Who owns guns and you carry?

Ruger SR22. I love this gun, I carry it everywhere .

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/02/13/ruqeqy5a.jpg

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Originally Posted by Rob

Here is where civilians carrying firearms around town can get dicey. Law enforcement are trained in progression of force. Firing a weapon being the last possible step. Joe blow down the street see's a guy running off with his neighbors tv and shoots him in the back. Joe blow is going to jail.

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Then Joe Blow deserves jail because Joe is an idiot. Joe had an obligation to use reasonable force and he didn't. What Joe did should not affect my right to carry a gun.

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Originally Posted by sho220

Then Joe Blow deserves jail because Joe is an idiot. Joe had an obligation to use reasonable force and he didn't. What Joe did should not affect my right to carry a gun.

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Agreed. See my above post. Someone carrying doesn't bother me any. I just said it can get dicey with civilians making calls on when to shoot especially when it's not self defense.

just my point oh two.

anti firearms people look at the pro-gun people in kind of the same way anti snake people look at us. they dont understand it, and they may never will. not growing up around guns they only see the bad things that happen with them (the only things that make the news.. kinda like with snakes huh?) they never expierenced things like getting up at 3:30 in the mornin with dad, hitting the woods and getting your first buck. thats one of the very few distinct memories i have from my childhood. i dont think having guns in your house makes it any less safe. i grew up around them and from a very young age i knew what they were and they were absolutely off limits, as did my siblings. i feel most of the freak accidents are from where young ones did not know what they were and were curious.

another distinct memory i have was going out to the shooting range with my uncle to shoot off his colection, including assault rifles. when used properly, these things can be such an exciting experience and a joy to handle (such as.. maybe keeping hots?).

if you had grown up with snakes and some of your fondest memories are times with someone in your family working with reptiles, you would get defensive if someone talked about taking away your babies.

just as people outside the community may think people are crazy for keeping "dangerous," or even venomous snakes, anti-gun people will never understand why we feel we have a RIGHT to keep our guns.

i dont look down on people for thinking im crazy for keeping snakes, because they simply dont understand.. just as i understand how someone would think i'm crazy for loving firearms.. because they've only seen the bad. they dont understand it's some people's way of life.

I have made that connection with a buddy of mine who is huge into his guns. Lol he still thinks I'm nuts for liking snakes.

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Originally Posted by Rob

I have made that connection with a buddy of mine who is huge into his guns. Lol he still thinks I'm nuts for liking snakes.

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exactly. and no matter how hard you might want to change someones view, they may just never understand. if more people atleast tried to understand where other people came from, the world would be a better place. just because you may not agree with someone elses views on something, doesnt mean you shouldnt atleast try to respect them and understand where they came from and how they think.

Right now I just have a Mossberg 500 12g. Concealed carry is not legal in Illinois yet. Federal court ruled it unconstitutional and ordered IL to come up with a bill regarding that. It's a good way through its process, which is supposed to be finalized sometime this year. Sooooooo... soon I will be carrying. Until then, it's my benchmade 557 and 13 years of karate competition as my EDC ;)

Can we not use my name with idiots? Im beginning to feel bad :( tLets say any Tom D!ck or Harry. That's better.

Ruger mark ii target .22
Getting:
S&W m&p sheild .40 for cc
Glock 26 for 2nd cc

Eventually a 1911 for open carry.

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Had a CC years ago, carried a SW mod 27 at the time, (stainless, 4" barrel) and usually had an 870 with me, (bird gun, 12ga, 28" modified choke). No need for the CC these days, and I'm too old for duck hunting, so nowadays I have an old Savage 20ga/.22 mag over/under for home defense. Also have an old Ithaca .22 lever gun for plinking.

S

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Originally Posted by MrLang

Going to preface this post by saying I'm not here to troll, talk bad about your right to carry, or any of that. For whatever record, I do believe people have the right to carry if they decide they want to. I am just here to gain a better personal understanding of your decisions.


What does this mean? Do you feel there are times you need a gun but don't have one? Have you or anyone you have ever known ever had a need for a firearm at your hip? Can you describe the situation if it's not too personal?

