Disaster!

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Originally Posted by smasharama13

Well I wanted to say something productive to this thread, but after reading all of it, I realized that I would just piss people off arguing about how I think that animal rights activist have gone too far.

I used to wait in the car for my mom while she was in the store. God forbid that you leave a dog in the car now-a-days.

Thanks guys, I love the freedom I just got done fighting for be taken away from me. Oh, wait that was so that 10% of the people could protest and make more regulations for the other 90% and feel good because now the rats are treated more humanly.





BTW I just got out of the Army, where I spent 5 out of the last 8 years not in this country.

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You've said nothing. Say what you mean, and mean what you say. Some people won't like it (including me I'm sure by your cryptic tiptoeing). Kids shouldn't be left alone in a car, dogs shouldn't be left alone in a car. There is a big difference between animal rights activists (the PETA type) and people who think animals deserve to be treated with respect. I personally think the punishment for animal abuse isn't nearly harsh enough. You mentioned your service for this country twice in the post but I don't see the relevance.

"animal rights activist"???? Sorry dear but PETA would burn me at the stake since I keep 15 snakes and 75+ rats/mice in cages and "force" them to breed. I prefer to think of myself as an animal welfare advocate if any silly label needs be applied. Since I choose to have living animals and choose to put sexually mature creatures together with the aim of reproduction then I just feel it's incumbent upon me to see to their best interests. Not only for the creatures involved but in the case of our breeder/feeder rat colony, it's just good business. Good care/housing leads to healthy breeding stock and therefore more and healthier litters of feeders produced. When it comes to domesticated pets, they deserve as much or more. They are bred as companion animals and often are highly bonded to their humans and very dependent on us. They deserve a level of care that I didn't see exhibited here, so I spoke up and I'll likely do it again. :)

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Originally Posted by smasharama13

Well I wanted to say something productive to this thread, but after reading all of it, I realized that I would just piss people off arguing about how I think that animal rights activist have gone too far.

I used to wait in the car for my mom while she was in the store. God forbid that you leave a dog in the car now-a-days.

Thanks guys, I love the freedom I just got done fighting for be taken away from me. Oh, wait that was so that 10% of the people could protest and make more regulations for the other 90% and feel good because now the rats are treated more humanly.





BTW I just got out of the Army, where I spent 5 out of the last 8 years not in this country.

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I understood it. And thank you for serving.

I don't know why you all insist on using common sense and freedoms when there is a perfectly good ZT bandwagon to jump on!

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Originally Posted by jglass38

You've said nothing. Say what you mean, and mean what you say. Some people won't like it (including me I'm sure by your cryptic tiptoeing). Kids shouldn't be left alone in a car, dogs shouldn't be left alone in a car. There is a big difference between animal rights activists (the PETA type) and people who think animals deserve to be treated with respect. I personally think the punishment for animal abuse isn't nearly harsh enough. You mentioned your service for this country twice in the post but I don't see the relevance.

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OK then, here I go.

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Originally Posted by jglass38

You were mad at the cat for doing what comes naturally? Then you punished the cat by throwing it out in freezing cold weather.

Let me be direct, concise and to the point: You should not have the right to own a pet. Not now, not ever. I am starting to believe psychological evaluation is needed before owning a pet or having a child. Un-friggin-believable!

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Firstly, I hope when your kids, if you have any, come up and tell you something or you catch them being bad, that you don't blow up on them like you did this poster.


Cat's are outside animals which people keep inside. We take away the freedom that they naturally and instinctively have, there for putting a cat outside (unless you live in a place like Montana or places in Canada where it get to be like -30 deg. or in a metropolitan or other large city) and even making it stay there is not a problem. I personally don't and probably wouldn't own a cat.



Rats are barley able to be considered as pet creatures, but they are. I think that having a few (non pet) feeder rats, (even before you know the size so assume it's a normal rat) in an environment that might not be quite a comfortable and optimal as a large cage in no problem at all.

Additionally you all snapped on this person without first getting more accurate details.

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Originally Posted by jglass38

Its the punishing of the cat I take issue with.

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Was it punishment, or are you the one over reacting? Here's an example of something that happened to me the other day.

My darn dogs got into the trash yesterday. I was so mad at them. I put them outside for like 3 hours and it was sooo cold.

Am I cruel for making them stay outside? No!

Now the exact same scenario with a little more detail........... When I came home after being gone for about 6 hours, I found that the darn dogs got into the trash (something they haven't done in a really long time). Was I angry, yes. I put the dogs out into the fenced yard, one to get them out of my way while I cleaned and two for them to go to the bathroom. After I got everything picked up about 10 minutes later, I went to let the dogs in and they were having so much fun running around playing in the cold rain that they didn't want to come in. I checked on them every 30 minutes or so and they finally decided it was time to come in after about 3 hours.



You see the difference in the way I worded this and how you felt when you read each example?

I don't think Wolf was really thinking about what she wrote about the cat, but was more focused on the fact that it knocked down and broke that rat tank.

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Originally Posted by jglass38

Jeez, was I too harsh? I never do that! :D

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This looks to me like it regularly makes your day when you make others feel like they are 2 feet tall. Since this is only what I read and how I interpret your words, I really don't know. If these words were spoken, I could further get the emotions from your tone and understand more your meaning.





Since returning from Korea in November, I've seen this show on the TV called ASPC Huston/Phoenix. They get way carried away on that show, to go so far as to take an animal from it's albeit irresponsible owner and then simply put the animal down because they feel like it can't be adopted out as a safe animal. Sometimes they take the animals away for some really bad reasons, and sometime the animals are really being abused. What's worse, being dead or not being groomed? I just hope that my tax dollars are going to something a little more productive to man kind than having people go around confiscating animals just to put them down.

the #3, and #4 posts in this thread reminded me of this show. If you can't be responsible, then we're going to kill your animals kind of thing. After reading your responses to my first post, I guess you're not quite like that.

