Shipping in the Winter

Hello,

I posted below with the confusion on humidity levels during an URI.

Now I'm curious as to how do you pack a ball python for shipping keeping in mind the outside temps will be between 20 - 30 degrees.

I received two snakes in one of the boxes you can get from LLLreptile (white with red lettering and styrofoam inserts on all sides. The two snakes were in seperate bags, with crumpled newspaper and two handwarmers. My vet said this was not acceptable and they should have had more warmers and been put in a secondary container on the inside of the box with handwarmers in direct contact with the containers. When I opened the box the handwarmers were not in contact with the snakes, but I don't know if this is from shifting during shipping. Snakes arrived ice cold, both have survived so far, one has an URI and the one that I originally wanted and paid for appears to be the wrong gender (will be having it probed on Thursday). I've owned ball pythons for a few years, but am new to breeding/shipping/etc. and any advice is appreciated. I don't want to demand a refund if the seller packed his animals correctly, but it he was negligent at all, or he sexed them wrong I will be contacting him to see if we can resolve this.
Anyone see anything wrong with the packing that I mentioned above?
Thank in advance,
Nicole

I personally don't ship when the temps get below freezing it is just far to much risk to the animal. How ever when I do ship regardless of cooler or warmer weather, the box is insulated and there is some form of shipping substrate to reduce the amount of air that the warmers or cool packs have to effect.

Hope that helps

I don't ship below about 30 degrees. I always use a 3/4" thick styro box with one 40hr heat pack taped to the lid and not touching the snake. I actually ususally try to put the heat pack in the opposite corner from where the snake is. Depending on the temps I poke anywhere from 1-4 holes with a screwdriver in the box. I have never had any problems.

Are you sure they were hand warmers and not the proper heat packs? They don't really look all that different. Were the heat packs still warm when you opened the box? I would ask your vet how many snakes he has ever shipped. I would never put a heat pack in direct contact with the deli cup a snake was in.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by nbelval

...with handwarmers in direct contact with the containers.

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Putting a heat pack in direct contact with a container can do as much or more harm to the snake as the cold can. Heat packs get very hot (upwards of 140 F).

Here is a link to a post I made when we were running as J&J Reptiles when in Maine.
Now that I am working for Outback Reptiles the temps are not as extreme her in Va, but the packaging still stays the same.

Hope this helps.

http://www.ball-pythons.net/forums/s...ad.php?t=80547

Thanks everyone. My only thing now is, are the two hand warmers sufficient in these temps and for the duration of the trip? Wondering if the 40 hour ones should have been used instead.

Its better for the snake too be cold then burn up and die. The way you are describing the snakes were shipped seems fine to me. Like Colin said the heat packs get up to 140 degrees, if that was directly under the snake it would burn the snake. We ship our animals in the same box that most people use(red and white boxes) that have 3/4 in. foam. We tape the heat pack to the top of the foam, And fill the box with shredded paper. Never had a problem doing it that way. Hope this helps.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by nbelval

Thanks everyone. My only thing now is, are the two hand warmers sufficient in these temps and for the duration of the trip? Wondering if the 40 hour ones should have been used instead.

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They should have used the 40+ hour heat packs. Were the hand warmers still warm when it got there?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by nbelval

Hello,

I posted below with the confusion on humidity levels during an URI.

Now I'm curious as to how do you pack a ball python for shipping keeping in mind the outside temps will be between 20 - 30 degrees.

I received two snakes in one of the boxes you can get from LLLreptile (white with red lettering and styrofoam inserts on all sides. The two snakes were in seperate bags, with crumpled newspaper and two handwarmers. My vet said this was not acceptable and they should have had more warmers and been put in a secondary container on the inside of the box with handwarmers in direct contact with the containers. When I opened the box the handwarmers were not in contact with the snakes, but I don't know if this is from shifting during shipping. Snakes arrived ice cold, both have survived so far, one has an URI and the one that I originally wanted and paid for appears to be the wrong gender (will be having it probed on Thursday). I've owned ball pythons for a few years, but am new to breeding/shipping/etc. and any advice is appreciated. I don't want to demand a refund if the seller packed his animals correctly, but it he was negligent at all, or he sexed them wrong I will be contacting him to see if we can resolve this.
Anyone see anything wrong with the packing that I mentioned above?
Thank in advance,
Nicole

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It sounds like your biggest problem would be one of them having a RI. I don't think it is possible for a snake to get an RI overnight. That snake was most likely sick when it was shipped to you. If you don't mind, who did you get them from? PM me if you don't want it publicly known. Did you contact the seller as soon as the animals showed up to your house about the conditions and RI?