I guess I would extend this question to everyone here who carries regularly. Though it is statistically insignificant the amount of times a violent break-in happens to an otherwise law abiding citizen while they are home, I can understand why people keep them for home protection. I can definitely understand why people keep them for sport.

They say you shouldn't pull a gun on someone unless you plan to use it. I'm not formally asking this question because I'm sure you will all say there would be no hesitation, but would you really shoot someone down if they weren't going to take your life? The follow up question is this: do you find yourself in situations where a complete stranger would make a decision to take your life? I've lived in poor neighborhoods before in the US and in more dangerous countries and can say it is going to be a hard sell if you tell me you live in a bad neighborhood and that's why you think someone will kill you on the street. The biggest risk you have is losing your wallet and having to call the bank to cancel your cards.

Again, not coming here to stir things up, etc, and none of you have to reply / I don't want to fully derail your thread. If anyone feels compelled to address this stuff in a calm, logical, and reasonable manor citing real knowledge I would be very interested in the response.

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Actually, I used to carry at all times and then one day I asked myself pretty much these same questions. Of course, when I asked them of myself they weren't nearly as articulate :)

It had been suggested several times by friends/family that I get a cc and learn to shoot because I spend a lot of time alone, I'm not very big, and I'm pretty trusting and friendly. I always said that I would never do it because I know myself well enough to know that I wouldn't shoot someone under any circumstances, I'd rather be a victim as sad as that sounds. Then the jewelry store I work at was robbed in a particularly disgusting way and my opinion changed. I suddenly became sure that I could shoot someone if I "needed" to because the world is better off without certain people anyway. So I got a cc, learned to shoot, and started carrying every day.

I gradually started carrying less and less because my gun was too heavy to cart around all the time and when I practiced at the range it seemed to jam fairly frequently, so I kept it in my car instead of on my person. One day my boyfriend asked me why I hadn't been carrying it with me and suggested that we buy me a new one if that one was a problem. At that point, the thought of carrying a gun all the time again kind of bothered me. I'm not sure why. I just asked myself to try to think of a couple of real life scenarios where there was a real chance that it would save me. I couldn't come up with one. If someone grabs me on the street, what are the odds that I'm going to be able to get it out and fire (especially in the midst of an unexpected struggle)? If I'm at a light and someone tries to steal my car, am I going to shoot them? No way, I'm going to give them my car. I'm not saying you should, just that that's how I am.

Really, the only legitimate scenario I could come up with where I may "need" a firearm and am confident that I could get to it, and am confident that I would use it would be in the case of someone coming into my home with intent of causing me great harm/death. So I don't carry anymore, but I do have two hand guns in separate rooms of my house where I could get to one regardless of which end of the house I'm on.

I'm not opposed to people carrying guns if they want to. Personally, I take the "right" to take another person's life VERY seriously and I'm just not sure I could handle having to make that decision, especially in a split second. So in my case, I'm probably further ahead to just not carry a gun.

If I eventually think of a logical reason that I should carry, then I will.

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Originally Posted by Rob

Ride with a cop for the day.

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Rob is WAY better at context clues than Mike!

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Originally Posted by OsirisRa32

Meh...if we used the death penalty more often maybe there wouldnt be so many criminals...../stirringthepot

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How about just speed up death row.................. I'm tired of paying for the walking dead and my dead-beat dad;)

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Originally Posted by MrLang

It is statistical FACT that your children's safety is compromised by your decision to keep guns under their roof. Next time you buy them a Happy Meal with a gun in the car, don't ask yourself which one might be bad for your kid, ask yourself which one is worse.

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Actually that fact only holds true in households where a firearm is hidden from children in an unsecure location and the child finds it.
I do not see a reason why you shouldn't show your children firearm safety and take them to the range or hunting with you.

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Originally Posted by Rob

Here is where civilians carrying firearms around town can get dicey. Law enforcement are trained in progression of force. Firing a weapon being the last possible step. Joe blow down the street see's a guy running off with his neighbors tv and shoots him in the back. Joe blow is going to jail.

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Crook running away could be let go or chased down depending on the situation but not a life threatening situation. Crook within 10 feet or so could be viewed either way. Crook with hands in pants or pockets is DRT (dead right there).
Texas laws allow me to protect me, my family, my property and now even my neighbors with deadly force if needed.

