. :) Kind of interesting to read all this.

Hobbyist or Breeder: Hobbyist
# Snakes in Collection: 1
How often do you handle your snakes: once a week
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?: in cage
# of snakes with cage aggression: 0
F/T P/K or Live?: Live mice
Tank/Tub: Boaphile plastic cage

The only time I have thought I might actually get bit was when we first got him and fed in separate tub due to the cage aggression myth, once I found out that was crap we started feeding in tank.

Hobbyist or Breeder:both
# Snakes in Collection:15
How often do you handle your snakes:once or twice a week
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?:inside their tubs
# of snakes with cage aggression:none
F/T P/K or Live?:live
Tank/Tub: tub

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 771subliminal

Hobbyist or Breeder:hobbyist
# Snakes in Collection:1 at this time, but I've kept many as a kid
How often do you handle your snakes:2-3 times a week
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?:outside, but going to switch to inside as I feel it's less stressful
# of snakes with cage aggression:0 and never have had any whether fed in or out of the cage
F/T P/K or Live?:F/T - 2 large mice once a week
Tank/Tub: naturalistic terrarium

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Hobbyist or Breeder: Andrea and Matt, Hobbyists
# Snakes in Collection: Three - 2 boys, 1 girl
How often do you handle your snakes: 30 minutes a day except feeding day and the two following days
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?: Our youngest won't eat in his cage, our other male eats in a feeding box and our female will eat anything anywhere (she is our rescue and was starved before we got her).
# of snakes with cage aggression: NONE!
F/T P/K or Live?: Live rats to all three.
Tank/Tub:[/QUOTE] Our youngest is in a tank, our other male is in a tub, and our female is in the enclosure she came with, which is a homemade tank.

Hobbyist or Breeder: Hobbyist, Future breeder.
# Snakes in Collection: 4
How often do you handle your snakes: 1-3 times a week
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?: Inside
# of snakes with cage aggression: None
F/T P/K or Live?: All live
Tank/Tub: All tubs

Maybe you should tell her that the snakes you guys have at work are simply items to sell, and not pets yet. They're not being handled much, so when they are handled they're a little frightened.

Hobbyist or Breeder:Both kind of. Starting breeding in the fall
# Snakes in Collection:6
How often do you handle your snakes:once a week each
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?:In cage
# of snakes with cage aggression: Zero
F/T P/K or Live?: F/T
Tank/Tub:Tubs for the ball python, boaphile for the boa.

Hobbyist or Breeder: mom
# Snakes in Collection: 20
How often do you handle your snakes: almost daily
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?:In cage
# of snakes with cage aggression: 2 (boas) 1 BP
F/T P/K or Live?: live
Tank/Tub:Tubs

also I checked the wrong box on the poll :(

Hobbyist or Breeder: hobbyist
# Snakes in Collection:4
How often do you handle your snakes: Twice a week.
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?: Inside
# of snakes with cage aggression: 0
F/T P/K or Live?: live
Tank/Tub:tanks

Hobbyist or Breeder: Hobbyist
# Snakes in Collection: 1
How often do you handle your snakes: Every few days.
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?: Outside (I'm a worry wart when it comes to feeding in her cage. ^^;; )
# of snakes with cage aggression: None
F/T P/K or Live?: Live rats
Tank/Tub: Tank

Hobbyist or Breeder: Hobbyist
# Snakes in Collection: 4
How often do you handle your snakes: 2-3times a day
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?: Inside aquarium
# of snakes with cage aggression: None
F/T P/K or Live?: 3 snakes F/T, 1 live small rats
Tank/Tub: Tank

All I can say is, ignorance is bliss. :rolleyes:

Hobbyist or Breeder: Niki (Hobbyist)
# Snakes in Collection: One (for now, muahahah)
How often do you handle your snakes: Every day
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?: Inside, every time
# of snakes with cage aggression: Zero, zilch, nadda!
F/T P/K or Live?: Live
Tank/Tub: Tank, for the time being

:D

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jay_Bunny

Do you feed F/T, live, or P/K?
Do you house them in tubs, tanks, or both? (if both, how many live in tanks, how many in tubs?)

Well I'm not a total idiot, hahaha. I work at Petsmart too and not everyone there is an idiot. Some of us really do care about the animals and know a lot. We are just not allowed to apply our knowledge. Petsmarts policies do not allow us to.

