Pit Bulls

I don't understand why people go on and on about how horrible pitbulls are. I've met pitbulls before and of all the ones I've met, each and every one of them has been sweet as candy with a loving disposition. Pitbulls are acutally called "Nanny dogs" because they are so great with children. They are protective yes, but with some training, they will understand what is acceptable protection behavior and unacceptable behavior.

We got to babysit a pitbull puppy years ago and she was the cutest thing ever. She was much more well behaved than any of our other dogs. Comparing her to the lab/german shepard mix my brother had a while back, she was the essence of good. Nala, the lab mix bit everyone and my brother ended up having to find her a new home. Today, Paige, the pit puppy is a happy healthy, friendly dog with no bite record and ABSOLUTELY NO aggression issues. This is because she was trained from a young age how to behave.

Its like a child. If you let a child do whatever it wants, don't set rules and guidelines, ect, the child will be horrible. The same goes for any dog. I've been bitten by more small dogs than I have big ones and the only big dog to ever bite me was our rottie, who had an abusive past.

Pitbulls were not bred to fight. Earlier pits were bred to hunt boar. Hunting boar and being bred to fight other dogs are two seperate things. Even people who fight dogs train the dogs to be non-human aggressive.

http://www.workingpitbull.com/images/1sm.jpg Handlers even stay in the rink with these dogs.

Lets see, if your owner put you through all of this.....

http://bahamashumanesociety.com/albu...Bull.sized.jpg
http://www.workingpitbull.com/images/abuse2.jpg
http://www.realpitbull.com/images/skinny.jpg

I think you'd be a little pissed off too.

But, if a dog is brought up right, you can normally expect this...

http://www.workingpitbull.com/images/aaron2.jpg
http://www.pitbullproject.ca/may.jpg
http://www.workingpitbull.com/images/brei300w.jpg
http://img.viacomlocalnetworks.com/i...e_094164315/xl

When it all comes down to it, we as meat-eating animals are all prone to aggression. Its whether or not we keep it in check is what makes the difference. The same goes for ANY dog. With training and a good home, pitbulls can be loving, sweet, loyal, caring, compassionate, and downright wonderful companions. Its the bad things that people tend to focus on just because so many people use pitbulls for wrong purposes. If those owners were to suddenly switch to your beloved lab (who scores lower than the pitbull on the temperment tests) I think people would end up trying to ban those as well.

I think people need to start focusing on the people who can't seem to care for dogs properly and use them for dog fighting rather than the dogs themselves. Take a puppy, put it in the hands of a loving family who will care for it, train it, and love it, chances are, that puppy will grow up to be a irreplaceable member of that family. Take that same puppy, put it in the hands of some low-life looking to make some dollars, that dogs outlook is not so good. I understand that these dogs are not born with a blank slate, but with training, pits are wonderful pets.

So, lets stop bickering about how horrible pits are and take a look around and see what the real problem is. Its not that loyal dog sitting there playing with your children, its the criminals out there fighting dogs.

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Originally Posted by gibbrishclown

Bad analogy, IMO. (not to pick on you :D ) Yes pit bulls were bred to fight back in the day, and are still bred irresponsibly today by the most IGNORANT of thugs and sold to all their buddies as status symbols because these men are generally lacking manhood and need a dog to make up the difference for them. I have 4 female pits/ pitXs in my house and not one of them is inclined to attack ANYTHING! Oops, ok one of the pit mixes will attack rats and gobble them up like skittles or did as a puppy. LOL

I'll concede that a pit and an anaconda will do significant damage, but that is the only thing that gives your analogy any credence what so ever... IMO you can't really compare snakes to dogs... A pit who is unstable is a HUGE danger and a major safety concern. Pits were bred to be dog aggressive though, not human aggressive, and if you study the history a little you'll see that they washed the opponents' dogs before matches and that there were dogmen, not necessarily the owners, in the pits breaking up the fight if a dog fanged or something... if a dog attacked a dogman, it was culled and no decendents were produced... these days thuggish trash breeds FOR those traits and sells the offspring to the dumbest SOBs they can find and guess what?! Someone gets hurt...

Pits aren't more inclined to attack, check out their standings with the American Temperment Testing Society atts.org I believe. They beat out mutts, if I recall correctly.

Unfortunately pits are owned by and large *with glaring and wonderful exceptions* by the WORST dog owners out there... These people have their own theories on how to raise a dog be it simple neglect and a miserable life on a chain, physical abuse, denied socialization, fed gun powder... teased till they bite and then rewarded for it... or some mess with the puppies till the whine and then they beat them for weakness... I've seen pics of bait dogs with no nose who was euthanized just after the evidence photos were taken... dogs with drains running out of them on the mend from the horrors that are dog fighting...