Everyone like to say there is due process and civilians should be judge but no one wants to pay for all the deadbeats in prison. I for one am tired of being a victim of everyone else's criminals. That is a whole different debate though.

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Originally Posted by KMG

If someone was to rob me I would not hesitate to shoot them. There is no guarantee that the robber will not hurt or kill you if you fully cooperate. I would like to make sure they never get the chance to harm me or anybody else ever again. I carry a pocket pistol next to my wallet so it appears I'm giving it up, but surprise.

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Get your facts straight Lang. I clearly used the word ROB in my original comment. You twisted it to pickpocket like a five cent attorney. So good day to you.

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Originally Posted by Rob

Correction- it was Texas so the guy walked.
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/t/story?id...261806%2Cd.b2I

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He walked because he did nothing wrong. In Texas you have the right to use force, including deadly force, to protect your property and your neighbors. I would take Joe Horn as a neighbor any day. I love Texas!


I have worked way to hard to have nice things to have a jobless low life come and take them. Burglars and robbers have made the decision to commit crimes that could get them killed or sent to prison. Its their choice they made. Why is the responsibility be placed on the victim for choosing not to be a victim.

Your stats are also rubbish. So 90+% are non violent. Just because an actual physical injury was not sustained does not mean trauma was not experienced. Meeting victims that have only had a gun or knife pulled on them has taught me this. So the weapon was not used on them, the situation still leaves a mark on the persons soul. Many people experience PTSD after becoming a victim.

I can attest that having knives, razors, clubs, and guns pulled on you is not something everybody can deal with. I have been through all of those and was even hit by a car once by a fleeing suspect. No Lang I did not shoot or kill him, I chased him down and put him in jail. Going through these things has given me a better understanding of what a victim feels that many can not understand until they too become a victim.


Rob, this was not directed at you. I only wanted to reference the link you added.

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Originally Posted by KMG

He walked because he did nothing wrong. In Texas you have the right to use force, including deadly force, to protect your property and your neighbors. I would take Joe Horn as a neighbor any day. I love Texas!.

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While yes you have every right to defend yourself, this does not fall under that category. The police dispatcher told him not to pursue and no stolen property is worth shooting someone over. This old man decided to ignore those orders and shot them in the back while fleeing, he was in no danger what so ever. Yes they are scum bags, and should be put in jail for a while but not killed. That is a huge problem in Texas, shoot first think later. That type of thinking will lead to innocent people killed.

Ps- Just so we are clear I'm for people being able to own and carry, as I own myself. Just in this particular instance, I think it was a bad shot.

Dispatchers are civilians. They are told to say things that keep the area they work for out of trouble. They give the P.C. responses and can not order anybody to do anything.

I realize you are pro gun. Was not trying to say you weren't.


I just know how little these low lifes value your and my life so I value theirs the same.

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Originally Posted by KMG

Dispatchers are civilians.

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Most of the time, then again sometimes it's an officer getting some sweet OT ;)

Well when I turn 21 im definitely getting a handgun. But no cc for me. My county will probably not give me one. I think theres 3 people with a cc permit lol.

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Originally Posted by Rob

Most of the time, then again sometimes it's an officer getting some sweet OT ;)

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Neither the city or the county does that near Houston, and I don't know of anybody that does. Maybe some really small departmens. Its not like Super Troopers, great movie. I know I wouldn't want to do it, its hard work.

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Originally Posted by KMG

Neither the city or the county does that near Houston, and I don't know of anybody that does. Maybe some really small departmens. Its not like Super Troopers, great movie. I know I wouldn't want to do it, its hard work.

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We do up in ct. Dispatchers call out, go on vacation. Or if a officer is on light duty for whatever reason, they can get stuck in there.

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Originally Posted by Rob

We do up in ct. Dispatchers call out, go on vacation. Or if a officer is on light duty for whatever reason, they can get stuck in there.

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Yikes, I'm glad we don't. I know some dispatchers and I can promise you that it can be an endless job some nights.

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Originally Posted by KMG

He walked because he did nothing wrong. In Texas you have the right to use force, including deadly force, to protect your property and your neighbors. I would take Joe Horn as a neighbor any day. I love Texas!