I received the animals on the 31st. This is the condition I received them in...
http://picasaweb.google.com/PricklyP...K2ppZXtlsTLaA#
I thought they were dead. I noticed the males belly contract slightly while taking photos as proof that they arrived deceased, so I then warmed them up as quickly as possible. The signs of RI didn't start until the 9th. I kept their tanks at 95 in the hot end and 80 at the cool realizing that an RI may set in. The smaller female has so far been fine.
So I believe the RI set in here under my care. I do feel it wouldn't have happened though had they not been half frozen when they arrived. My vet wholeheartedly agrees and also feels they should not have been shipped at a temp below 40 degrees.
Lesson learned on my part and I will never have animals shipped to me below these temps again, but I do feel it is the shippers responsibility to ensure the safety and welfare of their animals.
I would like to wait until I go back in to the vet on thursday and find out for sure the gender of the animal (as that is now in question), and then offer the seller the chance to rectify the situation before I slander them in anyway.
I'm basically trying to collect any evidence of wrong doing on their part by a group of peers.
Oh, and yes I contacted the seller as soon as they arrived and reported the condition and I also contacted about the RI and the fact that I'd be bringing him to the vet. He asked me to keep him updated. I have not yet contacted him about the visit, since I wanted to get the fecal results and the gender double checked prior to contact. If you think I should make him aware of the RI (it was pretty obvious and he even said it sounded like an RI), as diagnosed by the vet now I will. Just thought I should have all my info straight before presenting anything to him.
If he's done nothing wrong then I don't want to berate him either. But I'm getting the impression that at the very least the heat packs were inadequate.
They too (the heat packs) were cold upon receiving the animals. After I had noticed the animals were alive I scanned one with my temp gun and the temp was 52 degrees, this was after about 10 minutes after arrival. And they had been sitting on heat pads in their tanks while I took the photos.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by nbelval

I received the animals on the 31st. This is the condition I received them in...
http://picasaweb.google.com/PricklyP...K2ppZXtlsTLaA#
I thought they were dead. I noticed the males belly contract slightly while taking photos as proof that they arrived deceased, so I then warmed them up as quickly as possible. The signs of RI didn't start until the 9th. I kept their tanks at 95 in the hot end and 80 at the cool realizing that an RI may set in. The smaller female has so far been fine.
So I believe the RI set in here under my care. I do feel it wouldn't have happened though had they not been half frozen when they arrived. My vet wholeheartedly agrees and also feels they should not have been shipped at a temp below 40 degrees.
Lesson learned on my part and I will never have animals shipped to me below these temps again, but I do feel it is the shippers responsibility to ensure the safety and welfare of their animals.
I would like to wait until I go back in to the vet on thursday and find out for sure the gender of the animal (as that is now in question), and then offer the seller the chance to rectify the situation before I slander them in anyway.
I'm basically trying to collect any evidence of wrong doing on their part by a group of peers.
Oh, and yes I contacted the seller as soon as they arrived and reported the condition and I also contacted about the RI and the fact that I'd be bringing him to the vet. He asked me to keep him updated. I have not yet contacted him about the visit, since I wanted to get the fecal results and the gender double checked prior to contact. If you think I should make him aware of the RI (it was pretty obvious and he even said it sounded like an RI), as diagnosed by the vet now I will. Just thought I should have all my info straight before presenting anything to him.
If he's done nothing wrong then I don't want to berate him either. But I'm getting the impression that at the very least the heat packs were inadequate.
They too (the heat packs) were cold upon receiving the animals. After I had noticed the animals were alive I scanned one with my temp gun and the temp was 52 degrees, this was after about 10 minutes after arrival. And they had been sitting on heat pads in their tanks while I took the photos.

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Wow they didnt look to good glad they are doing better now. It looks like the seller didnt put the right heat packs in and they just got way to cold. It wouldnt have been a problem if they had put the right heat packs in. We have shipped in 25 degree weather and they arrived warm, but that was with good heat packs.