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Originally Posted by smasharama13

OK then, here I go.




Firstly, I hope when your kids, if you have any, come up and tell you something or you catch them being bad, that you don't blow up on them like you did this poster.

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You could bet I would discipline them properly. Kids need direction and occassionally to be smacked when they aren't listening. Unfortunately what was perfectly ok in the past (disciplining your child) is now considered abusive and invites stares from strangers and most likely a call to child services.

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Cat's are outside animals which people keep inside. We take away the freedom that they naturally and instinctively have, there for putting a cat outside (unless you live in a place like Montana or places in Canada where it get to be like -30 deg. or in a metropolitan or other large city) and even making it stay there is not a problem. I personally don't and probably wouldn't own a cat.

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Cats are domesticated animals and wonderful pets. They are as sensitive to abuse/neglect as man's best friend. You not owning a cat wouldn't allow you to know that. The original poster threw her cat outside in the cold for doing something that came naturally and instinctually to it. There is a big difference in disciplining a child as a means to change behavior patterns. and punishing an animal for following its instinct.

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Rats are barley able to be considered as pet creatures, but they are. I think that having a few (non pet) feeder rats, (even before you know the size so assume it's a normal rat) in an environment that might not be quite a comfortable and optimal as a large cage in no problem at all.

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Why are rats barely able to be considered pet creatures? Because you say so? I (and a lot of others) believe them to be among the best small animal pets that you can have. They are smart, interesting, friendly creatures.

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My darn dogs got into the trash yesterday. I was so mad at them. I put them outside for like 3 hours and it was sooo cold.

Am I cruel for making them stay outside? No!

Now the exact same scenario with a little more detail........... When I came home after being gone for about 6 hours, I found that the darn dogs got into the trash (something they haven't done in a really long time). Was I angry, yes. I put the dogs out into the fenced yard, one to get them out of my way while I cleaned and two for them to go to the bathroom. After I got everything picked up about 10 minutes later, I went to let the dogs in and they were having so much fun running around playing in the cold rain that they didn't want to come in. I checked on them every 30 minutes or so and they finally decided it was time to come in after about 3 hours.


You see the difference in the way I worded this and how you felt when you read each example?

I don't think Wolf was really thinking about what she wrote about the cat, but was more focused on the fact that it knocked down and broke that rat tank.

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Its not MY job to interpret people's posts. I read it the same as others did and came to the same conclusion. Maybe she should have been more clear. I still would have felt that it was cruel.

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This looks to me like it regularly makes your day when you make others feel like they are 2 feet tall. Since this is only what I read and how I interpret your words, I really don't know. If these words were spoken, I could further get the emotions from your tone and understand more your meaning.

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Think what you want. People need to be responsible for things they say or type. I react the way I feel at the time. Not everyone likes me or my style. That is really ok though! :D

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Since returning from Korea in November, I've seen this show on the TV called ASPC Huston/Phoenix. They get way carried away on that show, to go so far as to take an animal from it's albeit irresponsible owner and then simply put the animal down because they feel like it can't be adopted out as a safe animal. Sometimes they take the animals away for some really bad reasons, and sometime the animals are really being abused. What's worse, being dead or not being groomed? I just hope that my tax dollars are going to something a little more productive to man kind than having people go around confiscating animals just to put them down.

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So its ok to leave animals in abusive homes rather than take them out of the situation and try to rehabilitate them and find them GOOD homes? Sounds like they are doing a really horrible thing! :confused: Sometimes animals are not adoptable after years of abuse and neglect and must be put to sleep. Yes that is absolutely better for them.

The problem is that you don't have a lot of experience with shelters, rescues and seeing animal abuse/neglect firsthand. I do. I've spent the better part of my life working with animals in one way or another. I grew up with many cats and dogs, fish, small animals and reptiles in the house. I have worked at animal shelters and did years of volunteer work with a rescue organization that my mother ran. I have also worked for years at pet stores trying to educate people before they purchase animals. I have seen the cruelty that humans have put animals through and it disgusts me. I react strongly to it.

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the #3, and #4 posts in this thread reminded me of this show. If you can't be responsible, then we're going to kill your animals kind of thing. After reading your responses to my first post, I guess you're not quite like that.

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Correct! If you don't take proper care of your animals, they should be taken away. If it is determined that you were cruel to the animals you should go to prison and be barred from every owning an animal again. The problem is that our country is too lenient on animal abusers. Animals rely upon us for care, love and companionship. Those who betray that deserve the worst punishment possible.

Jamie has said everything I would have.
Thank you for saving me the time.

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Originally Posted by joyful girl

Jamie has said everything I would have.
Thank you for saving me the time.

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No problem! :D

Well, you are correct in the fact that I have never worked first hand in a rescue situation. I do too feel that there should be more harsh punishments for "abuse". I also think that one persons views on what is to be considered abuse is not the same as the next. I think there should be harsher punishments for all types of crimes like theft, murder and sexual crimes to name a few, but my ideals of what should be the appropriate punishment would be regarded by many as inhumane.

I do hope, now that every ones rats, cats, dogs, snakes and what ever other pets they have are being treated good, and I hope that Wolf has learned from what ever it is that went wrong.

I guess in the heat of the moment, we all make bad decisions. Lets just hope that the consequences of those decisions don't lead to others suffering from them.


Good day to you all.

Well, I bought a 2 story wire cage with tubes, a wheel, ect. The rats love it! I also put up a barracade so the cat can't get to the cage, let alone knock it over. SO everyone is safe and content...




All this fuss....geezzzz......