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This is the attitude that scares me a bit.

I don't think anyone should have the right to protect property by the use of deadly force, EVER. It's stuff VS someone's life. That someone may be a criminal, but if your life is not in danger, and you see this guy walking away with some of your stuff, you should go to prison for a long, long time if you shoot him.

If you feel like your are in grave danger, then that is a different story.. but just property.. just materialistic stuff?

No. Way.

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Originally Posted by CatandDiallo

This is the attitude that scares me a bit.

I don't think anyone should have the right to protect property by the use of deadly force, EVER. It's stuff VS someone's life. That someone may be a criminal, but if your life is not in danger, and you see this guy walking away with some of your stuff, you should go to prison for a long, long time if you shoot him.

If you feel like your are in grave danger, then that is a different story.. but just property.. just materialistic stuff?

No. Way.

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If I broke into your house, prove to me you life is not in danger;)

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Originally Posted by PitOnTheProwl

If I broke into your house, prove to me you life is not in danger;)

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I get the impression that there are a few people in on this conversation who believe a person should be shot for stealing your stuff, period. Yes, you can say that if someone is in your home, you don't KNOW that your life isn't in danger, and that is absolutely true, you really don't know. But I don't think that's where she was going with her comment. I think she was talking about the attitude that someone deserves to die simply for being a criminal.

If you think it's ok to shoot someone over a tv, that's your opinion and you're not alone. Just don't hide that opinion under the guise that you'd shoot this person stealing your tv because you "can't be 100% positive your life isn't in danger."

PS- Those are general "you", not YOU, Pit on the Prowl.

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Originally Posted by CatandDiallo

This is the attitude that scares me a bit.

I don't think anyone should have the right to protect property by the use of deadly force, EVER. It's stuff VS someone's life. That someone may be a criminal, but if your life is not in danger, and you see this guy walking away with some of your stuff, you should go to prison for a long, long time if you shoot him.

If you feel like your are in grave danger, then that is a different story.. but just property.. just materialistic stuff?

No. Way.

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Originally Posted by BrandiR

I get the impression that there are a few people in on this conversation who believe a person should be shot for stealing your stuff, period. Yes, you can say that if someone is in your home, you don't KNOW that your life isn't in danger, and that is absolutely true, you really don't know. But I don't think that's where she was going with her comment. I think she was talking about the attitude that someone deserves to die simply for being a criminal.

If you think it's ok to shoot someone over a tv, that's your opinion and you're not alone. Just don't hide that opinion under the guise that you'd shoot this person stealing your tv because you "can't be 100% positive your life isn't in danger."

PS- Those are general "you", not YOU, Pit on the Prowl.

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I agree to an extent. The gray area comes in when that "property" is a living being. For example... someone breaking in to steal our snakes, or stealing livestock, etc. Animals are considered property by law, but they aren't a lifeless piece of plastic or metal that can easily be replaced, they are living breathing beings. I'm not sure I would want to shoot someone in the process of stealing an animal (I would be concerned about the animal being injured in the process), but I do think something more than just letting them walk should be allowed, legally speaking. I don't know what, but something.

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Originally Posted by sorraia

I agree to an extent. The gray area comes in when that "property" is a living being. For example... someone breaking in to steal our snakes, or stealing livestock, etc. Animals are considered property by law, but they aren't a lifeless piece of plastic or metal that can easily be replaced, they are living breathing beings. I'm not sure I would want to shoot someone in the process of stealing an animal (I would be concerned about the animal being injured in the process), but I do think something more than just letting them walk should be allowed, legally speaking. I don't know what, but something.

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I don't think anyone should ever be allowed to walk if caught committing a crime. If less kids were given a slap on the wrist for their teenage nonsense, we'd have fewer adult criminals. We're WAY too lenient on criminals.

As for stealing animals, that's a different story. A life is clearly in danger, even if not human. Would I personally shoot someone to save a snake or a dog? Uh, no. But some people are more passionate about animals than I am. When I use the word "property" I mean inanimate objects, not a living anything.

If yall only knew what kind of people these are committing these crimes I think you would feel different. You are normal and rational, thinking these people are the same, they are not. You can bet that they would take your life over property. Sometimes they do while stealing it. Its not theirs to start with but they are willing to kill for it. I just think if its that important they should be willing to die for it themselves while trying to take it.

