Ballbids.com

Awwww did poor little Zacky's scam go boom :rofl::rofl::rofl:.I am glad the word is out and they are done :banana:

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Originally Posted by mr.spooky

i can see these guys making alot of quick cash from people that arent as fortunate as us (here on BP.net) to see all this pan out.
i feel sorry for all the bidders.

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Don't worry, if anyone is smart enough to google ballbids.com before they bid this thread is the 5th thing that pops up, and the first site that isn't ball bids :)

I also wouldn't be suprised if the winner was a bot. How would anybody know if that wasn't a winner. How much money he can pocket without selling anything.

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Originally Posted by Ash

Wow this turned out to be far more hilarious than I anticipated.

Here's what I feel like is really going on:

1. The site appears to have been thrown together by somebody with very little patience, let alone knowledge regarding marketing or website construction. The odds that the person behind the site will pay any attention to the health of the animals or the satisfaction of the customer are slim to none.

2. If the website creator really cared about anything other than making a quick buck, more attention would have been paid to details like how the timer would behave, whether the website would be able to handle the traffic, and whether the terms of service were written by Best Buy. Once the money is in his pocket, he's going to be gone.

3. The site is likely set up in such a way that the timer will repeatedly reset if a certain profit has not been attained. To bidders watching the auction, it would appear as though other users are bidding, causing the timer to reset. This process would continue until a certain amount of money has been accrued. I highly doubt that it's an accident, or the fault of the 'server'. It's probably intentional, and extremely sloppy programming.

So in conclusion, I am absolutely not going to give this person any of my money. The fact that one individual person might get away with a morph for pennies on the dollar does not justify the means that it took to make it happen. IF anybody gets the snake cheap, it means that hundreds of others spent heaps of money in exchange for NOTHING. Hundreds of people get ripped off while one person is pleased with themselves for being a jackass and lining the pockets of a scumbag. In the meantime we are COLLECTIVELY shat on. The whole community.

It DOES matter to me that his practices are impatient, sloppy, underhanded and dishonest. I do not want somebody like this to make any money at the expense of weak-willed people and innocent animals.

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*makes more popcorn*

Hi everyone!
I'm sorry for taking so long to respond to your posts! I'm sure you can imagine how backed up we've been with today's fiasco!

Anyway, I read through all of your threads, and I'd like to go through a few major topics that I see being mentioned over and over again:

1) Quarantine: I confused the previous question about quarantine with general housing. For that, I apologize. The truth is that we don't have a proper quarantine set up, but it hasn't been an issue until this point because all of our snakes have been with us for about a month now, none of which are showing signs of health problems. However, we will have a proper quarantine set up in no time. As I mentioned earlier, we have the necessary supplies to build several more hatchling racks, which we will separate from our primary snake room and use as a quarantine.

2) Warranty, Live Delivery, Health, and Genetic guarantees: Our terms and conditions make several references to items that we "intend" to include in the future, such as tanks, heat pads, thermostats, etc., which is why you see items being referred to as "it". in general, the terms and conditions are only meant to provide us with legal protection, but I'm prepared to make necessary changes as you all see fit.

I'll begin by making necessary provisions that guarantee free return shipping and the exchange of live animals, in the case that you are unhappy with the snake you receive, live delivery, good health, and published genetics. Please, let me know if I missed anything.

3) Our backgrounds: It's true that I've only been involved, hands-on, with this trade for several weeks, but I'm primarily the tech/web guy, so, although it remains important, it's not AS important as it would be if I was a dedicated breeder. I depend on Zack's knowledge and experience, and although he may not be the most experienced breeder or snake handler around, he certainly knows enough to get us where we need to be and to keep our snakes in good health.

Also, we're both from South Florida, but we now live in Louisville, Kentucky. Zack's been up here for about 3 years, and I just recently moved up a little more than 2 weeks ago. And no, the website wasn't thrown together in 2 weeks time. It was built and modified multiple times over the last 6 months. It was only because of our impending launch date that I finally moved up to KY. Is there anything I'm leaving out?

4) Banner advertising: It's become very obvious that our banner ads need to be modified so that there is no confusion as to whether or not we have already auctioned off several snakes. As of now, all of our display ads on google have been paused, and I'll be crafting some new ones shortly, none of which will imply that any auctions have been "sold".