Thanks. That's kind of what I was looking for. Like I said I'm new at all this, and didn't want to go in to discuss the situation without me knowing what should have been done differently. If anyone else can confirm this or has any suggestions please let me know. I'm just getting started with ball pythons and I really don't want to burn bridges with people right off the bat!

Thanks,
Nicole

Did the shipper use hand-warmers or heat packs? I ask because hand-warmers only last a short amount of time, while heat packs last anywhere from 30 to 60 hours. The shipper also has to be careful not to tape the wrong side of the heat pack, since it is air activated. Another issue could have been the insulation. If it had cracks or pieces missing, cold air would have entered.

They were the small hand warmers. They were not taped, loose in with the newspaper.
The box looked a bit dirty, like it had been used a time or two, but I didn't notice and missing pieces or cracks in the insulation.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by nbelval

They were the small hand warmers. They were not taped, loose in with the newspaper.
The box looked a bit dirty, like it had been used a time or two, but I didn't notice and missing pieces or cracks in the insulation.

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If they were hand-warmers, then they wouldn't have kept the snakes warm enough for long. The shipper should have used heat packs taped to the top of the insulation. I have shipped, and received, many shipments successfully in winter. If you use good boxes with 3/4" insulation and proper heat packs, you should not have any problems.

i would contact the shipper immediately. it's not right that you have a vet bill, and a sick snake due to poor shipping. That is jacked up, they looked dead in those pics, i would be plenty upset with the guy you bought them from

sucks man, i recently bought a bumblebee male and he arrived the same way... now im trying to bring him back, i did keep in contact with breeder and so far he's been cool, im giving the snake till friday and if it still acting weird im gonna return it,, my snake arrived almost frozen with one heatpack, after he warmed up he was acting as if he had ibd, scary,,,, im waiting a couple days and im gonna open his tub and check....REALLY SUCKS sorry to hear you went through the same thing......ARRGGGGG

Every breeder is different but many will not ship below 30/40 degrees. If they do, the box and materials must be extra perfect in every way. Especially the heat packs. I personally would never ship below 35/40 degrees.

As for the OP and this last post before me saying they warmed up the snakes as fast as possible, this is not always the right thing to do with reptiles. Read this report by Dave Barker of VPI.. If the link doesn't work here is a quote from the report. A snake showing signs of IBD after fast warming up would be a normal reaction. They do not always come back from this but if this is what is wrong, it was preventable..

"As temperatures drop, snakes become less active. At temperatures
of 13EC (55EF), most snakes move about slowly, flick
their tongues out in slow motion, and will drink water. As
temperatures drop further, most snakes become torpid and are
unable to move or to react to stimuli.

As temperatures decrease below the point of torpor, there is
an increasing chance that when warmed up the snake will suffer
cold shock syndrome [CSS]. However, rarely are snakes killed
outright when chilled to core-body temperatures of 4–7EC
(40–45EF) for only a few hours; if the duration has been short,
most will warm up with few, if any ill effects; however, after
even a quick chill, some snakes may suffer CSS or other problems
upon warming up. At temperatures below 10EC (50EF),
pythons suffer an increasing chance of dying as the duration of
exposure to cold temperature increases.

When warmed to temperatures where activity is possible,
snakes suffering CSS will not be able to move in a coordinated
manner. They may exhibit what appear to be violent seizures if
disturbed or handled. Snakes with this condition may die within
48 hours of being warmed; if they survive past that period of
time, they likely will recover, but full recovery to normal coordinated
movement can take more than a year."

http://www.vpi.com/sites/vpi.com/fil...fCold_BCHS.pdf

I would never have someone ship a snake if it was below 40 degree's. Those poor babies. Yes, I would definitely have the shipper do something about this. They do look dead. This is just totally uncalled for.

Thanks for the info. My snakes are acting normally after being warmed up just the one had the URI (for now). It took a good half hour though to warm them up though. So, if you do get snakes half frozen, what should you do?

The seller knows I'm taking him to the vet, and I will be in touch with him tomorrow afternoon once I know the gender 100% on this animal as it looking like that may have been misrepresented as well. I realize mistakes can be made, but I bought this MALE specifically to breed this season with my female. Now with the URI, that may not be possible and it surely won't be possible if he is a SHE! LOL. It's not really funny, but its been a lot of drama from the start just in getting these snakes, so it figures!

Sorry to oceancube that you are having troubles with your bumblebee. :(

Quote:

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Originally Posted by oceancube

sucks man, i recently bought a bumblebee male and he arrived the same way... now im trying to bring him back, i did keep in contact with breeder and so far he's been cool, im giving the snake till friday and if it still acting weird im gonna return it,, my snake arrived almost frozen with one heatpack, after he warmed up he was acting as if he had ibd, scary,,,, im waiting a couple days and im gonna open his tub and check....REALLY SUCKS sorry to hear you went through the same thing......ARRGGGGG

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Sounds like the stress of shipping and the cold has set off his wobble.. I've seen it happen..shipping or transporting them can from time to time trigger them to wobble even if they haven't before..the breeder might not have known or even thought to tell you so you'd know if it happens.

I am supposed to be shipping an animal but the temps have been in the teens overnight and there have been ice storms and snow along the route the package would travel so I am really hesitant about shipping right now.
I don't want to jeopardize the snakes welfare.
It's just too cold lately and the windchill makes it even worse.

I have 2 snakes I paid for but are being held for shipping until the weather breaks. One of the snakes was something I had been looking for but of the 4 I looked at, only one seller was willing to hold it for a later ship date. To me, that is a responsible breeder and is part of the reason I went with his snake and not one the others. If a breeder either will not honor your request to hold the animal (with payment of course) for shipping OR will not give you an extended health guarantee (maybe a week due to the cold) then I would not purchase from them.

As a breeder, if you are concerned in any way about the weather then follow your instinct and tell the buyer you can not ship until the weather gets a little better.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SPJ

I am supposed to be shipping an animal but the temps have been in the teens overnight and there have been ice storms and snow along the route the package would travel so I am really hesitant about shipping right now.
I don't want to jeopardize the snakes welfare.
It's just too cold lately and the windchill makes it even worse.

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And anyone that wants you to ship an animal despite the weather is a fool and a jerk. I would never knowingly place an animal in harms way for a buck and I'm glad your not either.
On the other side, if you have completely paid off an animal and the shipper/ breeder refuses to hold an animal for a reasonable period of time, until the weather breaks, I would ask for my money back and never look back. That person obviously does not care about the animal. If he doesn't care about the animal during the shipping process then it puts into question how well he cared for the animal up to that point. You should always know what the breeder will or won't do prior to paying them.

You would be surprised how many people want snakes shipped right away even when the temps are in the single digits.
I have no problem holding and caring for an animal until the weather is nicer (I prefer to do that) but some people want it immediately after paying for it.
In those cases, you just refund the money.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by singingtothewheat

And anyone that wants you to ship an animal despite the weather is a fool and a jerk.

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That might be a tad harsh...I just got a couple of tics and burms from some of the most respected breeders in the country and they shipped the snakes to me in the frozen wasteland of Illinois...They were packed like everyone mentioned with an extra 40 hour heat pack...They all arrived in perfect condition...

For my situation, the weather is probably the least of the snakes worries...Our UPS carriers are down-right abusive with packages :mad::mad: Needless to say, I trusted the breeders experience and got my snakes fine...If I didn't know the breeder or they were new to breeding and shipping I wouldn't have done this transaction, but they've been in the business way to long to question their experience and judgment...Just had my burmy out and he's happy all nice and warm..

If I had known then what I know now, I never would have had them shipped. I would have driven the 5 hours and picked up or found a closer source. I was in need of a male ready to breed and foolishly assumed the breeder would know what was safe and what wasn't (I have kept snakes for years, but this would be my first clutch - which is now not happening - so even more dissapointment). It breaks my heart to think what those snakes went through because I didn't know enough to have him hold the snakes or to check into these forums prior to purchasing. A friend recommended that I come on here and one other forum after the fact to get more info. I have been on this forum for awhile, but didn't even think to check first. Look before you leap I guess! My lesson has certainly been learned. :(
As a side note: on the other forum they have a Board of Inquiry and the seller has a "questionable" history. Again, wish I knew then what I know now!
Oh, and hats off to you breeders that choose to hold your animals until better weather.
I used to raise hedgehogs and wouldn't ship (airlines only), if it was going to be below 40. Why did I think it would be okay for herps? Blond moment? So angry with myself for the whole situation.

