List of possible banned snakes

Im watching the live podcast now. He just said all of the 9 snakes that are possibly dangerous.
He said boa constrictor, does that include red tail boas?
Honestly other than those, while I don't want it to be passed, it would not be the end of the world to me

yea it does. They even listed all 4 species of anacondas. 2 of which I dont believe are even in our country. I know there not in the pet trade.

The only ground they have is the size of the burmese. They can't even come with any examples of the other species listed. That's what makes me mad. They are going to use the burmese and it's size as the model, and then just squeeze the others through onto the ban. UGH!

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Originally Posted by thegoalie22

Im watching the live podcast now. He just said all of the 9 snakes that are possibly dangerous.
He said boa constrictor, does that include red tail boas?
Honestly other than those, while I don't want it to be passed, it would not be the end of the world to me

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Maybe not for YOU, but we're fighting this for ALL herpers. And if they ban one, they'll continue to add more. Might not be this bill, but it will certainly be one later.

While I only keep ball pythons and a few colubrids, any banning would be a loss.

What are the proposed species?

4 species of anaconda
boas
retics
burms
rocks
scrub

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Originally Posted by rabernet

Maybe not for YOU, but we're fighting this for ALL herpers. And if they ban one, they'll continue to add more. Might not be this bill, but it will certainly be one later.

While I only keep ball pythons and a few colubrids, any banning would be a loss.

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Thats why I dont understand usark stance on this

So the listed species won't be able to be sold and transported out of the states they are presently in? Would folks be allowed permits to move snakes to other states?

Xavier

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Originally Posted by Denial

Thats why I dont understand usark stance on this

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i dont understand it ether, thats like if i had said your aloud to have only two fingures and then the doc says hay ill help,,, and he comes up with ok you can keep all you fingures but your pinky come on,, why not stand up for all the snakes being ban,,but i think its because also they think that the burm and the rock are one of the most common snake in the us that it dont matter, which is bull

well if you watched the video this morning they clearly said boas and balls are were the money is in the industry. So basically those species come first. BUt there are still people that invest alot into burms. The butterscotch burm is fetching 10 grand and the hypos are 1500-3000. And for them to agree on rocks and burms just opens the doors for retics and anacondas.

Well to listen to my husband this is just a first step on banning so much more.

But sometimes he gets a little outta control....he said the other night.....take our snakes and the next thing they will try to take our guns....

hmmmm....

yep...thats my recently retired military guy!! :salute:

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Originally Posted by Denial

well if you watched the video this morning they clearly said boas and balls are were the money is in the industry. So basically those species come first. BUt there are still people that invest alot into burms. The butterscotch burm is fetching 10 grand and the hypos are 1500-3000. And for them to agree on rocks and burms just opens the doors for retics and anacondas.

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Oh man they better not ban Boas! The Boas and Balls DO bring in the most money. Im sure if they include these it will be very noticable the damage it will do to the amount of money changing hands. They have no idea at all the hundreds of thousand of dollars spent each year on the purchase and care of these animals in the herp world. Most of it isnt tax free either.

If only someone could put together a spread sheet to show what really goes into it and just how much the government will lose. The shipping companies, fedex & ups. Packaging. All the pet stores. Think about all the bedding & supplies people buy for breeding rodents. Bedding, racks, wheels, food, chew toys, tanks, lids etc.. Online supplies stores for UTH, therms, cages, bowls, bedding, lights, hygros, hides. The rack makers. Incubators. All the websites which require membership and fees to post adds. etc etc etc.

They have absolutely no idea how much money would be takin out of circulation. When you really think about everyone who will be affected because of the massive size of this hobby its really astronomical.

Im sure it will be very financially noticable for everyone. Wow. It will be very bad if they really do this. They just have no idea. It would be SO bad that they would literally wish they had not done it.

If the shipping companies were told of the actual impact this will have I bet some of their people would fight it too. TONS of reptiles are shipped every day!

