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Re: Lesser/Butter
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Lesser x Lesser = blue eyed lucy? is that all, or will you also get other lessers.
as far as I know, you would get blue eyed Leucistics, lessers and normals. Think of a lesser as being a het leucistic.
I think he was just pointing out the different ways to make a leucistic, not breaking it down to the different forms in a single clutch.
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Re: Lesser/Butter
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Originally Posted by MarkS
as far as I know, you would get blue eyed Leucistics, lessers and normals. Think of a lesser as being a het leucistic.
I think he was just pointing out the different ways to make a leucistic, not breaking it down to the different forms in a single clutch.
I think calling it what it is, is less confusing. It's a co-dom, so think of the BEL as a super lesser.
A lesser x lesser should = lessers, BEL's, and normals.
A lesser x normal (non sibling) should = lessers and normals.
Anyone can feel more than free to correct me if I'm wrong.
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Re: Lesser/Butter
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Originally Posted by jhall1468
That doesn't make much sense to me. A codominant allele that presents no differences between a wild-type in visual appearance? I'm not sure what is going on with the "Daddy" gene, but I think it is WAY to early to be making predictions on what it is, let alone what it's compatible with.
This theory has been around for years now (I didn't come up with it, someone on this forum who posts as Hahaman did) and agrees with all the subsequent breedings I've heard of so far, most notably the platys that have been produced (and not produced) including the daddy/platy butter with no inbreeding.
There is precedence for a dilute gene that has no visible effect by it's self but dilutes certain morphs in rats.
I think it is way too late after years of platy breedings for there to still be so much confusion as to the results. I'm going to go out on a limb and say I'm pretty darn sure this theory is right. I just need to find a better way of explaining it so it makes sense to others. I can't remember if this site supports html, let me try a test Punnett square:
<html><table border=2><tr><td></td><td>w</td><td>Wl</td></tr><tr><td>wd</td><td>w wd</td><td>wd Wl</td></tr><tr><td>w</td><td>w w</td><td>w Wl</td></tr></table></html>
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Re: Lesser/Butter
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Lesser x Butter = Blue eye lucy
Who has produced a lucy from butter x lesser ? On ralphs birthing records clutch 18 in 05 he produced a butter lesser cross and it wasnt a Blue eye lucy.
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Re: Lesser/Butter
So is a Platty Daddy actually Het Leucistic Het Dilute? Or is it Het Leucistic Homo Dilute?
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Re: Lesser/Butter
If dilute and lesser are alleles (different mutations of the same gene) I don't think it's technical to refer to a platy as a double het but I can't remember what the right term is for that. Whatever it's called I believe that the platy has one lesser gene and one dilute gene.
I don't believe a platy can be homozygous dilute because the platy/daddy butter was produced without any inbreeding.
If these are all mutations of the same gene then there is only room for two copies of all types in one animal so for example a luecistic could not carry the dilute gene because it would already have two versions that produce a white snake together. The platy would be just another combo of different mutations of this gene like the karma leucistics and perhaps the crystal.
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Re: Lesser/Butter
Wow, ok I can see what you're talking about, but I could never explain it in words either, lol. It's like seeing and describing God!
Okok, how about this: an allele can only be paired, but the lesser gene has two variations instead of one. If a blue eyed leucistic is represented ll and a lesser is represented as Ll, and a normal is represented as LL, then a Platty Daddy is represented as Pl. It's like an interloper, lol. The P is this extra gene that interferes with the l gene. When you breed a Pl to a normal, the outcomes are 50% PL (normal that's connected with the dilute gene) and 50% Ll (Lesser). So, when you breed one of these first generation PL to a lesser, the outcomes are 25% LL (normal), 25% Ll (Lesser), 25% PL (normal w/ dilute), and 25% Pl (Platty Daddy). Does that make sense??
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Re: Lesser/Butter
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I think it is way too late after years of platy breedings for there to still be so much confusion as to the results. I'm going to go out on a limb and say I'm pretty darn sure this theory is right.
I couldn't disagree more.
There's one way to figure it out without question.
Platinum x Normal = 50% Lesser & 50% "Dilute"
"Dilute" x "Dilute" = 25% Normal, 25% "Dilute" and 25% "Super Dilute"
"Super Dilute" x "Super Lesser" = 100% Platty Daddies
Perhaps this has been done and I didn't realize it. But unless/until Platinum's can be produced via this method I don't that we can be so sure.
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Re: Lesser/Butter
Ralph has bred normal Platinum siblings together and got nothing from that pairing. There is no super dilute form. It is really weird how the Platinum gives a gene to the normal appearing sibs to make more Platinums when bred to a Lesser or Butter! Those normals have something special in them and it is not visible. Very confusing I know.
Brock :rockon:
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Re: Lesser/Butter
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I think calling it what it is, is less confusing. It's a co-dom, so think of the BEL as a super lesser.
True, it is co-dominant. However, I don't think 'Super' is an accepted scientific term, but heterozygous is.
Mark
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