Another issue they cause is higher property insurance. Everything that is stolen and damaged is replaced by insurance. No big deal until you realize that everybody paying for insurance is paying higher premiums because the insurance company has to make up for losses and charges us to do it. Nothing is free unless your a criminal. Even when they go to prison we are flipping the bill for their food, lights, clothes, medical, tv, ac/heat. We are never done paying for them and their poor choices.

I get tired of finding people in their mid twenties with over thirty arrest, sometimes including one or two homicides and they are out walking the streets. Those kind of people are just not needed in society.

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Originally Posted by KMG

I get tired of finding people in their mid twenties with over thirty arrest, sometimes including one or two homicides and they are out walking the streets. Those kind of people are just not needed in society.

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Sounds like the bad neighbor I had! After she was arrested (and released the next day... prisons and jails are too over-crowded to hold them, so they get released to commit more crimes!) I was able to get her full name and look up her record. 30 years old and had a 10 year criminal history, including multiple felonies. Most were drug-related (possession, cultivating marijuana), but others included identity theft, check fraud and forgery, and DUI. The other stellar individuals arrested on that property during the time had similar records. I collected over 20 license plate numbers which I gave to the police, and at least 5 or 6 of those included stolen vehicles. Other stolen property was found on the premises after each arrest. This is a big reason I want to move out of this state. These kinds of creeps are being released by the hundreds from state prisons and county jails.

- - - Updated - - -

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Originally Posted by BrandiR

I don't think anyone should ever be allowed to walk if caught committing a crime. If less kids were given a slap on the wrist for their teenage nonsense, we'd have fewer adult criminals. We're WAY too lenient on criminals.

As for stealing animals, that's a different story. A life is clearly in danger, even if not human. Would I personally shoot someone to save a snake or a dog? Uh, no. But some people are more passionate about animals than I am. When I use the word "property" I mean inanimate objects, not a living anything.

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Need to get the laws changed then, since animals are legally considered "property" the same as inanimate objects. :(

When I first posed my question I thought there would be one of 3 responses:

1. To carry your toys around with you to show off to the other boys and compare muzzle lengths

2. Because you live an exceptionally dangerous lifestyle or in an exceptionally dangerous neighborhood

3. Because you have a bleak, pessimistic, dangerously paranoid view of the world around you

Apparently I needed to add general aggression/psychosis to that list. "Since I don't want to get in trouble for murder, I'm just begging for the opportunity to waste someone legally."



When people started responding #3, I thought it would be interesting to see what they had to say about other dangers in the world that one could be completely justified in being concerned with. Those things would be that which contributes (obesity) to the leading causes of death in the US, heart disease and cancer.

Interestingly, the people who gave calm, reasonable responses also cited a concern for the food they eat and the lifestyle they live. The others chose to lash out with personal insults and attempts to derail the conversation into a debate about their right to carry arms or when it is appropriate to use lethal force on criminals.

I agreed in the beginning and continue to agree that every American has the right to bear arms. All I sought was a brief explanation of the decision to exercise the right. When people gave reasoning with huge holes in it, I felt obliged to provide a different perspective. I believe in the whole 'love thy neighbor' concept even though I don't actively participate in any religion. It felt my duty to try to shed light on rational fears about the world to help people question their own beliefs and practices. I think questioning one's beliefs and practices is the only way to personally advance and become a better person.

Doolittle hit the nail on the head when she said McDonald's was worse. Safe gun ownership is low-risk. What's more dangerous to children than the boogie man robber is the one who instills a culture of eating pizza as a celebration and having 'fry parties.' There is a blazing contradiction between that cultural training and one which says you should keep yourself and your body protected by firearms everywhere you go. I hope this last post helps a few of you understand where I was coming from with my 'debate.'

I'll leave this here and won't post again on your thread. I really did not mean to get it so side-tracked, but I guess I should have expected it.


"Security is mostly a superstition. It does not exist in nature, nor do the children of men as a whole experience it. Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. Life is either a daring adventure, or nothing."
Helen Keller

Think about this.

