Those Ultramels in the photo section!

They are incredible! So what makes them?
Mike

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Originally Posted by mfkelly

They are incredible! So what makes them?
Mike

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It's another base morph (T+ Albino).

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Originally Posted by mfkelly

They are incredible! So what makes them?
Mike

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They are recessive so you need hets or ultamels to make one.

I didn't know what they were either. Thanks for asking!

I wondered this too. BP morphs are out of control!!!

It seems like there is no end to morphs and combos in the BP world. Is there any other animal that has this much variation in their color/pattern genetics?!!! Mice are vastly bred and I don't think they have nearly the amount of variation that BPs do.

Granted you could make an infinite number of combos for mammals like dogs, but you start to get in really murky water with all the genetic health problems that comes along with each breed (unlike 98% of bp morphs).

And yes I know there is a difference between morphs and breeds :D

I don't think they're really T+ Albinos, since they have black eyes...

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Originally Posted by Nordinho

I don't think they're really T+ Albinos, since they have black eyes...

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I thought tyrosinase-positive have dark pigmentation versus the tyrosinase-negative? Isn't tyrosinase an enzyme necessary in the production of melanin from tyrosine?

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Originally Posted by Jerhart

I thought tyrosinase-positive have dark pigmentation versus the tyrosinase-negative? Isn't tyrosinase an enzyme necessary in the production of melanin from tyrosine?

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T- =regular Albinos
T+ = Caramels (which have red eyes)...

Ultramels as T+??? think there's more to it or it'd be just another line of Caramel Albino. :confused:

Ultramel looks just like Crider to me.

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Originally Posted by NorthernRegius

T- =regular Albinos
T+ = Caramels (which have red eyes)...

Ultramels as T+??? think there's more to it or it'd be just another line of Caramel Albino. :confused:

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I believe it is just another line of Caramel. It just isn't compatible with the other Caramel Albinos lines according to Vin Russo I believe, so it is called Ultramel. T+

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Originally Posted by WingedWolfPsion

Ultramel looks just like Crider to me.

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See this is where I agree...I am not sure if the Crider line is now called Ultramel?

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Originally Posted by WingedWolfPsion

Ultramel looks just like Crider to me.

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Thats cause they appear to be different lines of the same morph which have also been called burgandy albino too. Time will tell for sure.

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Originally Posted by West Coast Jungle

Thats cause they appear to be different lines of the same morph which have also been called burgandy albino too. Time will tell for sure.

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Does it appear to be the same as the Burgundy Albino? I know some people put the Candy Ball and the Toffee ball in the same category but I think those are different. At least the pics I've seen of hatchling candy balls look more like an albino to me, but they apparently darken up later to look like the toffees? What DOES a hatchling toffee ball look like anyway?

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Originally Posted by WingedWolfPsion

Ultramel looks just like Crider to me.

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I believe Crider Caramels are now being called Ultramels, so same snake, different name. Anyone can feel more than free to correct me as I'm not 100%.

I think they cannot be T+ albinos, correct me if I'm mistaken--they have black eyes. Melanin in the eyes would preclude amelanism, one would think. Instead, they would have to be some form of hypo, yes?

Ultramels are Criders just called a different name.

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Originally Posted by WingedWolfPsion

I think they cannot be T+ albinos, correct me if I'm mistaken--they have black eyes. Melanin in the eyes would preclude amelanism, one would think. Instead, they would have to be some form of hypo, yes?

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No.

http://www.ralphdavisreptiles.com/co...all_python.asp

The eyes look black when photographed from a distance but close up photos with flash show they are actually very dark red.

http://i925.photobucket.com/albums/a...ltramelEye.jpg

The eye color will be determined by two things: pigment in the retina and pigment in the iris. If there is pigment in the iris but not the retina, the eye will look dark with a red pupil. If there is pigment in the retina but not the iris, the eye will look red with a dark pupil. Eye color in a given albino morph is going to depend on whether or not the genes causing the morph affect the retina and/or iris.

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Originally Posted by Jerhart

I believe it is just another line of Caramel. It just isn't compatible with the other Caramel Albinos lines according to Vin Russo I believe, so it is called Ultramel. T+



See this is where I agree...I am not sure if the Crider line is now called Ultramel?

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The original Crider animal came in 10 years ago give or take a year...and the Ultramels have only been around for a couple of years so they are indeed different. Maybe like lessers and butters? We'll know once they are bred to each other. Here's a closeup shot of a proven male Crider...with a flash...no red.
http://photos.imageevent.com/ghirept...er%20close.jpg

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Originally Posted by Pulcher

Ultramels are Criders just called a different name.

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And probably Spilt Rock reptiles "Caramels" as well (at least I hope so). I have a pair of hets from Split Rock and while it has not been confirmed that they are Ultramels they sure look the same to me and a few other people whose opinion I trust.

http://www.splitrockreptiles.com/htm...s_caramel.html

The Crider line and Vin Russo snakes all come from the same WC founder animal. My female Crider has dark red eyes that it takes a flashlight to see. I think they are a form of T+ Albino but not the same morph as the Caramel. I have seen the VPI Burgundy in the flesh and she looks almost identical to my Crider female. I have an Ultramel as well and he is slightly diffrent looking than the Crider but nothing I would not just call natural variation in Normals showing itself within the morph. There are a couple breeders in this country with Ultramels that call them their own line of Caramels but they all trace back to were the ultramels come from. From my observations I would be shocked if Ultramels, Burgundy, and Crider/VR snakes were not the same morph from diffrent WC Founders. Just like the Toffee and Candy are almost certainly the same morph as well. Only time will tell.

Ryan Young