Boas and hides

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Originally Posted by martin82531

Would you still say rat pups or would a small rat be appropriate?


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at 420 grams 10% is 42g and 15% is 63g this is the rule for BP however I have found that the girth is still about right for boas as they get older 20-25% their weight the girth is better but with her on the small side i would stick to small rats until she starts gaining

Rats:
	Age	Weight	Length*	Equivalent
Rat Pinkies	1-6 days	3-8 grams	1-2"	Mouse Fuzzie
Rat Fuzzies	7-13 days	9-20 grams	2-2.5"	Hopper or Weaned Mice
Rat Pups	2-3 weeks	21-30 grams	2.5-3.5"	Large Mouse
Weaned Rats	3-4 weeks	31-45 grams	3.5-4.5"	X-Large Mouse
Small Rats	4-6 weeks	46-79 grams	4.5-6"
Medium Rats	6-8 weeks	80-149 grams	6-8"
Large Rats	8-10 weeks	150-265 grams	8-9"	1/2 lb Rabbit

This is the chart I use to gauge size of the rats and small rats would put her right in the ideal range unless you notice a large lump which I don't expect you will until her girth is larger and you start dealing with medium and large rats that where the weight gaps are larger

All four of my boas have hides. The Dumerils and Costa Rican BCI use them only when in shed and occassionally when digesting.
The Madagascar Ground Boa and Tarahumara BCI use them most of the time, and they are the two biggest of the group...

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Originally Posted by martin82531

Would you still say rat pups or would a small rat be appropriate?


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Yes, I think rat pups are appropriate. Smaller is better with boas.

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Originally Posted by DrDooLittle

Eyeball the rat, eyeball your snake, and as long as it won't leave a noticeable lump, you are good to go.

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With boas, you will do better if the prey size does not leave a noticable lump. I think a small rat would be too large for her. She will get big enough soon enough.

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Originally Posted by Dark Lady Kat

That is why I thought she was underfed if she was just a year old 400ish is small but not a concern but at almost 2 years old I figured she is only about half the size she should be even on a small side. I agree she does look good but although she may be healthy she may have not grown to where she needs to be due to the decrease in food from the feeding schedule the previous owner / breeder went months without feeding her. [/COLOR]

You are by far more experienced than I Evenstar and I assumed you had missed that she was almost 2 years old that is the only reason I made the recommendation I did

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No worries - I can understand why you thought what you thought. But be careful - boas do not need to be any certain size by any certain age so long as they are eating well, gaining at least a small bit of weight, shedding regularly, and have good body condition. There is no evidence that the previous owner went months without feeding this snake just because the "feeding chart" doesn't have those entries. Her body condition is too good to have gone months with no food at her age. Even if she DID go months with no food, that is all the more reason to keep her food items small!!

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Originally Posted by Dark Lady Kat

at [COLOR=#333333] 420 grams 10% is 42g and 15% is 63g this is the rule for BP however I have found that the girth is still about right for boas as they get older 20-25% their weight the girth is better but with her on the small side i would stick to small rats until she starts gaining.

This is the chart I use to gauge size of the rats and small rats would put her right in the ideal range unless you notice a large lump which I don't expect you will until her girth is larger and you start dealing with medium and large rats that where the weight gaps are larger

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Those percentages are ok for ball pythons and most other pythons - NOT for boas. Please understand, boas are NOT balls. They have slower metabolisms, more sensitive digestion, different body types. Percentages used for pythons should not be applied to boas. Here are a few quotes from Gus Rentro of Rio Bravo Reptiles. Gus, along with Vin Russo who wrote, "The Complete Boa Constrictor" (which I highly recommend any new boa owner buy and read completely), is one of the foremost authorities on the captive raising and rearing of Boa Constrictors in the US.
http://www.riobravoreptiles.com/care_raisingboas.htm


"How often do I feed my boas?"
Inexplicably, there still exists a lot of confusion about how much and how often snakes should be fed. Feed a growing red-tail as often as it will take food but wait until all signs of the previous feeding have gone. In other words, don't feed it if it is still bloated with the last meal. Depending upon the temperature cycle it is in and the size of the prey item this can take from 6-15 days. If unsure, wait another day or two. It is a practical impossibility to underfeed a normal healthy boa kept in the proper conditions. Many people find it entirely effortless to overfeed theirs! The single most frequently identifiable factor in premature death, poor fertility and other problems with captive boa, especially red-tails, is obesity resulting from over feeding.