You see a man dressed in black crawl out of your neighbors window. You can see they are taking items but your not sure what. Maybe stolen guns to be used in other crimes, maybe just jewelry and a playstation. Not sure but you know its property.

You confront them and tell then to stop. They don't and they run away.

You call the police and they check on your neighbor. They find that they were killed in a struggle with the intruder. Now with nothing to go on but your statement of "a man dressed in black" (We call that "the usual" since that's all we usually get), and not knowing for sure what was taken solving this crime is near impossible.

Despite what CSI shows do on tv we are a for way from that in the real world.

Now back up a bit.

You confront thm and tell them to stop. They don't and they get shot.

You call the police and they check on your neighbor. They find that they were killed in a struggle with the intruder. Now with the criminal dead or in the hospital we know who did it. If they are dead they will never do it again. If just wounded we at least can send them to court for their crimes.


My point is you never know for certain that the criminal is not going to harm you or if they have already harmed another. But you can be sure that if they are not stopped they will commit more crimes. Maybe the next time against you.

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Originally Posted by MrLang

When I first posed my question I thought there would be one of 3 responses:

1. To carry your toys around with you to show off to the other boys and compare muzzle lengths

2. Because you live an exceptionally dangerous lifestyle or in an exceptionally dangerous neighborhood

3. Because you have a bleak, pessimistic, dangerously paranoid view of the world around you

Apparently I needed to add general aggression/psychosis to that list. "Since I don't want to get in trouble for murder, I'm just begging for the opportunity to waste someone legally."



When people started responding #3, I thought it would be interesting to see what they had to say about other dangers in the world that one could be completely justified in being concerned with. Those things would be that which contributes (obesity) to the leading causes of death in the US, heart disease and cancer.

Interestingly, the people who gave calm, reasonable responses also cited a concern for the food they eat and the lifestyle they live. The others chose to lash out with personal insults and attempts to derail the conversation into a debate about their right to carry arms or when it is appropriate to use lethal force on criminals.

I agreed in the beginning and continue to agree that every American has the right to bear arms. All I sought was a brief explanation of the decision to exercise the right. When people gave reasoning with huge holes in it, I felt obliged to provide a different perspective. I believe in the whole 'love thy neighbor' concept even though I don't actively participate in any religion. It felt my duty to try to shed light on rational fears about the world to help people question their own beliefs and practices. I think questioning one's beliefs and practices is the only way to personally advance and become a better person.

Doolittle hit the nail on the head when she said McDonald's was worse. Safe gun ownership is low-risk. What's more dangerous to children than the boogie man robber is the one who instills a culture of eating pizza as a celebration and having 'fry parties.' There is a blazing contradiction between that cultural training and one which says you should keep yourself and your body protected by firearms everywhere you go. I hope this last post helps a few of you understand where I was coming from with my 'debate.'

I'll leave this here and won't post again on your thread. I really did not mean to get it so side-tracked, but I guess I should have expected it.


"Security is mostly a superstition. It does not exist in nature, nor do the children of men as a whole experience it. Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. Life is either a daring adventure, or nothing."
Helen Keller

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Wish you would open your mind a bit. I do have fry parties maybe once year. I also take my kids to macdonalds once in a blue moon to reward them for something. I don't know anyone who has died from the occasional mcnugget and small fries. Nor as chicken wing been linked to a death. I believe your problem mr Lang is you see in black and white. For you it's either 'we all want to shoot people' or 'having unhealthy food once in a while is a killer' not that I feel the need to defend my choices for you I will. You have struck a nerve and maybe that was your intent. If so congrats. Answer this question, do you wear a seatbelt in your vehicle? If you answer yes why? I've personally never been in a car accident where a seatbelt saved my life. However I do understand that there is a risk involved with driving so I choose to protect myself and family in any way I can. I also make sure my children have the appropriate child restraints at all times. According to your logic I'm just 'paranoid.' Is it ok for someone to smoke in their car and wear a seatbelt or is it pointless because they are smoking and that is unhealthy so why bother with a seatbelt. No different than carrying a gun statistics say I won't ever need it, but I choose to just incase, the same way I wear a seatbelt, just in case.
Please feel free to respond this thread is already derailed.