This is not a breed for just anyone. They need to be fully stimulated and socialized. They need to be neutered (IMO) and not faced with excess frustrations like living on a chain etc. You need to be on your A game all the time (esp. at first) as their leader to ensure that when they're too big and strong for you to physically handle that they already understand that they're YOUR SUBORDINATE. You pretty much need to know what you're doing and be responsible... but boy are they worth it! I'm 5'2 and I can walk all four of the dogs ranging from 50-70 pounds (I can't believe the puppy is already 50 pounds OMG she's going to be huge!) The neighbor kids come over and run and play with them. I foster cats and kittens and Proof -the biggest one, my soul mate, from game lines- is the best kitten mommy you've ever seen. I've seen her defend kittens from overzealous dogs as well as just generally nurture kittens, she'll groom them and carry them in her mouth (scary sight, but the only damage is a wet kitten) Matter of fact, Proof has helped break up one huge dog fight and she's also laid out a dog who attacked another one of my dogs and my ex on a walk. She's never drawn blood though... ever. The other day the neighbor kids walked each of the dogs in a rotation around the block (with me there of course!) Their parents have asked that when I replace the fence that I put in a gate so their kids can still come over and play with my pit bulls.

I have sooo much to say on this subject, but I know if I keep going on and on that people will not read my posts LOL, so I'll cut it short (heh)

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I read your whole post, but I still think my analogy of pitbull to toy breed = retic to ball python is a fair one. I understand what all of you pit supporters are saying, but you continue to blindly deny the aggressive instincts and massive power of pits. There are Bigger, stronger dogs out there, but people who want a mean dog or a fighting dog continue to use pit bulls. Why do you think this is?

We do understand that pits are powerful animals. So are people with guns and weapons that could kill hundreds. But, if socialized and trained correctly, pits are more likely to be big sweethearts instead of big killers.

Pit bulls were bred to fight other dogs and not too attack people. Just like someone said a few comments up that the handlers can handle the dogs while they are in hold ect or in the heat of battle without fear of getting bit. And people agressive dogs were shunned and put down and were not tolerated. Bad dogs = bad owners.

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Originally Posted by PythonWallace

I read your whole post, but I still think my analogy of pitbull to toy breed = retic to ball python is a fair one. I understand what all of you pit supporters are saying, but you continue to blindly deny the aggressive instincts and massive power of pits. There are Bigger, stronger dogs out there, but people who want a mean dog or a fighting dog continue to use pit bulls. Why do you think this is?

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They have gained a reputation as a bad ass dog. You don't honestly think they pick them up as puppies and they just grow into this, do you? This is the kind of person that would taunt and torment a dog into aggressive tendencies. Also they're obviously not controlling the dog if they just get out and kill an animal, etc. I stand by the fact that this is proof of bad ownership, and any dog can be goaded into this kind of behavior.

I just don't understand the pitbull-retic thing... One is a mammal with a much more advanced central nervous system, the other is a cold-blooded reptile incapable of emotion.

Id also like to know of any other dog you could handle whole they are fighting without the fear of being bit. They also could be worked on after a fight without the owners having to fear being bitten. Anyone who says pitbulls are some kind of monster arent very educated on the breed.

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Originally Posted by darkangel

They have gained a reputation as a bad ass dog. You don't honestly think they pick them up as puppies and they just grow into this, do you? This is the kind of person that would taunt and torment a dog into aggressive tendencies. Also they're obviously not controlling the dog if they just get out and kill an animal, etc. I stand by the fact that this is proof of bad ownership, and any dog can be goaded into this kind of behavior.

I just don't understand the pitbull-retic thing... One is a mammal with a much more advanced central nervous system, the other is a cold-blooded reptile incapable of emotion.

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I agree completely. You're talking about a highly social animal with a complex hierarchy who is totally capable of being educated, vs. an instinctive and thoughtless eating machine.

I really believe that people who argue against pits are those who've never worked with dogs in large numbers. It's easy to read the media reports and hear the scary stories from my brother's room-mates second cousin's aunt who knew a dog who killed a kid. It's a whole 'nother thing to work with them on a daily basis in situtations where they are distressed, fearful, and in pain.

I have seen a pitbull with a badly broken and unset leg hobble around wagging his tail while a toddler pulled on his ears. I've had pitbulls hit by cars who dragged themselves across the floor on their front legs so they could put their heads in my lap and give kisses. I've seen a dog shot in the face and missing half his jaw who went through months of painful medical treatments, yet still bounded joyfully into the clinic every single visit and wanted nothing more lethal than to see how far he could get his tongue down your ear (gummy kisses from a dog with no teeth feel wieeeeeeerd). I have had dogs come in fresh out of fights with gashes and punctures over their whole bodies, unable to stand or lift their heads, but you can hear that happy tail thumping away on the stretcher. Pits are absolutely the easiest dogs to work with, hands down. No matter what horrible painful treatment you have to put them through, they just keep forgiving you.

These are not vicious dogs...they are incredibly staunch and loving animals, put into bad situations and doing their best to survive whatever indignities people thrust upon them.

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Originally Posted by PythonWallace

I read your whole post, but I still think my analogy of pitbull to toy breed = retic to ball python is a fair one. I understand what all of you pit supporters are saying, but you continue to blindly deny the aggressive instincts and massive power of pits. There are Bigger, stronger dogs out there, but people who want a mean dog or a fighting dog continue to use pit bulls. Why do you think this is?