Update...
He is definately a She. I bought this snake to breed THIS season. A MALE, get him half frozen, gets the URI, has internal parasites, and NOW it a FEMALE!!!!!! SO unbelievably angry right now. I contacted the seller, but surprise, surprise no response. He was so quick when it came to taking my money...I'll give him a couple days I guess to reply.
So frustrated. Oh, and the Vet charged $20 to double check the sex for me. Seriously? $20 to probe a snake? Okay, I'm done for the moment. Anyone have suggestions how to deal with this?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by nbelval

Update...
He is definately a She. I bought this snake to breed THIS season. A MALE, get him half frozen, gets the URI, has internal parasites, and NOW it a FEMALE!!!!!! SO unbelievably angry right now. I contacted the seller, but surprise, surprise no response. He was so quick when it came to taking my money...I'll give him a couple days I guess to reply.
So frustrated. Oh, and the Vet charged $20 to double check the sex for me. Seriously? $20 to probe a snake? Okay, I'm done for the moment. Anyone have suggestions how to deal with this?

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Give the seller a couple days to respond. If the seller does respond give a chance, if they are willing, to make it right. If the seller does nothing at all go to the BOI forum on faunaclassifieds.com to report that seller as a bad guy and explain your experience. Make sure when you do that you have given the seller ample time to respond and fix the problem in case it is just a mistake.

The BOI is where you can look up a potential seller to see if they are a good or bad guy. Actually I would go there right now and enter the name in the search box to see if there are any other shotty deals reported with this person.

Just make sure you follow the rules regarding the BOI and posting there. Keep us updated.

There is also a buyer/seller references thread here you can search on this site but it is not used nearly as often as the BOI.

Keep all your vet bills and paperwork. Any emails between you and the seller. All details including TOS, shipping, tracking etc.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SPJ

You would be surprised how many people want snakes shipped right away even when the temps are in the single digits.
I have no problem holding and caring for an animal until the weather is nicer (I prefer to do that) but some people want it immediately after paying for it.
In those cases, you just refund the money.

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Oh I'm sure. It amazes me that people will put the animals and, if nothing else, their investment in harms way to get something fast.

I personally always ask about things like shipping if weather is bad but if that was forgotten until the money changed hands and the person didn't want to wait to ship I would still consider them a fool and a jerk. They would never see money from me again.

I looked into the BOI on fauna a few days ago. He has a less than stellar reference. So I'm not totally encouraged. I will give a few days and then alert him to the fact that I will be posting a complaint on the fauna BOI.
I'm really hoping since the complaints were a few years back that he has changed his ways and will come through. Thanks for the advice, I really appreciate it.
Really wish I had known about the BOI prior to making this purchase though!
An expensive lesson learned, and one that my husband isn't letting me forget! :)

I know that I am straying a bit off topic in regards to the original posters thread, but after reading all of the responses in this thread, I wanted to interject a bit of our experience with shipping.

I know that everyone has their own comfort level when it comes to shipping animals, and what the low and high temps are their min. / max. With that said, we will typically ship an animal so long as it is not below 26 degrees anywhere in the transporatation. We have done this successfully many times. So long as you pack your boxes well, they can easily and safely make the trip. With that said, here are a few things that I think the less experienced shipper should take into consideration.

First of all, for the longest time, we shipped animals in 1/2" insulation boxes. Obviously, everyone wants to save money where they can. After 2 years of doing this without a problem, we switched to the 3/4" insulated boxes, just as added insurance, and also because we got more confident in our abilities to ship, and was starting to ship in warmer and colder weather than before. However, I would suggest that anyone starting out use the 3/4" insulated boxes, as they maintain temps much better.

Next up is air holes. The only bad thing about air holes, is that you probably paid about $3- $4 dollars for your packaging, with the intent of insulating your snake, and then you put a hole in it. This allows the exchange of unwanted cold or warm air. Our opinion is to avoid them if possible. Your box will get some air from the untaped seams around box We rarely ever put airholes in our boxes, but occasionally it is necessary. We have shipped on numerous occassions with a heat pack in the box (12x9x6 which is a relatively small box) and did not put holes in the box. The snake and the heat pack both got the required air during transportation. I think one of the biggest deciding factors in the decision to put holes or not is wether the temps are cooler at the destination or the origination point, and also what the hub temperture is. The other factor in this decision is the heat pack you are using (they range from 20 hour to 60 hour packs), and each of those packs peak at a different temperature (higher temps the larger pack you use) and peak times that are later depending on the size of the pack. The tables for these packs can be found on Superior Enterprises website or wherever you oredr your heat packs from.