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yea sorry about not finishing, my internets failed out on me , GG terribad charter internet. i have emeralds/borneos in tanks (5 total) and ball pythons in tubs ( 20 total i think ) i feed them all prekilled or f/t depending how lazy i feel or if i have live/frozen sizes i need, they all eat either so i can switch it up. sont really have any that HAVE to have live,

thats messed up that make you give out false information, if i read that correctly. i know that 99% of the people ive delt with at the one here are complete retards lol. ( wasnt saying you were an idiot, in case you didnt get that lol )

Hobbyist or Breeder: hobbyist
# Snakes in Collection:3
How often do you handle your snakes:weekly
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?:inside
# of snakes with cage aggression:0
F/T P/K or Live?:live
Tank/Tub:tub

Hobbyist or Breeder: Hobbyist, hopefully breeder someday.
# Snakes in Collection: 2 for now.
How often do you handle your snakes: Daily/Every other day.
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?:Inside.
# of snakes with cage aggression: Neither have struck at me EVER.
F/T P/K or Live?: Small live rats, they tend to get more scratched when I give them larger meals.
Tank/Tub: Tubs all the way.

Hobbyist or Breeder: Hobbyist

# Snakes in Collection: 1 corn, 13 Ball pythons

How often do you handle your snakes: 1-2 times a week

In cage/Outside of cage to feed?: All but one gets fed in their cage. The one is an assist fed.

# of snakes with cage aggression: NONE

F/T P/K or Live?: The assist fed is p/k ASF hopper the rest is live rats or ASF

Tank/Tub: All are in tubs, when I first started keeping 4 were in tanks and fed the same.

Well, if they alert to the fact that it's feeding day, then they can be 'cage aggressive'--they will come up out of the bin after food as soon as it opens, because the scent is in the air. I don't think that really, counts, though.

I don't have any ball pythons that normally behave that way, and I always feed them in their bin.

I have 41 snakes--40 balls and one Plains garter. (He's not cage aggressive, either).

I don't have any aggressive snakes. I have a few that can be touchy sometimes, but will calm if approached correctly.

Cage aggression is specifically when a snake strikes to FEED whenever its cage is opened. A snake that is simply aggressive all the time isn't 'cage aggressive'. A snake that strikes defensively is not displaying cage aggression.

Hobbyist or Breeder: hobbiest, breeding in the fall if things work out
# Snakes in Collection: 10 (picking up the 10th next month). 2 ball pythons, 2.1 (picking up the other .1 next month) solomon island tree boas, 0.1 Nicaraguan, 0.1 rosy boa, 1.1 central american boas
How often do you handle your snakes: depends on the animals, some don't seem to tolerate handling well so they are handled less often, but usually about 1x a week.
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?: every snake is fed in their tubs
# of snakes with cage aggression: 0
F/T P/K or Live?: F/T
Tank/Tub: tubs in racks.

Hobbyist or Breeder: Future Breeder

# Snakes in Collection:9 breeders, 10 babies

How often do you handle your snakes:2 or 3 times per week

In cage/Outside of cage to feed?:Inside for adults, outside for babies still learning what food is

# of snakes with cage aggression:1 baby

F/T P/K or Live?:Adults get F/T babies are on live for now

Tank/Tub: Tubs for all

Gale

Hobbyist or Breeder: Hobbyist/Breeder

# Snakes in Collection: 28 ball pythons

How often do you handle your snakes: 2 or 3 times per week

In cage/Outside of cage to feed?: Inside for all

# of snakes with cage aggression: none

F/T P/K or Live?:all on F/T except 2 that get live / all on rats

Tank/Tub: Tubs for all

Quote:

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Hobbyist or Breeder:

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Both you can say, haven't produced anything yet;):P

Quote:

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# Snakes in Collection:

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12 (1 is being fostered and is not mine)

Quote:

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How often do you handle your snakes:

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I handle snakes everyday, but not particularly the same ones.

Quote:

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In cage/Outside of cage to feed?:

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All are fed in their tubs

Quote:

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# of snakes with cage aggression:

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Zero. The only aggressive snake I own is one of my Bloods who isn't just cage aggressive but aggressive all around.

Quote:

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F/T P/K or Live?:

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Both (live is fed to the Bloods)

Quote:

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Tank/Tub:

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Tubs

Meant to do "No, I feed in the cage."
Accidentally did Yes, I feed in the cage.

Snakes do not have the brain capacity or capability to make associations of that level unless you never handle the animal and you only feed the snakes, then they will expect you to feed upon opening the cage.

Two factors (handling and feeding) are too complex for them.

