14 months since this guy ate....

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Originally Posted by sg1trogdor

From one of your earlier posts I noticed you didn't leave the ASF in with the snake for very long. I would leave it in for several hours or even all night occasionally checking to make sure the ASF isn't getting "hungry" if you know what I mean. I have some snakes that take hours to eat but always do. ALso if you are worried about it try leaving a dead mouse in over night That works for a few of mine. Seems that they prefer the smell of dead rotting flesh. (well not literally rotting)

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I've left dead mice and or small rats in with him no joy. Good idea though! On my next attempt (after he settles down from the vet visit I'll leave the ASF in with him longer... checking on him to be safe. :D

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Originally Posted by irishanaconda

im suprised ppl will still say to leave a mouse in with out any supervision for long periods of time. a mouse or a rat can chew thru all kinds of stuff and can gnaw thru a snake in no time. as for ur non eating snake, i have a female who went for a year, then she laid 6 good eggs with no slugs, keep trying... she went back on feed after i found she would take a frozen thawed if i tucked it in with her in her hide and left it over night.... FROZEN THAWED... not live, do not leave live rats in the cage overnight with ur snake and please do not listen to the people who think its ok.... its not. i also breed asf rats and it works the same with pre killing them and leaving it in her hide.

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That will be my next thing to try if he doesn't eat the live ASF next time.

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Originally Posted by WingedWolfPsion

Flagyl really hasn't been shown to stimulate appetite in trials. It's actually an irritant in the digestive system and tends to put animals off feed. What it does is kill protozoa. Undiagnosed protozoal infections can certainly be a cause of anorexia in reptiles.
So, people give flagyl, the animal starts eating, and they believe the flagyl gave them back their appetite. Not exactly what's happening.
This is why it doesn't always work, of course. You might as well add in some panacur and do a total parasite clearing, while you're at it. It's hard on the snake to use these worming meds, but if it works, it's because the snake actually had parasites.

Or, assist-feed the snake, obtain a fecal sample, and have the vet do a proper fecal float check to determine if anything's going on. This would be better for the animal than shotgunning it with worming meds. If it has, say, tapeworm--that requires a different medication. So does coccidia. Panacur kills worms, and flagyl kills protoza. So, that's 4 different types of meds (at least). It would be best to use only what's needed.

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Yup. I read up on flagyl a bit. I understand it doesn't really stimulate the appetite so much as get rid of the problem that had them not eating... call it what you will but if it works it works! If this doesn't work panacur et al. will be the next try.

I'm thinking tapeworms wouldn't go this long without dying out considering the snake isn't eating? Or would it just eat the snake from the inside out? Either way it seems like a long time!

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Originally Posted by Big Gunns

What in the (insert word here) are you doing going to this Vet? Look at the list and find a good Qualified VET next time!!!!!!!!

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:rolleye2: I looked at the vet list: not a single one in Louisiana, let alone New Orleans. You'd think living in a big city we would have some, but they seem to have left after Hurricane Katrina. The only "exotic" vet still listed in our area (in the local phone book) couldn't even properly diagnose problems I had with a rabbit (which he assured me he knew ALL about!) I brought to him. I'm sure not bringing him a snake.

As it turns out my vet (who is part of a larger multi-doctor office) has no problems with snakes. The over-all practice doesn't treat snakes in general because of "liability issues" since they aren't specifically "exotic" designated. This specific doctor saw me and my snake on her "lunch break" and actually enjoys dealing with snakes. Would I necessarily bring her a snake that I needed diagnosed? I dunno, but I sure trust her to put a tube down his mouth and give him some Flagyl! :D

This doctor is also net-savvy and doesn't mind looking things up or calling someone if she isn't sure about something. :D

Well you should ask for b-vitamins too! They are an appetite stimulant for sure. You can ask them to include it with the next dose of whatever (if needed.)