5) Multiple account registrations: This is actually my fault, as I told Zack to register a new account under the name zackBallBids, that way it was clear who and what he represented in his responses. I wasn't aware of his multiple account registrations, but that doesn't excuse him from the fact that he did what he did. The new account has been banned, which is a reasonable penalty. This will not happen again.

6) Constrictors Unlimited: Mike Wilbanks is not affiliated with us, and naming him as our "supplier" could have made him look bad, something I did not expect. Instead, I should have only mentioned that we purchased our snakes from him, and that's all. i apologize for creating any confusion, and I intend to post disclaimers on all of our live animal auctions from here on out.

7) Server crash: I've been doing a whole lot of advertising over the last two days, but I had no clue how far my efforts would reach. On day 1 we had about 2500 visitors. Today, on day 2, our dedicated server was completely overwhelmed, even after we made modifications. It became obvious that the server wouldn't survive the last few minutes of the auctions, so I tried to extend them by 1 hour to give us time to work things out. Being in such a chaotic atmosphere, I accidentally added an extra day to each auction, instead of an hour. Because of the server load time, it took me a while just to go back and modify the auction end time again so that it reflected the extra hour instead of the extra day. This is why you see users mentioning one or the other, or both.

I've been catching up with emails and live support requests since all of that happened, so I apologize again for taking so long to respond to this thread. And please, let me know if there is anything I left out.

-Avi =)

You guys are just not right, not in your ethics, not in your business model, not in your care of these awesome animals and certainly not in your lies and deceptions.

So many noobie mistakes it's pathetic, these are live animals and it's our hobby your toying with, yet you expect us to understand :rage:

Sorry, your barking up the wrong tree :snake::snake::snake:

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Originally Posted by snakesRkewl

You guys are just not right, not in your ethics, not in your business model, not in your care of these awesome animals and certainly not in your lies and deceptions.

So many noobie mistakes it's pathetic, these are live animals and it's our hobby your toying with, yet you expect us to understand :rage:

Sorry, your barking up the wrong tree :snake::snake::snake:

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Couldn't agree with you more.

I knew this was shady from the start, but this just blew my mind...

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Originally Posted by aviBallBids

6) Constrictors Unlimited: Mike Wilbanks is not affiliated with us, and naming him as our "supplier" could have made him look bad

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Ya' think????

If I was Mike Wilbanks, I'd probably be knocking on your front door this morning...:fork:

Hi guys!

Just a quick update: Our terms have been updated as I mentioned.

http://www.ballbids.com/page/terms-conditions

Please check them out and let me know if I left anything out.

Thanks! -Avi =)

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Originally Posted by aviBallBids

Hi guys!

Just a quick update: Our terms have been updated as I mentioned.

http://www.ballbids.com/page/terms-conditions

Please check them out and let me know if I left anything out.

Thanks! -Avi =)

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It's a shame you didn't focus your efforts on something a little more honorable or legit. You seem very determined to make a go of this. Unfortunately (for you) this won't end well...

Out of curiosity, has anyone contacted the Internet fraud folks yet?

Wow, even they know Mike's name thrown in the mix with Avi and Zachs can make him look bad :rolleyes:

Look. To be honest, Avi, you seem like a good businessman. You're proving extremely tenacious at least, considering the EPIC backlash from the community the site is apparently trying to cater to. I'm kind of sorry that you got involved in a business venture with this dude. You probably could have been really successful doing something else. Hopefully this doesn't haunt you.

Anyway, I don't doubt they're going to make money at this whether we like it or not, probably from people who aren't involved in forums, like kids. People who don't know any better.

But I still feel it's a slimey way to make money. I don't think live animals should be used in this way and I especially don't think this is going to reflect well on the reptile industry. We already have a pretty crappy public image. People don't like the fact that we even ship animals in packages. Now it's going to look like we condone auctioning them off like electronics. So nice job, guys. Way to contribute something positive to the industry. Thanks.

Heh, I just finished reading this thread. When I get off work, I think I'm going to skip the popcorn. This seems entertaining enough to crack out some pizza and beer. :gj:

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Originally Posted by Ash

Look. To be honest, Avi, you seem like a good businessman. You're proving extremely tenacious at least, considering the EPIC backlash from the community the site is apparently trying to cater to. I'm kind of sorry that you got involved in a business venture with this dude. You probably could have been really successful doing something else. Hopefully this doesn't haunt you.