Ive never really thought about it in this way but its really amazing the damage it will do when you think down through all the levels that go into this hobby.

well andrew did mention today during the video that it would effect the shipping companies

I really hope nothing gets banned, even if I don't work work with those animals listed it would be a great loss to the hobby.

One banning only leads to another... :(

Banning of any of these species is not the answer. Responsible pet ownership and Parenting would solve the problems. This whole subject really really urks me. I hope people wise up and be more responsible. Also too many people dislike snakes for absolutely no reason, if only they had one as a pet. Opinions of these animals would change.

I only keep a few species of animals. The GF doesnt like snakes so I stick to 6 foot or smaller snakes generally. But I do hope all you Burm AND Retic{any large species snakes} dont get affected by this.

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Originally Posted by XGetSome

Banning of any of these species is not the answer. Responsible pet ownership and Parenting would solve the problems. This whole subject really really urks me. I hope people wise up and be more responsible. Also too many people dislike snakes for absolutely no reason, if only they had one as a pet. Opinions of these animals would change.

I only keep a few species of animals. The GF doesnt like snakes so I stick to 6 foot or smaller snakes generally. But I do hope all you Burm AND Retic{any large species snakes} dont get affected by this.

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And wouldnt all those people who are afraid of snakes for no reason be absolutely shocked if they knew the actual amount of people who own & love them? I would not be surprised at all if the number of snake haters is the minority. If they had any idea the actual scale of this hobby in the USA & the amount of revenue it generates just to kep one as a pet they would be dumbfounded. It shocks me that its not known to anyone other than the actual hobbiests and snake lovers.

That ignorance is the only reason these bans have gotten as far as they have. Like its been said before. For some reason the herpers do not put up the same kind of fight that dog & cat lovers do. Even tho more people get bitten by dogs and get sick from a potentially deadly bacteria in used cat litter every year than by snakes.

It really is rediculas. Completely. It shocks & bewilders me because its all happening right in front of our faces & we are fully aware that its happening without being supported by FACT. Thats the worst part. Some organization of people who use all the money donated to them for reasons other than what they lead the public to believe, is heading up the fight to put this ban into play. For some reason they have convinced polititions that its worth their time to waste tons of money and effort on banning these snakes.

Ummmm.. How?? How do you convince an otherwise intelligent person who supposedly works for the rights of the american people that it is worthwhile to ban pythons?? A politition who probably doesnt care one bit about the ecosystem in FLA. One who is motivated purely by money. That getting rid of a group of harmless animals from the pet trade which brings in millions of dollars a year, is a good idea???

It really frustrates me. Its the type of "logic" that really makes me say wtf?? And only want to laugh openly in the face of the moran... person who is trying to convince me that the sky is actually neon yellow with bright red clouds.



Fascism? Socialism?

I think so.....

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Originally Posted by stratus_020202

4 species of anaconda
boas
retics
burms
rocks
scrub

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Screw em, i'll take one of each!!!

BrandonsBalls

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Originally Posted by Draigess

If only someone could put together a spread sheet to show what really goes into it and just how much the government will lose. The shipping companies, fedex & ups. Packaging. All the pet stores. Think about all the bedding & supplies people buy for breeding rodents. Bedding, racks, wheels, food, chew toys, tanks, lids etc.. Online supplies stores for UTH, therms, cages, bowls, bedding, lights, hygros, hides. The rack makers. Incubators. All the websites which require membership and fees to post adds. etc etc etc.

They have absolutely no idea how much money would be takin out of circulation. When you really think about everyone who will be affected because of the massive size of this hobby its really astronomical.

[...]

Ive never really thought about it in this way but its really amazing the damage it will do when you think down through all the levels that go into this hobby.

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The problem is these people (HSUS, etc.) don't care about all the people who will be severely affected by a bill like this. All they care about is their agenda. If they're willing to lie, spread falsehoods, and perpetuate fear just to ban as many reptiles as possible, then they don't give a snake-food's-back-end about people who keep/enjoy/breed these creatures.