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Originally Posted by Seanjackmc

Nor as chicken wing been linked to a death.

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Didn't Mama Cass choke to death on a chicken wing?

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Originally Posted by MrLang

When I first posed my question I thought there would be one of 3 responses:

1. To carry your toys around with you to show off to the other boys and compare muzzle lengths

2. Because you live an exceptionally dangerous lifestyle or in an exceptionally dangerous neighborhood

3. Because you have a bleak, pessimistic, dangerously paranoid view of the world around you

Apparently I needed to add general aggression/psychosis to that list. "Since I don't want to get in trouble for murder, I'm just begging for the opportunity to waste someone legally."



When people started responding #3, I thought it would be interesting to see what they had to say about other dangers in the world that one could be completely justified in being concerned with. Those things would be that which contributes (obesity) to the leading causes of death in the US, heart disease and cancer.

Interestingly, the people who gave calm, reasonable responses also cited a concern for the food they eat and the lifestyle they live. The others chose to lash out with personal insults and attempts to derail the conversation into a debate about their right to carry arms or when it is appropriate to use lethal force on criminals.

I agreed in the beginning and continue to agree that every American has the right to bear arms. All I sought was a brief explanation of the decision to exercise the right. When people gave reasoning with huge holes in it, I felt obliged to provide a different perspective. I believe in the whole 'love thy neighbor' concept even though I don't actively participate in any religion. It felt my duty to try to shed light on rational fears about the world to help people question their own beliefs and practices. I think questioning one's beliefs and practices is the only way to personally advance and become a better person.

Doolittle hit the nail on the head when she said McDonald's was worse. Safe gun ownership is low-risk. What's more dangerous to children than the boogie man robber is the one who instills a culture of eating pizza as a celebration and having 'fry parties.' There is a blazing contradiction between that cultural training and one which says you should keep yourself and your body protected by firearms everywhere you go. I hope this last post helps a few of you understand where I was coming from with my 'debate.'

I'll leave this here and won't post again on your thread. I really did not mean to get it so side-tracked, but I guess I should have expected it.


"Security is mostly a superstition. It does not exist in nature, nor do the children of men as a whole experience it. Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. Life is either a daring adventure, or nothing."
Helen Keller

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Just because its a quote does not make it true.

You are in a murky bubble that is clouding your vision of the world, maybe your the drug clouded crackhead.

I have had several instances that I could have "waste(d) someone legally" and past. Taking care of the situation without resorting to justified deadly force. You tend to ignore most of the post and pick out and twist what you want. Your like the media.

I'm glad your not going to post on this thread any longer, I'm going to hold you to it. Now you will have more time to devote to your anti McDonalds campaign. I think you should look at including Jack in the Box and a few more.

I'm personally not a fast food fan and can't remember the last time I ate it but I hope your not against the supersize. If an American wants a gallon of Dr Pepper that is their business., not yours.

One day you will be tested and your bubble popped, I just hope that you have earned your Insanity tshirt and survive the ordeal.

I bet your glad we didn't choose option 1. Even the girls beat you.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BrandiR

Didn't Mama Cass choke to death on a chicken wing?

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Lol, I know of someone who almost died on a piece of broccoli, ever since then I have sworn off broccoli, I don't want to be the one who does die from an ill tempered vegetable.

I'm sorry Sean but Lang can not answer your question. He said he was done posting and i said I was holding him to it.

I wouldn't worry to much. I'm sure he wouldn't answer it and instead rant about a McFlurry.


So guys i have a Smith &Wesson model 28 (N frame) with a six inch barrel. Anybody have one bigger?

I have a beretta o/u with a 28 in barrel I usually carry it around the mall so everyone knows how tough I am and I just hope I see a shoplifting crime in progress so can waste someone. That's all us crazy gun owners do anyway right.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Deborah

I have a Glock 19 in my nightstand and I carry a Ruger LCP .380 (perfect compact size, fits great under any type of cloth with a small of back holster)

http://i954.photobucket.com/albums/a...-41-09_121.jpg

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This is why I NEVER show up unannounced! ;)

I have to lay low on New Years Eve. Sounds like a freaking war going on.

What do you guys think of Sig Sauer?
I was thinking of a P250 or P229

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 3skulls

I have to lay low on New Years Eve. Sounds like a freaking war going on.