Anyway, I don't doubt they're going to make money at this whether we like it or not, probably from people who aren't involved in forums, like kids. People who don't know any better.

But I still feel it's a slimey way to make money. I don't think live animals should be used in this way and I especially don't think this is going to reflect well on the reptile industry. We already have a pretty crappy public image. People don't like the fact that we even ship animals in packages. Now it's going to look like we condone auctioning them off like electronics. So nice job, guys. Way to contribute something positive to the industry. Thanks.

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All they need to do to get a glimpse of their future is check out the ghost town called reptileauctions.com...that website has been around for a few years and has never really done anything.

Personally I don't like the auction angle...I would think it would lead to a lot of impulse buys...which is not good when you're dealing with animals...

I feel bad for Avi getting into this, he seems like hes got decent marketing skills though is a little too slick for my tastes.


sent from my EVO

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Originally Posted by jbean7916

I feel bad for Avi getting into this, he seems like hes got decent marketing skills though is a little too slick for my tastes.


sent from my EVO

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I don't. Their both criminals. Internet fraud, using other peoples names without permission ., etc.... And then admit to lying about quarantine and other stuff. They should be sued if you ask me....both of them.. After all, their partners in this crime. All the proof needed is in these previous posts. If I were them, id be stepping away quietly as possible.
spooky

All I have to say is...It's not for me! I would love to see everybody stay away from this at all cost. I thought buying animals was about buying them from somebody who works hard to sustain a clean and healthy collection? Who knows how this guy keeps his animals if he doesn't breed or maintain a collection? Wouldn't it be fair to call this site and it's owners flippers? Best thing to do is, act like this site does not exist. What happens when your snake comes down sick? How is he going to replace your animal when he doesn't breed? Red flags in my book! Support your local breeder!:salute:

Subscribe

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Originally Posted by aviBallBids

Hi everyone!
I'm sorry for taking so long to respond to your posts! I'm sure you can imagine how backed up we've been with today's fiasco!

Anyway, I read through all of your threads, and I'd like to go through a few major topics that I see being mentioned over and over again:

1) Quarantine: I confused the previous question about quarantine with general housing. For that, I apologize. The truth is that we don't have a proper quarantine set up, but it hasn't been an issue until this point because all of our snakes have been with us for about a month now, none of which are showing signs of health problems. However, we will have a proper quarantine set up in no time. As I mentioned earlier, we have the necessary supplies to build several more hatchling racks, which we will separate from our primary snake room and use as a quarantine.

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So you admit you have no quarantine practice and in your prior posts, you were confused!? Sort of like how you are confused about what the truth is in advertising (false claims of sales).

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2) Warranty, Live Delivery, Health, and Genetic guarantees: Our terms and conditions make several references to items that we "intend" to include in the future, such as tanks, heat pads, thermostats, etc., which is why you see items being referred to as "it". in general, the terms and conditions are only meant to provide us with legal protection, but I'm prepared to make necessary changes as you all see fit.

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Your assurances mean nothing. The terms and conditions is your legal contract. Read it. It states that it is the full, complete and only legal binding contract. You are correct, they provide you with legal protection when people get screwed and come after you.

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I'll begin by making necessary provisions that guarantee free return shipping and the exchange of live animals, in the case that you are unhappy with the snake you receive, live delivery, good health, and published genetics. Please, let me know if I missed anything.

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Again, this means nothing. Your terms and conditions state otherwise.

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3) Our backgrounds: It's true that I've only been involved, hands-on, with this trade for several weeks, but I'm primarily the tech/web guy, so, although it remains important, it's not AS important as it would be if I was a dedicated breeder. I depend on Zack's knowledge and experience, and although he may not be the most experienced breeder or snake handler around, he certainly knows enough to get us where we need to be and to keep our snakes in good health.

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So you depend on a guy that a year ago didn't understand that you need a thermostat and used a heating pad? A guy who threw three and four snakes in together in a single tank? I think you need to explain a little more about Zach's vast knowledge and experience with ball pythons. From what I've seen here and other places, he has very little experience and doesn't understand basic ball python husbandry.

