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Re: superball<3
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mendel's Balls
One more point...are captive bred normal ball pythons that come from a long line of normal captive breedings 100% wild population ball pythons?
Still havent answered this question......and to think their appearance wont change given enough time in capativity is somewhat naive.
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Re: superball<3
Quote:
Originally Posted by PythonWallace
Dogs have reliable pedegree information. .
It's called a mongrel or mutt and I doubt the dog breeding world has no pedigree tracking problems. People are people. Overall, Mixed-breeds tend to have less health problems than purebreed dogs due to hybrid vigor. Furthermore,the selectively breeding rounds that give rise to the pure-breed dog tends to concentrate both good and bad genes. Hence purebreed are prone to many recessive genetic conditions. The advantage of purebreeds is that they have more specialized and controlled behaviors and appearances.
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Re: superball<3
Quote:
Originally Posted by sg1trogdor
To wach is his/her own. I am not saying its wrong, now would I do it? No. but crossbreeding and breeding things for certain traits has been done for centuries. Example, dogs and cats you thinkg there were naturally little rat dogs that have to be given little sweaters because they have no hair? No, they were bred that way for some god awful reason. im not nesessarily saying its right but you cant get upset at a snake breeder and then look over at your little hairless dog or your bulldog for that matter and not have an opinion. if i am a little off on my facts i apologize but my basic argument holds to be true, im just to tired to do the actual research right now. lol.
I hear you, and I understand that dog breeds are man-made for the most part. I just think it's different, because I can still buy a 100% Husky, or 100% wolf, or 100% dingo if I choose to, because of strict pedegree information. I would like to work with hybrids and create my own species of North American Rat/King/Corn over dozens of generations. I just would never do it unless there was a strict pedegree system in place for snakes, so I never have any hand in mucking up true blood lines.
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Re: superball<3
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mendel's Balls
Still havent answered this question......and to think their appearance wont change given enough time in capativity is somewhat naive.
Thousands of WC and CH balls are imported every year to refresh the captive bloodlines. Most breeders prefer to use CH as much as possible when normals are used. Selective breeding can and does change appearances, but they are still 100% ball pythons, and if bred to a wild type, the offspring will pretty much lose most of the characteristics of the selective breeding. I'd have no problem buying a decendant of all captive bred BPs as long as it looks good to me and didn't exhibit and physical or neurological flaws. Line bred captive or not, it's a bnall python.
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Re: superball<3
Quote:
Originally Posted by PythonWallace
I hear you, and I understand that dog breeds are man-made for the most part. I just think it's different, because I can still buy a 100% Husky, or 100% wolf, or 100% dingo if I choose to, because of strict pedegree information. I would like to work with hybrids and create my own species of North American Rat/King/Corn over dozens of generations. I just would never do it unless there was a strict pedegree system in place for snakes, so I never have any hand in mucking up true blood lines.
As long as these snakes remain conserved in the wild without capative breds being released in their geographic range I would think you could be certain that you could get something 100% King, Rat, or Corn. It's called Wild-caught.....
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Re: superball<3
Quote:
Originally Posted by PythonWallace
Thousands of WC and CH balls are imported every year to refresh the captive bloodlines. Most breeders prefer to use CH as much as possible when normals are used. Selective breeding can and does change appearances, but they are still 100% ball pythons, and if bred to a wild type, the offspring will pretty much lose most of the characteristics of the selective breeding. I'd have no problem buying a decendant of all captive bred BPs as long as it looks good to me and didn't exhibit and physical or neurological flaws. Line bred captive or not, it's a bnall python.
That's like saying a dog (Canis familiaris) and a wolf (Canis lupus) are the same. The former I've owned, the latter remains in the wild for me. This is a new hobby but given enough time there will be significant differences between wild and capative bred populations that will make it difficult to produce a wild-like/looking offspring from a WC x CBB crossing.
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Re: superball<3
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mendel's Balls
As long as these snakes remain conserved in the wild without capative breds being released in their geographic range I would think you could be certain that you could get something 100% King, Rat, or Corn. It's called Wild-caught.....
I could get a WC corn, but I'm mostly interested in corns because of all the amazing morphs out there. I wouldn't be interested in starting with wild caught animals and trying to duplicate all the work that people like Kathy Love and Rich Z. have done. Like I said before, it would be tough to buy a pair of snows, and know that they aren't emoryi crosses. It's too bad that's the case.
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Re: superball<3
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mendel's Balls
That's like saying a dog (Canis familiaris) and a wolf (Canis lupus) are the same. The former I've owned, the latter remains in the wild for me. This is a new hobby but given enough time there will be significant differences between wild and capative bred populations that will make it difficult to produce a wild-like/looking offspring from a WC x CBB crossing.
I'm just saying there are dog and wolf hybrids, but there are still pure breds that can be identified through generations and generations of paper work. I also think that since people consider it a good thing to import fresh bp lines, normal balls in captivity will not morph into a different creature. diverse, fresh blood is a good thing.
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Re: superball<3
Quote:
Originally Posted by PythonWallace
Like I said before, it would be tough to buy a pair of snows, and know that they aren't emoryi crosses. It's too bad that's the case.
Perhaps I dont understand why this is such an issue for you. As long as the animal is healthly and you like the appearance what with this obessive need to know the minute details of its "bloodline" and as you call it?
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Re: superball<3
Quote:
Originally Posted by PythonWallace
I'm just saying there are dog and wolf hybrids, but there are still pure breds that can be identified through generations and generations of paper work. I also think that since people consider it a good thing to import fresh bp lines, normal balls in captivity will not morph into a different creature. diverse, fresh blood is a good thing.
Isnt a kind of directional selection going on over in Africa though? Anything that looks different is capatured and sent over to a developed country. Anything that's a possible morph is sent over here. That is likely to have a bottleneck effect on the population over in Africa.
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