What do you guys think of Sig Sauer?
I was thinking of a P250 or P229

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Nine rounds of .45 in the compact that's nice:)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 3skulls

I have to lay low on New Years Eve. Sounds like a freaking war going on.

What do you guys think of Sig Sauer?
I was thinking of a P250 or P229

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Nice guns. I just don't carry it because I'm not a fan of a DA/SA trigger. I haven't shot their DAK trigger though so I can't comment on that. I Did shoot a $1400 9mm from their custom shop that was amazing. I put three shots on a dime

I want the P238 bad but they are not cheap for a pocket pistol.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BrandiR

Didn't Mama Cass choke to death on a chicken wing?

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Actually, I believe it was a ham sandwich...


for good or for bad, this is ALL I can add to this thread

Quote:

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Originally Posted by KMG

Nice guns. I just don't carry it because I'm not a fan of a DA/SA trigger. I haven't shot their DAK trigger though so I can't comment on that. I Did shoot a $1400 9mm from their custom shop that was amazing. I put three shots on a dime

I want the P238 bad but they are not cheap for a pocket pistol.

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What don't you like about them?
The only gun I have ever own is my shotgun.
So i dont know much about handguns. I have done a little research but still in the very early stages at looking at them.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CatandDiallo

This is the attitude that scares me a bit.

I don't think anyone should have the right to protect property by the use of deadly force, EVER. It's stuff VS someone's life. That someone may be a criminal, but if your life is not in danger, and you see this guy walking away with some of your stuff, you should go to prison for a long, long time if you shoot him.

If you feel like your are in grave danger, then that is a different story.. but just property.. just materialistic stuff?

No. Way.

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I definitely agree. Hell I've had drunk friends accidentally going into the wrong house in themiddle of the night. (I have no idea how he got in to the housel I would be horrifie
ed if someone thought "oh my neighbor is being robbed. Let's shoot them"

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk 2

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 3skulls

What don't you like about them?
The only gun I have ever own is my shotgun.
So i dont know much about handguns. I have done a little research but still in the very early stages at looking at them.

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They are well made have a good feel and shoot well. The officers I know that carry them really like them and i have never heard of them having a problem with one.

If you start shooting with one its easy to learn the trigger system but for me shooting single action triggers it was a big change and not one I felt like making while becoming a police officer.

I went with the Glock. I already had a few and knew them. They at simple work house pistols. Many people don't like the grip but the torrent backstraps on the Gen4 help. I have completely customized mine. I got the frame reworked adding a beavertail and magwell, plus changed out all the guts. It is a very finished service pistol that i built for duty.

Check out this site.


http://gripreductions.com/

Quote:

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Originally Posted by barbie.dragon

I definitely agree. Hell I've had drunk friends accidentally going into the wrong house in themiddle of the night. (I have no idea how he got in to the housel I would be horrifie
ed if someone thought "oh my neighbor is being robbed. Let's shoot them"

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk 2

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So drunk you go in the wrong house? Seriously? How does that fit in the convo at all? That belongs on the "Worlds Dumbest" shows.

If you get shot because you are so drunk you go into the wrong house you deserve it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by KMG

So drunk you go in the wrong house? Seriously? How does that fit in the convo at all? That belongs on the "Worlds Dumbest" shows.

If you get shot because you are so drunk you go into the wrong house you deserve it.

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Imo, that happens more than you may think. You don't have to be "that drunk" to do something like that.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mike41793

Imo, that happens more than you may think. You don't have to be "that drunk" to do something like that.

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I have had my share of lost drunks to deal with but actually going in the wrong home. That's to much. If the homeowner shot them that is in no way the homeowners fault. It just does not fit in the topic we have been discussing. That is an alcohol issue. Its not gun related.

I am a Canadian and even I, at times, wish I could carry.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mike41793

Imo, that happens more than you may think. You don't have to be "that drunk" to do something like that.

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Easy fix to accidental and/or drunken idiocy - Lock your doors! I don't carry (but intend to eventually). However, I always lock my doors and close my garage. If someone is mysteriously in my house, they will meet the business end of my baseball bat BEFORE I ask them why they are there!