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Also, we're both from South Florida, but we now live in Louisville, Kentucky. Zack's been up here for about 3 years, and I just recently moved up a little more than 2 weeks ago. And no, the website wasn't thrown together in 2 weeks time. It was built and modified multiple times over the last 6 months. It was only because of our impending launch date that I finally moved up to KY. Is there anything I'm leaving out?

4) Banner advertising: It's become very obvious that our banner ads need to be modified so that there is no confusion as to whether or not we have already auctioned off several snakes. As of now, all of our display ads on google have been paused, and I'll be crafting some new ones shortly, none of which will imply that any auctions have been "sold".

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There was no confusion - you lied. When confronted, you did not say 'oh, that isn't a good idea'. You instead said it is just marketing. Trying to cover it up now and correct it only because multiple people have called you down on it is just placating the crowd. The truth is you lied. Admit it and stop trying to talk your way out of it.

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5) Multiple account registrations: This is actually my fault, as I told Zack to register a new account under the name zackBallBids, that way it was clear who and what he represented in his responses. I wasn't aware of his multiple account registrations, but that doesn't excuse him from the fact that he did what he did. The new account has been banned, which is a reasonable penalty. This will not happen again.

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Now you are making excuses and apologizing for Zach again. You told him to do it? He doesn't have the comprehension skills to understand it is against the rules after being directly told more than once? This is the expert you are relying on in your business?

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6) Constrictors Unlimited: Mike Wilbanks is not affiliated with us, and naming him as our "supplier" could have made him look bad, something I did not expect. Instead, I should have only mentioned that we purchased our snakes from him, and that's all. i apologize for creating any confusion, and I intend to post disclaimers on all of our live animal auctions from here on out.

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You tried to ride the coat tails of a reputable breeder to scam others. Shame on you. This is another typical method employed by scammers. You admit that your business model is similar to that of other scammers, but you are not. Now you use another method that scammers use, but we should trust you.

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7) Server crash: I've been doing a whole lot of advertising over the last two days, but I had no clue how far my efforts would reach. On day 1 we had about 2500 visitors. Today, on day 2, our dedicated server was completely overwhelmed, even after we made modifications. It became obvious that the server wouldn't survive the last few minutes of the auctions, so I tried to extend them by 1 hour to give us time to work things out. Being in such a chaotic atmosphere, I accidentally added an extra day to each auction, instead of an hour. Because of the server load time, it took me a while just to go back and modify the auction end time again so that it reflected the extra hour instead of the extra day. This is why you see users mentioning one or the other, or both.

I've been catching up with emails and live support requests since all of that happened, so I apologize again for taking so long to respond to this thread. And please, let me know if there is anything I left out.

-Avi =)

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Ending in a bunch of stuff and excuses about how wonderful and popular you are and trying to cover your butt. The fact is you have a business model that you admit is used by scammers. You have lied in your advertising. You have tried to give the impression that a reputable breeder is involved in your business (another scammer trick). You have yet to satisfy those who question your quarantine procedures (scammer red flag). The more you post, the more red flags that keep appearing. So, by all means continue to post.

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Originally Posted by aviBallBids

Hi guys!

Just a quick update: Our terms have been updated as I mentioned.

http://www.ballbids.com/page/terms-conditions

Please check them out and let me know if I left anything out.

Thanks! -Avi =)

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Still does not guarantee live delivery. Still does not guarantee sex. Still does not guarantee health. Still does not guarantee genetics. Still does not address how to deal with a sick snake. Still needs a lot of work. You really need to consult a lawyer and get someone with real experience involved.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by aviBallBids

Hi everyone!
I'm sorry for taking so long to respond to your posts! I'm sure you can imagine how backed up we've been with today's fiasco!

Anyway, I read through all of your threads, and I'd like to go through a few major topics that I see being mentioned over and over again:

1) Quarantine: I confused the previous question about quarantine with general housing. For that, I apologize. The truth is that we don't have a proper quarantine set up, but it hasn't been an issue until this point because all of our snakes have been with us for about a month now, none of which are showing signs of health problems. However, we will have a proper quarantine set up in no time. As I mentioned earlier, we have the necessary supplies to build several more hatchling racks, which we will separate from our primary snake room and use as a quarantine.