Overfeeding, feeding too frequently and feeding prey items too large can often sicken or even kill a red-tail. As will excessively high or low temps during digestion. Apparently a cycle of overfeeding sets up a condition of sensitivity or imbalance in the boa's digestive tract. Contents from the lower digestive tract may also get into the stomach during movement or handling if the meals are too large or too frequent. Regurgitation exacerbates this condition. It has also been suggested that sensitivity to domestic rodent hair sometimes develops in red-tails. The first sign of either of these conditions is usually regurgitation but can also be listlessness, refusal of food, restlessness or any combination of those symptoms. In addition to the risk of sickness or death, overfed, power-fed and overweight adult red-tails have repeatedly shown diminished breeding behavior and fertility. Properly conditioned animals are a must for breeding. I need also say that firm muscular red-tails and other boas demonstrating varied scale sizes, textures and iridescence are objects of splendid beauty far more wonderful than the simple spectacle of a huge fat boa. ~ Gus Rentfro, Rio Bravo Reptiles

I hope this helps the op and anyone else reading this thread to make proper decisions on feeding their boas. This information is never intended to insult - only to inform. :gj:

Thank you for everyone's help!

@Evenstar - no insult taken, not even remotely close. Thank you for the suggestion on the book, I did go ahead and pick it up, it will be here on Tuesday. For the time being I think I will go with a 10 day schedule with rat pups. Thank you for al your advice, much appreciated.


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I'm glad you got the book! You will really enjoy it - it is very informative on all levels. There's some really nice pictures of the various localities too which is nice. :gj:

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Originally Posted by Evenstar

I hope this helps the op and anyone else reading this thread to make proper decisions on feeding their boas. This information is never intended to insult - only to inform. :gj:

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I don't ever take any info from you as an insult it is always good to learn more I have found in weighing and measuring out the rats by girth and weight that the 10-15% rule for balls transfers by girth only on the smaller ones once you hit medium and up on rats the girth is smaller but the weight is larger because of the length leading to a 20-25% weight ratio. I am working on an average comparison chart for weight to girth since I couldn't find one the task is a bit daunting but in the end hopefully will prove to be more helpful I am going to average out ten litters of rats measuring girth every week and weight to determine category that the girth applies to.

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Originally Posted by martin82531

Thank you for everyone's help!

@Evenstar - no insult taken, not even remotely close. Thank you for the suggestion on the book, I did go ahead and pick it up, it will be here on Tuesday. For the time being I think I will go with a 10 day schedule with rat pups. Thank you for al your advice, much appreciated.


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It is a great book it is a long read though I am just getting started on a cover to cover read of it I only got mine in the mail 3 days ago

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Originally Posted by Dark Lady Kat

I don't ever take any info from you as an insult it is always good to learn more I have found in weighing and measuring out the rats by girth and weight that the 10-15% rule for balls transfers by girth only on the smaller ones once you hit medium and up on rats the girth is smaller but the weight is larger because of the length leading to a 20-25% weight ratio. I am working on an average comparison chart for weight to girth since I couldn't find one the task is a bit daunting but in the end hopefully will prove to be more helpful I am going to average out ten litters of rats measuring girth every week and weight to determine category that the girth applies to.

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Sounds good! And you're lucky - you can do this since you breed your own rats. Since I buy mine f/t, I just have to eye-ball them. I could weigh them of course, but when you're feeding 8 boas all banging away at their tubs wanting their rats NOW, well, you get 'em out and get 'em fed. LoL! :D