Pros and Cons - Butter vs Lesser

Pretty much, I want to know, for the future, what's the BEST investment and which morph would give you the most possibilities.

I've heard almost endless combos with Lessers, but not so much with Butters. Ultimately, I want to produce BELs, and both can produce as such by pairing with a Mojave.

Opinions? BOTH look awesome to me, different in their own way, yet very alike. I just would like to hear some opinions, combos-wise. Thanks so much! :gj:

Most people believe they are just different lines of the same morph. I personally would go with a lesser, but that is just me.

I'm a lesser man...

My brother (het.pied) on the other hand is a Butter guy.

I like lessers for their color. I like the lighter coloring as opposed to the brighter yellow of butters. but that's just me.:D

I love lessers

As for possibilities: they are both simple codominant (incomplete dominant, actually) traits that will be passed on to 50% of all offspring (assuming the heterozygous form). The visual difference between them is small in some cases and huge in others, so really go with what you like between the two.

As for investment potential: I feel that in the future butters will be more expensive than lessers since it seems like everybody is breeding lessers, while less people are breeding butters, however any difference (if there even will be one) will probably be light as they are both fairly common at this point and their prices seem to be linked (as they generally are the same price from what I have seen).

Really, though, the only thing I would suggest avoiding with them is breeding them together, it can and most likely has been done, but unless you have a keen eye or your babies all look extremely different there could be an issue of identifying them as either.

I like both, all I can say is the butter has a buttery smooth look to them and lessers have a little more contrast to them but still have the smooth look to them.

I don't think there's any difference...like none at all. They're compatible, both make a very white BEL.

I think a lot of the variation you see has to do with the genes of the normal parent. I have both and have no reason to choose. lol

But...if I were leaning one way or the other, I think the butter would get the nod. They just seem to be a little lighter in the dark part of the pattern...but again, that could just be the normal genes in that particular bloodline.

All of the combos will be the same...no difference whatsoever.

See if you can tell which is which in this picture and then decide what you like better before you scroll down...

http://www.acreptiles.com/main/image...rkaybutter.jpg

They're both butters...from the same clutch. :P

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bad-one

Most people believe they are just different lines of the same morph. I personally would go with a lesser, but that is just me.

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yep different lines, until proven otherwise they are the same morph

just like a lemon and bell pastel, different line same morph, good and bad examples of each, ect...

it seems im repeating myself every week, should be a sticky that just titled "Their the same damn thing"

I have both also and plan on making combo's this year with both to see if they differ at all when put side by side.

Here is a Butter Spider I produced this year. I plan on making some Lesser Spiders along with some more Butter Spiders this coming season.
http://i370.photobucket.com/albums/o...e/IMG_1752.jpg
http://i370.photobucket.com/albums/o...e/IMG_1760.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Moofins07

Pretty much, I want to know, for the future, what's the BEST investment and which morph would give you the most possibilities.
I've heard almost endless combos with Lessers, but not so much with Butters. Ultimately, I want to produce BELs, and both can produce as such by pairing with a Mojave.

Opinions? BOTH look awesome to me, different in their own way, yet very alike. I just would like to hear some opinions, combos-wise. Thanks so much! :gj:

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They're going to give you the same combination possibilities. Any combo you make with a lesser you can make with a butter.

Here's my lesser, who's just as light as Anthony's butters. I also agree that most of the looks come from selectively choosing the normal that is paired with the lesser:

http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/h...9/DSC_0176.jpg

http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/h...9/DSC_0177.jpg

personally, when im looking to purchase an animal i go for the specific animal and not necessarily the morph name/label. I bought my pastel because his yellows were NEON. he's browned out a little but hes still a stunning animal. When i got my cinnamon, i actually went to the show looking to pick up an enchi, and was absolutely blown away by the cinny and picked him up. I wasn't looking for a male cinny but i'll get him a girlfriend later.

Having no opinion entering the thread and reading what more experienced people have said, I would go with a lesser. You're asking from an investment stand point and the lessers do the same things as butters for less. Lessers are generally from ~$275-$350 and butters are ~$350-$450, from websites like kingsnake and faunaclassifieds. Also the lesser seems to be more common where as a butter just seems like an advertising gimmick to sell the same snakes for more.

I started out as a lesser person... But the butters have grown on me, I personally choose butters because they are less common. Same morph or not there does seem to be a color difference to me good and bad examples do exist of both. There are many ways to make blue eyed lucys any combo of russo, mojave, lesser, butter, and I have heard the opinion that mystic is another blue eyed lucy morph that makes a dirtier version... like super mojave just with some color difference. Dont know if there is any truth to it or not. But back to my ansewer to the original question. I choose butter

The snakes called Butters are descended from a wild caught animal that the Bells proved out. The snakes called Lessers are descended from a line started by Ralph Davis with a totally different WC animal. That's all the difference is.


Here's a cool pair of Lessers I picked up this year. There was a normal in the clutch that also had the same pattern...as well as several clutchmates that didn't have it. They came from Ben Siegel's Lesser x YB clutch if I remember right.

Female
http://www.acreptiles.com/main/image...sserfemale.jpg

Male
http://www.acreptiles.com/main/image...lessermale.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jjmitchell

I have heard the opinion that mystic is another blue eyed lucy morph that makes a dirtier version... like super mojave just with some color difference. Dont know if there is any truth to it or not.

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What you heard is correct. Mystics, Phantoms, Mojaves, Butters, Lessers and "Specials" are all variations of the same genetic mutation on the same allele.

These snakes vary from very light (butter) to very dark (mystic/phantom). The lightest ones make pure white leucies, the mojaves are in the middle and make a leucistic with a greyish purple head, and the mystic/phantoms produce a fairly dark purple snake. You can cross any of these snakes together and produce some variation of a "leucistic" as well.

Once you look at them that way, it's a pretty neat "family" of morphs and they can all be combined to make different types of leucistic.

I just realized after typing that...the "Blue Eyed Leucistic" project might not be as dead end as I thought.

I spent months trying to figure out which to purchase. I specifically worried about the 'browning out' that I've seen in some lessers which prompted me to look into butters. The butters generally have a lighter and creamier coloring, hence the name. I figured that would be a better fit for what I was looking for...

Not to mention, they seem to beess available. And like others have stated, that translates to holding their value better than something that is very readily available.