2) Warranty, Live Delivery, Health, and Genetic guarantees: Our terms and conditions make several references to items that we "intend" to include in the future, such as tanks, heat pads, thermostats, etc., which is why you see items being referred to as "it". in general, the terms and conditions are only meant to provide us with legal protection, but I'm prepared to make necessary changes as you all see fit.

I'll begin by making necessary provisions that guarantee free return shipping and the exchange of live animals, in the case that you are unhappy with the snake you receive, live delivery, good health, and published genetics. Please, let me know if I missed anything.

3) Our backgrounds: It's true that I've only been involved, hands-on, with this trade for several weeks, but I'm primarily the tech/web guy, so, although it remains important, it's not AS important as it would be if I was a dedicated breeder. I depend on Zack's knowledge and experience, and although he may not be the most experienced breeder or snake handler around, he certainly knows enough to get us where we need to be and to keep our snakes in good health.

Also, we're both from South Florida, but we now live in Louisville, Kentucky. Zack's been up here for about 3 years, and I just recently moved up a little more than 2 weeks ago. And no, the website wasn't thrown together in 2 weeks time. It was built and modified multiple times over the last 6 months. It was only because of our impending launch date that I finally moved up to KY. Is there anything I'm leaving out?

4) Banner advertising: It's become very obvious that our banner ads need to be modified so that there is no confusion as to whether or not we have already auctioned off several snakes. As of now, all of our display ads on google have been paused, and I'll be crafting some new ones shortly, none of which will imply that any auctions have been "sold".

5) Multiple account registrations: This is actually my fault, as I told Zack to register a new account under the name zackBallBids, that way it was clear who and what he represented in his responses. I wasn't aware of his multiple account registrations, but that doesn't excuse him from the fact that he did what he did. The new account has been banned, which is a reasonable penalty. This will not happen again.

6) Constrictors Unlimited: Mike Wilbanks is not affiliated with us, and naming him as our "supplier" could have made him look bad, something I did not expect. Instead, I should have only mentioned that we purchased our snakes from him, and that's all. i apologize for creating any confusion, and I intend to post disclaimers on all of our live animal auctions from here on out.

7) Server crash: I've been doing a whole lot of advertising over the last two days, but I had no clue how far my efforts would reach. On day 1 we had about 2500 visitors. Today, on day 2, our dedicated server was completely overwhelmed, even after we made modifications. It became obvious that the server wouldn't survive the last few minutes of the auctions, so I tried to extend them by 1 hour to give us time to work things out. Being in such a chaotic atmosphere, I accidentally added an extra day to each auction, instead of an hour. Because of the server load time, it took me a while just to go back and modify the auction end time again so that it reflected the extra hour instead of the extra day. This is why you see users mentioning one or the other, or both.

I've been catching up with emails and live support requests since all of that happened, so I apologize again for taking so long to respond to this thread. And please, let me know if there is anything I left out.

-Avi =)

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Zack give it up you have been exposed as a fraud and your running around in circles trying to recover.ITS OVER! Sorry if your other half(probably your girlfriend again) still thinks anyone that has any common sense is falling for your load of crap you wrote here.Yea your depending on your experiance with ball pythons :rofl:.You dont have the knowledge to care for a knat let alone a ball python.My suggestion for you just go away and dont come back because YOU WILL BE EXPOSED yet again if you try anything ever again.

don took care of most of what I was thinking about after reading the updates.

one question lingers though, aside from the discrepancy in avi's statements regarding refunds from the server-crashing auction: who, if anyone, actually won last night?

this business model should fade away entirely, and should not have been appropriated to sell any live animals in the first place.

avi, I have two big dogs. Those two dogs are pretty good sized, they eat a lot. When they poop it is in LARGE piles.

Those LARGE piles are minuscule compared to the piles you keep leaving everywhere you post.

What I'm alluding to here, and we ALL know you're good at alluding to illusions, so I'm sure that you'll understand this and be able to dumb it down enough so that your partner will also understand, is that YOU are full of crap. Top to bottom, side to side, in and out, crap crap crap.

Anyone who trusts you or your dimwitted partner is either a newb, a fool, or too greedy to see what a load you're selling.