Another thing to take into consideration is the size of the box. A larger box (while it costs more to ship), will hold it's internal temperature better, because it is harder to change the temperature of a large volume of air than a smaller volue. Also, depending on the temp, more than one heat pack may be used. While I have never done it, I have
heard of breeders using 2 different sized heat packs before, such as a 30 hr and a 40 hr. The theory here is that the 30 hr will peak early, and the 40 hr. will peak later, thus giving an overall warmer temp for a longer period of time. The placement of the heat pack is just as important. If we are shipping one snake, we generally put the heat pack on one side, and lay the snake bag in the box in such a manner that the snake can move in the bag closer or further away from the heat if desired. In the situation of more than 2 snakes in a box, we typically put the heat pack on the lid, so that all of the snakes have some exposure to the heat.

One last consideration is the container the reptile is packaged in. Snake bags breath better, but don't have the insulation factor of plastic, like a deli cup. Be careful with deli cups and heat packs though, as they seam to trap the heat, and you could end up overheating an animal in a deli cup. We have switched over to cloth bags only for ball python shipping. We do ship corn snakes and baby kenyan sand boas in deli cups, as keeping them in a snake bag is very difficult.

The last comment I would like to make is that a great way to gain shipping experience without actually shipping, is to pack a box like you are shipping, and leave it outside with an in/out thermometer in different weather conditions. This allows you to see how good or bad your packaging is without risking an animal or a customers positive experience.

The last note I can add, is that we write down the forecasted temps during transportation (gathered from a weather website) and the amount of heat or cool packs used as well as the number of holes placed in the box. This allows us to go back (after enough data has been collected), and see how we have successfully shipped in the past. If you have a very helpful customer, ask them if they can measure the temps of the box and snake when they receive it, as this will give you invaluable feedback on future shipments.

We just shipped a Spotnose female to a customer in Illinois this week. The temps at home were about 40 - 32 degrees, with temps in Memphis (we ude FedEx) were going to be in the mid thirties while the box layed over, and they were 38 - 28 in Illinois. We packed in a 12x9x6 box with 3/4 insulation and 2 40hr. heat packs taped to the lid on one side, and one very small hole in the side of the box opposite of the heat packs. I had never used 2 heat packs in this small of a box, but had a friend that shipped to Colorado the day before with one heat pack, and his snake arrived at 63 degrees. I asked my customer to check temps if he could when his snake arrived, and the box was 88 degrees, and the snake was 82 - 85 degrees. This info proved very helpful to me, as I was going to be shipping to another customer next week in Colorado where I was going to be experiencing very similar temps.

All in all, just try to think about exactlly what the temps will be at each stage of the journey, and think about how best to combat each step, and you will safely ship every time.

I hope this can help someone,

Wish my seller had read and followed this sort of advice...Thanks for the post, it will be helpful to me int he future and I'm sure it will benefit many others! :)

So I got a reply from my seller...

"Hi Nicole, I used 40 hour heat packs in the box that I sent to you not hand warmers. look in the box and you will find the heat pack wrappers.

I will exchange the BP if indeed it was missexed. if you deciede to keep it after you are finished treating it we can work something out. internal parasites can be introduced to a Bp many ways including feeding rodents.fecal exams are a regular precaution when keeping and recieving new snakes. keep me posted"

So my questions now are...
Do the 40 hour heat packs come in the same size as the handwarmer kind? Like 2" x 3"? I thought they were the larger 3" x 5" or so? I have some of both and the kind that was in the box looked like the handwarmers. Of course now I can't prove it since I didn't feel the need at the time to retain the wrappers on the handwarmers.

And as for his parasite explanation. If fecals should be a regular precaution, then why didn't HE catch it at HIS facility? If this were the only problem with the snake I wouldn't even have brought it to his attention. It's just another issue to be dealt with.

So aggravated! :taz:

Just wanted to post that after a bit of back and forth, the seller has made more than good on this problem. He has a very satisfied customer now. ;)