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Originally Posted by BPelizabeth

Well to listen to my husband this is just a first step on banning so much more.

But sometimes he gets a little outta control....he said the other night.....take our snakes and the next thing they will try to take our guns....

hmmmm....

yep...thats my recently retired military guy!! :salute:

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its sad to say he has some merit there. every year they try to ban a list of guns. now they are trying to tax the crap out of ammo so we cant afford it.

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Originally Posted by nixer

its sad to say he has some merit there. every year they try to ban a list of guns. now they are trying to tax the crap out of ammo so we cant afford it.

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duh, you shooting a target is endangering my safety and infringing on my rights...a state away. you should now this, nixer, cmon now. :rolleye2:

I hope there are no bans.
IMO I do think a permit should be required for keeping the larger snakes. This may include boa constrictors and other middle sized snakes that have never harmed a human. I say this only so the needs of the snakes are met and that the snake(s) can not escape. The permit should have a list of requirements for the proper care of the animal.
IMO It's too easy for an impulse buyer to purchase a snake that is going to get BIG. I saw baby burmese pythons for $60 at an expo a few years ago. These were easily affordable beautiful snakes with the potential of getting over 15 feet!
Bans are not the answer! Not for guns either!

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Originally Posted by HypoPita

duh, you shooting a target is endangering my safety and infringing on my rights...a state away. you should now this, nixer, cmon now. :rolleye2:

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:rofl::rofl::rofl:
i hit what i shoot at but i surely doubt that anyone could for that distance.
perhaps they would shoot better if they held the gun properly or we put sights on the side of the gun :weirdface

Well I only have BP's, however I do honestly believe that if this passes we are just an inch away from banning other things. Already in certain states there are bans on certain dogs in apartments....ie pitbulls, rottys etc. When I first moved to AZ I had a hard time trying to get an apartment because I had a pit mix. I know here if something happens or those animals are turned into the humane society...they do not even get a chance to get adopted.

It is really ppls general ignorance! They hear a story and run with it. Just like when ppl see my BP's they instantly talk about the girl that got killed in FL. Hello...not a BP. I personally take it upon myself to educate everyone I know in regards to snakes. If I can make a difference in the few hundred I know....good deal. (I work at a school) so I am talking about friends and kids and parents at school.

As far as the politicians...well they are listening to these special interests groups.... I think one person talked about shipping companies and the tax involved that the gov. receives on selling them. I think that is an area that someone should ivestigate and really bring to the attention of those politicians. I also think ....ok lets comprimise....for those snakes in question...get a license. Pay a small fee...like a dog. Is it the best idea....probably not however it is a comprimise. Maybe if you are a breeder have some type of permit. I don't know!! Just suggestions ...instead of banning them. Maybe chipping them would be a good idea so if someone does release....and it is caught that person has to pay a fine. ??


Maybe to get a license you have to go through some online training ...kind of like a read this and then a test to get your license....maybe then uninformed ppl that get them and don't know how to take care of them will be discouraged from buying them.

I am just trying to give the ppl that have a voice on here when it comes to this debate ideas to comprimise instead of the politicians saying ....BANNED!

All of this is just ideas coming from someone that doesn't even have them....just do not want to see this happen ....I truly believe that this decision will affect all of us down the road eventually.

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Originally Posted by BPelizabeth

As far as the politicians...well they are listening to these special interests groups.... I think one person talked about shipping companies and the tax involved that the gov. receives on selling them. I think that is an area that someone should ivestigate and really bring to the attention of those politicians. I also think ....ok lets comprimise....for those snakes in question...get a license. Pay a small fee...like a dog. Is it the best idea....probably not however it is a comprimise. Maybe if you are a breeder have some type of permit. I don't know!! Just suggestions ...instead of banning them. Maybe chipping them would be a good idea so if someone does release....and it is caught that person has to pay a fine. ??