Your web skills may be great, but your lack of integrity and general stupidity in thinking that we'll fall for your continued excuses for your blatant attempts to delude us are glaring examples of much of what is wrong not just with this industry but greedy bastards the world over.

YOU may not know it, your less than intelligent partner does, but this crapfest you've hurled all over the reptile webworld is going to stain your backside for the rest of forever. Some of us have really long memories and you've obviously pissed Joe off enough that he's going to make a point of hound dogging you two pillars of the community until either you're gone or he's dead. Have fun with that. He's just the first up. You've got a line of folks behind him watching in case he misses something.

Obviously you're not as stupid as zack, few are, so maybe you should consider moving on to something else, you know, something that won't make you look so damn stupid and money grubbing. Maybe you could run for congress.

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Originally Posted by wilomn

Maybe you could run for congress.

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:rofl::rofl::grabbed::clap:

Folks please see post 68 here on this link.I think ole Zach has blocked me from seeing it lol. http://www.reptileradio.net/reptiler...388#post671388

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Originally Posted by joepythons

Folks please see post 68 here on this link.I think ole Zach has blocked me from seeing it lol. http://www.reptileradio.net/reptiler...388#post671388

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Yeah I saw it, and he looks like a tool! I registered on his page to see everything, I cant believe this guy. I checked out a thread started by him on here last year, and he is a complete baby, getting mad at everyone for talking to him like he is a "beginner". He had four big mistakes in his original post about heat pads, keeping 4 snakes in a tank, changing between heat pads and lamps. This makes Ben's facebook auctions look like the Barrett-Jacksons of the herp community!

My wife and I were looking at his site last night. It's all a lottery system.

I spend, say $90, to buy bids. Say I bid on a snake I really want. I dump all those bids into that snake. Someone else wins, I'm out $90. I might as well flush that down the toilet instead. OR, I can set that aside and put it to the purchase of the same snake I really wanted from a reputable breeder, who will and can stand behind the quality of the snake, thus insuring my continued business with that breeder. Gee, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out which choice is the best one.

And I agree, support your local breeder. :gj::salute:

Wouldn't you have to have a business license to do this? If so that should be public record. Also if they do have a license they can be reported to BBB and to the internet fraud department.

Honestly this was the longest thread I have read to date, and it was totally worth it. I am now late to work but way worth it.

On one note I called the number on their site and Avi answered the phone.

It surprises me that there isn't some government agency that goes around and does investigations and shuts stuff like this down. Another black mark on the industry.

I LOVED some of your comments though, like the one about the company being like Titanic only the Titanic got underway before it tanked. Had to give some love to that comment since t got none and I laughed so hard when I read it.

Anyway hope these criminals are dealt with soon.

Here's what I feel like is really going on:

1. The site appears to have been thrown together by somebody with very little patience, let alone knowledge regarding marketing or website construction. The odds that the person behind the site will pay any attention to the health of the animals or the satisfaction of the customer are slim to none.

2. If the website creator really cared about anything other than making a quick buck, more attention would have been paid to details like how the timer would behave, whether the website would be able to handle the traffic, and whether the terms of service were written by Best Buy. Once the money is in his pocket, he's going to be gone.

3. The site is likely set up in such a way that the timer will repeatedly reset if a certain profit has not been attained. To bidders watching the auction, it would appear as though other users are bidding, causing the timer to reset. This process would continue until a certain amount of money has been accrued. I highly doubt that it's an accident, or the fault of the 'server'. It's probably intentional, and extremely sloppy programming.

So in conclusion, I am absolutely not going to give this person any of my money. The fact that one individual person might get away with a morph for pennies on the dollar does not justify the means that it took to make it happen. IF anybody gets the snake cheap, it means that hundreds of others spent heaps of money in exchange for NOTHING. Hundreds of people get ripped off while one person is pleased with themselves for being a jackass and lining the pockets of a scumbag. In the meantime we are COLLECTIVELY shat on. The whole community.

It DOES matter to me that his practices are impatient, sloppy, underhanded and dishonest. I do not want somebody like this to make any money at the expense of weak-willed people and innocent animals.

could this be reported here https://trustsealinfo.verisign.com/s...ds.com&lang=en
or does it have nothing to do with the matter at hand?
thanks
spooky

wait a minute.... this says the sight owner is here :BALL BIDS, LLC.
Coral Springs
Florida, US

i thought they were in KY or somewhere???????
spooky

Started in FL, moved to KY. Gotta keep up :D

LOL:oops:

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Originally Posted by Don

http://www.usatoday.com/tech/columni...auctions_n.htm

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This was helpful. Thanks for sharing this, Don.

