I am going to have to disagree

Suddenly that cheesy 80s (Might have been 90s...) commercial comes into my head...

The more you know

Conversations like these are awesome. I learn alot, whether or not it's from a book or a class, it's from experienced people.

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Originally Posted by Skiploder

IF cage aggression were somehow related to being conditioned via being fed in the cage (:weirdface) then all you'd have to do to un-condition the snake is to open the cage at random intervals without feeding it.

I've had fish be conditioned to shooting to the top of the tank whenever my hand was up there. But I'm not in the habit of handling fish so it is understandable that they'd be conditioned to expect food.

Most pet snakes, unlike fish, are handled. I would hazard a WAG and throw out that the average snake is handled at random intervals several times before it's fed.

Therefore, I seriously doubt that after only one feeding, amidst several handling sessions, and being previously fed in a separate bin - that the OP's snake all of a sudden is conditioned to expect food when his cage door is opened.

Then again - what do I know?

Right?

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Yeah I completely agree. I was trying to simply point out that conditioning could occur after one instance to that one forum member. Of course it ended up being not so simple...

Dennis

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IF cage aggression were somehow related to being conditioned via being fed in the cage () then all you'd have to do to un-condition the snake is to open the cage at random intervals without feeding it.

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On second thought what you just described is intermittent reinforcement which can produce longer lasting training effects on animals that normal classical conditioning/reinforcement techniques. But lets not go there...however pertinent training may be to the original topic.

Dennis

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Originally Posted by Hapa_Haole

On second thought what you just described is intermittent reinforcement which can produce longer lasting training effects on animals that normal classical conditioning/reinforcement techniques. But lets not go there...however pertinent training may be to the original topic.

Dennis

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Is that really "intermittent reinforcement" (I'm assuming that's a valid name for it since you used it) or just confusing a dumb animal by throwing off it's perception of a simple pattern?

Hi,

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Originally Posted by wilomn

I suppose it may just depend on which MODE the MOD was in.

Friendly MODE- no problem
Irritated MODE- some people......
Frustrated in General MODE- infraction infraction, infractions all around

And female cats are not just queens but Queens of they see, have ever seen and will ever see. Try to get it right next time.

Sheesh.

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It was indeed female dog not cat but the word was partially expressed using other characters - which is taken as an attempted censor bypass if the word can still be understood. I know this because I edited the quote of the post further down the first page. :)

And the mod's mood doesn't really come into this.


dr del

I've never had a problem with cage aggression and I have always fed in-cage, but I also judge a snake's mood before attempting to handle or clean or put my hands within striking distance.

A snake can be hungry at any time, and I do my best to not present my fingers as possible prey.

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Originally Posted by Montie Python

My point in the matter was simply that I disagree with people saying there is no difference between feeding them in a different enclosure rather than their own enclosure

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If you are going to disagree with a rule of thumb (I thought the rule was snakes are more likely to eat in their own enclosure, but what ev), then I guess having more than one account counts with more weight?

How about this. We've had snakes for a couple of years.

We feed 40+ (lost count) snakes every week (roughly) in their enclosure.

40+ x 104 (2 years approx) = 4,680 instances where our snakes ate in their enclosures, and NONE are showing cage aggression, like you are saying has definitely happened after your one time of feeding in the cage.

Go figure.

But I digress, please, carry on, you can totally disagree after the one little feeding, because it is clearly common sense and not mere speculation given there are many more factors at play besides the one feeding in the cage at all, right? Right??? Yep. That's just plain common sense at work over there.

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Originally Posted by Montie Python

Additionally i was cleaning his tank today, and he came out of his hide very aggressively looking to see if i had his food...he NEVER comes out of his hide when I'm cleaning...I must admit, i was a bit intimidated...

I have to say that I'm no snake's pushover

so i will continue feeding him in his feeding bin...to see if his Osbourne behavior will subside...

Thank you,

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lawl.

i feed my bp anywhere, he'll eat while being handled, while wrapped around my arm or whatever so i dont have many feeding problems (and hes only a few months old :))

but i know what your talking about there, lol. if you feed in their enclosure then theyre a barrel of laughs for a day or so afterwards. although mines never actually struck me i find it hilarious how he will rush from his hide at the slightest knock or vibration.
aslong as you can get him to smell your hand before biting tho your fine :)

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Originally Posted by seercirra

lawl.

i feed my bp anywhere, he'll eat while being handled, while wrapped around my arm or whatever so i dont have many feeding problems (and hes only a few months old :))

but i know what your talking about there, lol. if you feed in their enclosure then theyre a barrel of laughs for a day or so afterwards. although mines never actually struck me i find it hilarious how he will rush from his hide at the slightest knock or vibration.
aslong as you can get him to smell your hand before biting tho your fine :)

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...why would you feed a snake while its being handled or rather, wrapped around your arm? Are you sure you are feeding the snake enough?


If you want to pick up a snake who looks to be in a bad mood, just approach from the side so they can see your hand but can't turn to bite quickly enough. Then scoop em up and hold them until they relax a bit. Don't wave your hand in front of the snake first and let it smell you. You are just giving it more of a reason to bite you (especially if it is pissed). They are not dogs or cats, they don't need to smell you before you pick them up.

It is true that all snakes are different, and do react differently to different things. Since I've been feeding my two Kings and my Corn in their enclosures, they think I'm feeding them EVERY SINGLE TIME I OPEN THE CAGE so they spring out and try to get me on my finger. My larger King snake shows some serious feeding response.. just last week when I grabbed him to pick him up he almost bit my arm. And I know my arm looks nothing like his food. He's such a sweet snake.. but now he's showing some bad feeding responses.. My male BP and my boa do just fine with no feeding responses.