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I never mentioned toy breeds... I have been bitten by many toy breeds... they tend to be unstable because people treat them like kids or accessories and don't train them properly... or should I say the ones that are nasty are nasty for this reason for the most part.

The only reason I'd "deny" the "aggressive instincts" as you describe them is because I don't see them in the animals that I live with. I've seen pits be dog aggressive... I have a tale about breaking up a 4 pit bull fight in my yard all by my self below... I've heard the tales of killer pits killing kids, maiming people- I get that they can be very aggressive and are extremely powerful! Believe me I get it. I would argue that pound for pound pits are stronger than almost any other breed I'm familiar with... no others are coming to mind right now that are more heavily muscled or capable... I believe they're heavily represented in weight pull competitions as well. I'm only arguing that it's not that the breed itself is more likely to be aggressive by NATURE ONLY... THAT IT'S THE BREED... I believe that they're good for it if that's what you want and make of them and waaay too many people want that and create monsters.

I think they use pits due to the gameness and tenacity... I've seen my Proof continue to play ball with a shard of glass in her foot bleeding EVERYWHERE... She actually has had toenails come off and she runs on the pulp of her nail for weeks afterwards... she's TOUGH AS NAILS! (no pun) The puppy I have can be just whipped around by the bigger dogs, she can be slapped by ignorant people, (her only correction is with a squirt gun!) she doesn't respond to pain as an inhibitor... this is a great trait in a gladiator. They're damn good at what they do when they do attack, absolutely, I won't fight you there...

Dog aggression is one thing that is common in pits... people aggression is not! And here's my anecdote on the subject:

2 years ago on May 1, Corona's 1st birthday, I gave her a ball in the yard, which was foolish to do with my ex's dogs out in the yard. His dogs were both in tact and unstable due to his absence (I'd kicked him out the October before, but housed his dogs till he had a place for them -I burned all his other possessions) and my inability to handle all that was going on at the time. Killian tore into Corona's throat first and I grabbed him off but he reattached to her thigh. He attacked her a lot over food, but I had enough control over him that we all slept in the same bed and I just fed them seperately (there are so many things I was doing wrong then, don't think I don't see that in hind sight :D) Brandy joined in the frey and got right on Corona's throat. Proof grabbed Corona by the scruff of the neck and just started pulling... I was confused, groggy, and quite possibly hung over from the night before, but I laid down on top of Corona. I got hurt, so I started throwing punches... (that only increases the aggression BTW or gets them to turn on you) I got hurt more and they weren't relenting. I stuck my hands in their mouths and tried to make them let go of the puppy... no dice. Finally I used my whole forearm as a break stick and picked Killian up under the belly with his mouth around my arm and I carried him into the house and crated him. He was fine once I got him away from the fight. When I got back outside Proof had Brandy by the throat pinned and Corona was in a heap up against the garage. I got ALL the other dogs in crates and took Corona to the bathroom to clean her up and assess the damage. The water hit my hand where (of all things) Corona had bit through it (I believe she was just closing her eyes and biting at that point and I surely don't blame her) and I knew that she needed to see a vet if I was in such pain, and I'd heard a pop sound when she bit through my hand, so I wanted to get checked out by a doc too... I was fine, a few bruises and some puncture wounds... a new anxiety LOL... Corona is fine today... she got pain meds from the vet and antibiotics... I got saline and hydrogen peroxide (boy did I feel like a sissy when I found out my hand wasn't broken and the popping noise was just her biting through my hand) Point is that if these dogs are the fierce killers everyone says they are, I wouldn't have gotten up from that fight they would have attacked me and killed me... they didn't the only injuries I had were from sticking my hands and arms into the fight and on my back from laying on the puppy... Besides, with Proof being from game lines with an ace for a father (supposedly) shouldn't she have gotten into the fight for blood and not to end it? If their bloodlines are everything why would she break up a fight instead of just getting in it and killing?

"You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to slartibartfast again."



I've worked with dogs quite awhile. I've never been bitten by a pit. Bassetts, Poodles, Beagles, a few Labs and even a Golden Retriever but never a pit.

Too many people base their opinions on what they see in the news room (though how many journalists can identify a pitbull?) instead of hands on experience with these dogs. The bassett bite was one of the worst I had, broke the skin, left a deep dark nasty bruise and put my hand out of commision for awhile. Do I hate bassett hounds now? Of course not. Every dog is an individual.

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Originally Posted by Entropy

"You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to slartibartfast again."



I've worked with dogs quite awhile. I've never been bitten by a pit. Bassetts, Poodles, Beagles, a few Labs and even a Golden Retriever but never a pit.

Too many people base their opinions on what they see in the news room (though how many journalists can identify a pitbull?) instead of hands on experience with these dogs. The bassett bite was one of the worst I had, broke the skin, left a deep dark nasty bruise and put my hand out of commision for awhile. Do I hate bassett hounds now? Of course not. Every dog is an individual.

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Great points!... I got a message telling me I had spread too much reputation for this 24 hour period... didn't know that could happen :D But now I'll have to just post that I like a post rather than spreading rep for the next 24 Heh heh heh :cool: