Do all Black-Eyed Lucy's have some yellow spotting?

Does anyone know?

All of the Black Eyed Leucistics I've seen have yellow spotting on them.

They're probably all medium or low quality. The best BELs are pure white. Mind that they are often holdbacks or will be sold for high prices.

If you want to see what the spots can do when pushed to the extreme check out the Super Sulfur thread.

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Originally Posted by Oxylepy

The best BELs are pure white.

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Of course you know this is an opinion :P
I personally like the spotted/colored ones better, but that too is an opinion :D

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Originally Posted by snakesRkewl

Of course you know this is an opinion :P
I personally like the spotted/colored ones better, but that too is an opinion :D

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Well okay, the ones that go for the most money and are generally the most desirable tend to be the pure white ones :P

Personally I'm hoping my fire produces pure whites, but at the same time I would LOVE an extremely blotched BEL like the one super sulfur

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Originally Posted by Oxylepy

Well okay, the ones that go for the most money and are generally the most desirable tend to be the pure white ones :P

Personally I'm hoping my fire produces pure whites, but at the same time I would LOVE an extremely blotched BEL like the one super sulfur

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Agreed, I am loving my new fire male and hope to make pure whites and blotched, because they both have their own beauty for sure.

How do you produce all-white Black-Eyed Lucy's then?

All the black eyed Lucy's I have seen have varying amounts of yellow on them. I have seen some pure white blue eyed Lucy's though.

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Originally Posted by Codejunky

How do you produce all-white Black-Eyed Lucy's then?

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Luck of the draw and/or great genetics.

Sulfurs tend to make more defined patches, while Fires tend to have the best chance of getting pure whites. I suppose if people took a few pure whites and kept breeding them, ultimately they could make a pure white genetic line, but the number of generations you would go through would be staggering.

this one looks pure:

http://www.constrictors.com/images/B...c/Lucy0930.jpg

Have to see it in person to be sure, though

Most of the Black Eyed Leucistics I've seen do have some yellow spotting. It's rare to have one that is completely white but they are out there.

Think of them kind of like a yellow and white piebald. NO white pieds are extremely rare, but then again extreme white pieds are also extremely rare. Most of them fall somewhere in the middle. Yellow spotting on the Black Eyed Leucistics is kind of the same way.

Personally I think that if you want a pure white snake with the least amount of color I would go with a Blue Eyed Leucistic. Personally I prefer MORE yellow spotting on the Black Eyed Leucistics as I think that is what makes them unique as a morph.

Hi,

There was someone posting on one of the british forums who produces a high percentage of pure white Black ELs who said he had achieved it through selective breeding.

I will try and find the links tomorrow - it stuck in my mind as there was a heated exchange about it.


dr del

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Originally Posted by jason79

All the black eyed Lucy's I have seen have varying amounts of yellow on them. I have seen some pure white blue eyed Lucy's though.

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Which?

Anyway this is my male - the first one on here, I also have one male who is spotless, although the female has two minute yellow spots. All in the quality of fire!

http://www.captivebredreptileforums....leucistic.html

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Originally Posted by Oxylepy

Luck of the draw and/or great genetics.

Sulfurs tend to make more defined patches, while Fires tend to have the best chance of getting pure whites.

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Well considering there's only been 4 Super sulfurs and 2 of those are also super mojaves, I don't know how you came to that conclusion. Dave's is definitely extreme but there's more then a couple super fires like that as well. The only other regular super sulfur was low yellow having 3 small blotches. Who knows they may end up throwing higher colored supers but to say that based on the appearance of one snake is a little premature. Truthfully I hope you're right as I like variety.

Eric

I remember hearing that a few months back, so it could be wrong. I remember someone saying that they were hoping that they would all end up with the patching because its cool. I cant wait to see them bred more to hopefully be like that one, which is amazing.

the blotching is random in black eyed lucys blue eyes are a totally different morph.BHB has a big female for sale that is almost all white super fire on fuana.

If you really do not know something, or think you heard it from someone, why post it as fact? Like Eric said, there have only been a handful of Super Sulfurs produced, and I think all or most have come from breedings where they could be crosses of some sort. So, to say anything for sure, having to do with Super Sulfurs, you would have to have at least ten of them hanging around to compare with the 10 Super Fires you would have to have to make any kind of comparison that would be relevant???? As it stands, I think Eric and I are the only ones to have produced Super Sulfurs, I have only produced one, and I am sure you have seen it. Based on that one snake, you do not see me saying ALL Super Sulfurs are going to look as cool, do you? Why not? I could sell alot of Sulfurs by doing that. Because there just are not enough Super Sulfurs around, to come up with any kind of conclusions.

Dave

this is the fire bel that BHB has up
http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/foru...d.php?t=156665

OP here.

I have another question. Do all Black-Eyed Lucy's have red pupils?


I've seen a lot of pictures of BELs with black eyes, but no red pupils.

Is that just because of the lighting/angle of the camera? Or do some BEL's have dark pupils?

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Originally Posted by Codejunky

OP here.

I have another question. Do all Black-Eyed Lucy's have red pupils?


I've seen a lot of pictures of BELs with black eyes, but no red pupils.

Is that just because of the lighting/angle of the camera? Or do some BEL's have dark pupils?

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ive only seen one in person yes blood red pupils very cool!

Why would a Black Eyed Lucy with yellow splotching be imperfect and/or less desirable, on the contrary, the yellow splotching is quite appealing in my eyes, after all, we have all the other perfect white snakes to view as pure whites!

The random yellow patches really does give them caracter, the high yellow specimen Dave produced is awesome!

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Originally Posted by RegiusCo

Why would a Black Eyed Lucy with yellow splotching be imperfect and/or less desirable, on the contrary, the yellow splotching is quite appealing in my eyes, after all, we have all the other perfect white snakes to view as pure whites!

The random yellow patches really does give them caracter, the high yellow specimen Dave produced is awesome!

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usually rarity is whats desiable. pure whites are alot rarer than yellow splotches. everyone going to have their own opinion but most of the time popular opinion is rare will be the most desirable.

True. Well, a super sulfur with rich yellow spotting is just as rare an all-white Super Fire (when compared to a BEL with a few yellow spots).


I really want to breed an all-white BEL, so that's why I want to know how to produce snakes with minimum or no yellow spotting.

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Originally Posted by Codejunky

Does anyone know?

All of the Black Eyed Leucistics I've seen have yellow spotting on them.

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Big Gunns has seen many. Most will have some spotting on them, some a lot more than others. You can find "perfect" ones though.

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Originally Posted by Codejunky

True. Well, a super sulfur with rich yellow spotting is just as rare an all-white Super Fire (when compared to a BEL with a few yellow spots).


I really want to breed an all-white BEL, so that's why I want to know how to produce snakes with minimum or no yellow spotting.

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bet you in 2-3 years they will be just as common as the yellow spotted BEL. i read on this thread they've only made 4 of them, there will be more just wait.

seems like from reading through this thread and many others, selective breeding seemed to get the no spotted BEL. so buy some fires that are already from a low spot BEL line and hope for the best

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Originally Posted by OhhWatALoser

bet you in 2-3 years they will be just as common as the yellow spotted BEL. i read on this thread they've only made 4 of them, there will be more just wait.

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In all Big Gunns years he has to admit, this has to be one of the most genius cases of deductive reasoning that Big Gunns has ever seen.:D

Are you 100% sure on this OWA?;):D

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Originally Posted by Big Gunns

In all Big Gunns years he has to admit, this has to be one of the most genius cases of deductive reasoning that Big Gunns has ever seen.:D

Are you 100% sure on this OWA?;):D

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sometimes im not sure if you understand. hes comparing something that can be produced by pairing a sulfur to another sulfur and 25% of the time super sulfur vs an all white BEL which only a handful have been made out of many non-pure BEL's. so the rarity one vs the other will drop significantly in a couple years.

sooo.... im not sure what you getting at? should I have typed that the first time? i thought most people would understand that from my "genius case of deductive reasoning" :D

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Originally Posted by OhhWatALoser

sometimes im not sure if you understand. hes comparing something that can be produced by pairing a sulfur to another sulfur and 25% of the time super sulfur vs an all white BEL which only a handful have been made out of many non-pure BEL's. so the rarity one vs the other will drop significantly in a couple years.

sooo.... im not sure what you getting at? should I have typed that the first time? i thought most people would understand that from my "genius case of deductive reasoning" :D

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Big Gunns clearly understands what you're saying. What BG is trying to say is this. Obviously there will be more of them in the future. Does that really need to be pointed out? Clearly...like everything else...there will be more.

Hopefully you can understand what the "true genius" is saying this time.:P:D

In all honesty, I would be surprised if there is another Black eyed Lucy produced that is just like mine in the next 25 years. Unless it is a genetic situation involving the Mojave gene or something Eric and I have not thought of, I just do not see it happening anytime soon. The way the orange blotches just lined up......and to form a 99.9% complete stripe, (yeah, the orange stripe is one scale short of being perfect)... it going to be really hard to get another one.

I am laughing at all of the posts that say the orange blotches are lower quality or "B" Grade. I think there are plenty of people who think just the opposite. There are several ways to make a White Lucy, not many ways to make my snake.

Dave

http://i491.photobucket.com/albums/r...l/IMGP3305.jpg

That is an absolutely gorgeous animal! I would give him rack space any day!!
Mike Kelly

http://i491.photobucket.com/albums/r...l/IMGP3305.jpg
Dave,
this is from sulfer x sulfer, have you done anything with sulfer x fire?

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Originally Posted by EmberBall

I am laughing at all of the posts that say the orange blotches are lower quality or "B" Grade. I think there are plenty of people who think just the opposite.

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I would be one of those! Great looking snake! Makes me want to get back into ball pythons!

There are completely yellow/speckle free ones being produced here in the UK. I'll have to graba picture or two when I get the chance, we had our fire male from someone who produced a couple alongside another couple with just a few yellow scales on. literally one cent sized or smaller patch.

The clean BELs (and nice fires) were produced by paul.angelides, the forum user who proved the toffee gene this year. We hung on for a fire from him as the pairing that produced him was a nice clean BEL male x fire