Hobbyist or Breeder: Both

# Snakes in Collection: 22

How often do you handle your snakes: couple times a month per snake

In cage/Outside of cage to feed?: inside

# of snakes with cage aggression: 1

F/T P/K or Live?: F/T and occasionally live

Tank/Tub: Tubs

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jay_Bunny

I was at work yesterday and one of my co-workers took the ball pythons out of their cage and took them into the back to feed them. While I was in the back and she was feeding (they actually ate for once, but I might add that later when I looked in the feeding log she had wrote down that she fed one of them 4 pinkies! Ugh!) I just said "Petsmart's way of feeding is so strange to me." She asked me what I meant and I mentioned that I fed in the cage. She then replies, "Oh no, you shouldn't do that. It makes them cage aggressive." I politely told her that no, that is a myth and whether you feed in the cage or outside the cage has no influence on cage aggression. She says, "I have to respectfully disagree." I then told her that I keep ball pythons and that I don't have any snakes that are cage aggressive BECAUSE I feed in the cage. I have one or two that are just cage aggressive anyway (Thriller my pastel, though he is improving a lot, and my corn snake who has been cage aggressive since day 1) She says, "Well then I think you are just lucky then." I told her that many breeders that I have spoken to do not experience cage aggression either even if they feed in the cage.

So I figured I'd take a poll here and see how many people actually experience ANY cage aggression. Please, please, please fill this out the way I write it because I want to compile all the data and possibly print it out to show my co-workers.

Hobbyist or Breeder:
# Snakes in Collection:
How often do you handle your snakes:
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?:
# of snakes with cage aggression:
F/T P/K or Live?:
Tank/Tub:

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i work at petsmart too! LOL

Hobbyist or Breeder: Hobbyist
# Snakes in Collection: 4
How often do you handle your snakes: 3 to 4 times a week
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?: In cage
# of snakes with cage aggression: 0
F/T P/K or Live?: F/T
Tank/Tub: Tubs in a rack

Hobbyist or Breeder: Hobbyist.
# Snakes in Collection: 4
How often do you handle your snakes: 2-3 times a week.
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?: In cage
# of snakes with cage aggression: None
F/T P/K or Live?: One eats live, the others get f/t
Tank/Tub: Rack system

I personally believe that cage feeding being the cause of agression is a myth that just refuses to die. :P

Quote:

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Originally Posted by WingedWolfPsion

Well, if they alert to the fact that it's feeding day, then they can be 'cage aggressive'--they will come up out of the bin after food as soon as it opens, because the scent is in the air. I don't think that really, counts, though.

I don't have any ball pythons that normally behave that way, and I always feed them in their bin.

I have 41 snakes--40 balls and one Plains garter. (He's not cage aggressive, either).

I don't have any aggressive snakes. I have a few that can be touchy sometimes, but will calm if approached correctly.

Cage aggression is specifically when a snake strikes to FEED whenever its cage is opened. A snake that is simply aggressive all the time isn't 'cage aggressive'. A snake that strikes defensively is not displaying cage aggression.

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Agreed..

Hobbyist or Breeder: Hobbyist

# Snakes in Collection: 7 Ball Pythons and 1 Corn Snake

How often do you handle your snakes: 4 to 5 times a week

In cage/Outside of cage to feed?: In

# of snakes with cage aggression: The corn can be aggressive but he has never bitten.

F/T P/K or Live?: The corn and one of the BP's will eat F/T, P/K, or live and the rest of the BP's all eat live.

Tank/Tub: The corn is in a 55 gallon tank and the BP's are in tubs.

Hobbyist or Breeder: Both
# Snakes in Collection: 2 at the moment
How often do you handle your snakes: 1-3 Times a Week
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?: In
# of snakes with cage aggression: 0
F/T P/K or Live?: F/T - Sometimes Live
Tank/Tub: Tub

Hobbyist or Breeder: Hobbyist
# Snakes in Collection: 15
How often do you handle your snakes: some daily, most weekly
In cage/Outside of cage to feed?: In
# of snakes with cage aggression: 1 old female
F/T P/K or Live?: Mix
Tank/Tub: Tub

I've experienced cage aggression from feeding in the cage, but it's animal-dependent and very seasonal. Most of my older animals know the difference between my hand and a dead rodent; and in the winter they can't even be bothered to strike at the rodents. But in the summer, if there's even a hint of rodent in the air, then it's all gaping jaws and flying leaps.

Sounds like you'd have the same problem whether you're reaching in to drop a rat or to pick them up to move them to feed them.