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Originally Posted by rabernet

The longest that I personally leave prey in with my animals is 30 minutes, any longer than that, I feel that the snake is more stressed by the prey's presence than not.

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This is why I removed the ASF last attempt after only about an hour the snake was acting stressed and had just balled up. It was obvious it wasn't even checking out the ASF anymore (which it did right at first).

Whew! I think I answered them all. Thanks so much for all the interest and advice guys and gals! This is why I like this forum. At this point I am just waiting for the Flagyl to (maybe?) work it's magic and then I'll try feeding him this Sunday most likely.

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Originally Posted by Bleepr

Well you should ask for b-vitamins too! They are an appetite stimulant for sure. You can ask them to include it with the next dose of whatever (if needed.)

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I actually meant to do that last time and I forgot. If it's a no-go this weekend she already said I can bring him back in for another go. I'll ask her about that then.

By the way, did I mention that the visit didn't cost me anything at all? I promised to buy some candy bars from her kid for the school money drive. :D

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Originally Posted by wax32

Yup. I read up on flagyl a bit. I understand it doesn't really stimulate the appetite so much as get rid of the problem that had them not eating... call it what you will but if it works it works! If this doesn't work panacur et al. will be the next try.

I'm thinking tapeworms wouldn't go this long without dying out considering the snake isn't eating? Or would it just eat the snake from the inside out? Either way it seems like a long time!

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Yes it probably would, which is one reason BG only said to use Flagyl.

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Originally Posted by wax32

Whew! I think I answered them all. Thanks so much for all the interest and advice guys and gals! This is why I like this forum. At this point I am just waiting for the Flagyl to (maybe?) work it's magic and then I'll try feeding him this Sunday most likely.

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Sunday night.

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Originally Posted by wax32

I actually meant to do that last time and I forgot. If it's a no-go this weekend she already said I can bring him back in for another go. I'll ask her about that then.

By the way, did I mention that the visit didn't cost me anything at all? I promised to buy some candy bars from her kid for the school money drive. :D

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She didn't charge you because she felt guilty for not really knowing what to do.;):D

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Originally Posted by WingedWolfPsion

Flagyl really hasn't been shown to stimulate appetite in trials. It's actually an irritant in the digestive system and tends to put animals off feed. What it does is kill protozoa. Undiagnosed protozoal infections can certainly be a cause of anorexia in reptiles.
So, people give flagyl, the animal starts eating, and they believe the flagyl gave them back their appetite. Not exactly what's happening.
This is why it doesn't always work, of course. You might as well add in some panacur and do a total parasite clearing, while you're at it. It's hard on the snake to use these worming meds, but if it works, it's because the snake actually had parasites.

Or, assist-feed the snake, obtain a fecal sample, and have the vet do a proper fecal float check to determine if anything's going on. This would be better for the animal than shotgunning it with worming meds. If it has, say, tapeworm--that requires a different medication. So does coccidia. Panacur kills worms, and flagyl kills protoza. So, that's 4 different types of meds (at least). It would be best to use only what's needed.

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Big Gunns needs to comment on this further.

A few people including WWP have given BG some grief about telling people to use a certain med without a fecal. Big Gunns has this to say about that. Every time you go to the doctor, does the doc take blood or check your urine. We know the answer to that don't we. If you go to the doc and tell him you have a stomach ache, he is gonna ask you a bunch of questions and maybe prescribe you something.

On the other hand. If you go to the doctor and tell him you have a stomach ache....along with the fact that you just got back from Africa studying the mating habits of the African Dung beetle. He will probably do more tests on you.:D

Big Gunns point is this. Although doing a fecal and other tests is not a bad thing, it's not always needed if you're experienced....key word is "experienced". BG may turn out to be wrong in this case, but if the OP does everything BG says, BG thinks it will eat if it's not too far gone. We may need to do a leeetle more tricks to get it to eat though. If they don't work then BG thinks more tests will be needed.

Yup! I hope this works, this snake drives me crazy!