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Unfortunately, this is already the case in Florida. Burms (maybe others?) require microchipping and a permit. However, like in the case of the two-year-old's death, people can just ignore the law until it comes and bites them in the butt. There are a couple problems concerning this with our current situation: (1) If I remember correctly, this permit/chip law was only enacted fairly recently, so they haven't given it enough time to actually start working; (2) The permit/chip law was enacted after Burms had already populated southern Florida, so it does nothing to help the wild Burm problem (though, it somewhat keeps others from being released).

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Originally Posted by nixer

:rofl::rofl::rofl:
i hit what i shoot at but i surely doubt that anyone could for that distance.
perhaps they would shoot better if they held the gun properly or we put sights on the side of the gun :weirdface

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on a side note: maybe we can go shooting sometime after I get my gun license. I turn 21 next month..yessssss :banana:

I find it pretty frustrating and irrational for their first move to be a complete ban, instead of requiring a permit!!

liquor license -> sale -> 21 -> buy -> drink

permit -> car -> experience -> license

permit (course?) -> gun

snake -> BAN :confused:

In all honestly, I think a req'd course for reptiles would be a reasonable thing, and maybe even a good thing for the animals. Possibly conducted by herp societies in the style of the Motorcycle Safety Course available in Illinois.

Perhaps the herp society has sign up for, and hosts, an informational course on reptiles (specific to type of animal?) on a weekend; either on a monthly or annual basis, where sign up is 20 dollars or some other low cost to hold their place, the course is conducted, and what the msf course did was gave you the option at the end to either donate that 20 dollars to help their funding or request a refund of that money. It was basically used as collateral so you did not take up a space and not show up.

I don't think it should be like a huge test or way too critical into husbandry. Honestly we all do things a bit differently, and it works; but a general jist is a good idea. Getting to see and handle the larger snakes to know what you are getting into would be a fantastic idea.

This, ofcourse, as with anything, raises the problem of funding. That would all have to be figured out. I don't want to be one of the people that goes "oh, well the government should have this awesome course thing and fund it all" or "people should be required to pay [some ridiculous price] to take the required class class." I always get confused when people think the government can just shell out for every little thing; If you want them to, don't complain about hiking the taxes, imo.

This may not be fully clear, idk, I am kind of in a rush and preoccupied, but I think you guys understand what I'm saying. :gj:

For those of you who keep ball pythons, or colubrids, or lizards, please keep the following in mind:

"First they came for the communists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a communist;
Then they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist;
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a trade unionist;
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew;
Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak out for me."

WE ARE ALL IN THIS TOGETHER. If we do not stand with our fellow reptile keepers who work with Burms and AfRocks, make no mistake about it--WE will be next. HSUS has made its agenda abundantly clear. They have declared war on us. If we look ONLY to our own selfish interests and do not do our darnedest to support our fellow herpers, we will all MOST CERTAINLY lose the war.

MAKE THOSE PHONE CALLS. I don't care if all you own is a leopard gecko--MAKE the calls. If you own any herp, then this DOES affect you--immediately and directly. Act accordingly!

With the idea of the license testing.....I was thinking more along the lines of ppl being able to open up companies ...be that online. It adds to the economy....its another private business...and to me it might help those ppl that get snakes and have NO idea what they are doing and eventually kill the snake.

Just an idea....I certainly wouldn't want the gov. to run...I am NOT a fan of big government. I am not sure how the logistics of it would work out. (I am sure if this was something to move forward with ...I could figure it out. I have a friend that owns a company that teaches classes to ppl that are about to loose their licenses.) But ....again just an idea to maybe comprimise. And its another avenue for someone to open a business.

I am trying to just come up with solutions or ideas for the ppl that are fighting this directly. Since I am not up in front of these politicians the only thing I can do is send a letter or an email or call, but that is it. Not to discount that but.........

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Originally Posted by BPelizabeth

I think one person talked about shipping companies and the tax involved that the gov. receives on selling them. I think that is an area that someone should ivestigate and really bring to the attention of those politicians.

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Interesting point. I wonder if anybody has a contact at UPS, Fedex and Delta that could get this information?