One more thing I just noticed. Avi, have you posted anywhere under Zach's name and passed yourself off as him? I find it very odd that your grammar, spelling and sentence structure are fairly well formed and presented. Zach, on the other hand, cannot spell or put sentences together without serious grammatical errors and spelling errors. Yet, there are posts here under Zach's banned accounts that have very well written posts.

It is not just here. I've noticed on other sites, when the real Zach posts, his sentences are fragmented, spelling is awful and he is unable to express himself in writing. When you post, the sentence structure is good, spelling is proper and grammar is much better.

I think you may have been passing yourself off as Zach. For example, here is a thread supposedly from Zach from his banned account:

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Hello everyone, Zack from ballbids.com here


I saw a lot of you where skeptical about our new site and let me tell you, I do not blame you. This is brand new to the reptile industry and being that said I expected many people to be skeptical at first. Also, it does not help that other penny auction websites have scammed people. Tho any business has the ability to scam you. Many of them do use robot auto bidders as well. That's usually why they get into big trouble. We do not. If we take a loss then we take a loss. All of the snakes are from constrictors unlimited except the fire girl. She is my own. Just wanted to promote my business a little and give back something to the community that I have been in for a good while now. Which brings me to my next thing. I am a ball python breeder, I would not ruin my reputation just to make a quick buck. I love this industry to much to be thrown out of it

So in conclusion, I just wanted to say that I hope you can keep an open mind about this as well as see that I am not hiding my identity. There is nothing shady about what we are doing. I hope to see you all over here at ballbids.
Thanks again and if there are any questions I have left unanswered please do not hesitate to ask.

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Here is a post from the real Zach (which I think you helped him correct):

Quote:

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Hey everyone, Zack at Ballbids.com again


I see a lot of people are concerned about what has happened in the past. Let me explain... I never admitted to a lie because I never told one. I never made myself out to be better then anyone else. I never did anything wrong actually, accept not spelling right and posting to many threads about the same thing. I could see where people would have gotten mad but hey, it was my first time to a forum ever and as you can see, I am a very outgoing and friendly character that does not like negativity in my life. When people started to behave in an inappropriate manner it was only a matter of time before I snapped. I was not ready for that. Kind of threw me off I guess. Either way I should have never been irrational and lost my temper. Besides that, I never scammed or would even scam anyone in my entire life. I don't know why people like to make false accusations. But that is their business. Mine is to help suppress the negative false comments so that people that actually do like this company will not be scared off for false reasons. Anyways, I really wish the bad talking would end because there are no valid points to it. Yes it says on our website that we guarantee our product up to 7 days. We do guarantee live arrival. We do put it out there that you have to buy bids first. We even give you back 5 percent. We could have done this a different way just to make more money. And it might also have worked that way. But we did't. We wanted to make it honest and fair for everyone. I know why you are concerned. We all have been scammed. Not by me tho, and you will never by me! I hope you can agree with my ethics even if you don't agree with my business.

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Here is a thread from the real Zach without your help from a thread last year:

Quote:

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Ok I was not trying to impress anyone and I am not trying to act like a tough guy. I have been there done that. This is me. I say what I say but I will try and improve on what I say. If you really think you havent done anything look how you are talking to me. Look how your friend is insulting me. If you believe that you are right about that then you are way wrong. I admit that I need to work on how I come off here but please understand that you have said way to much and altercated a bigger viewing of this thread. So if you believe that you are right than think about it. You are being just as combative as me. Now lets shut it down and maybe one day we can talk eye to eye but I assure you right now you are making me mad with your insults. Like I said I am not a kid, maybe young but not a kid. Our experiances of life are all different. I might know a lot more about other things then you. But it doesnt matter. I said what I said and corrected it and you continued. What does that say on your behalf?

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See the difference? It is not just here, but pretty much everywhere I look at in the on-line community of reptiles. Avi, have you been posting as Zach?

Lol so ive been reading this whole thread and i went on fb a little while ago and saw this

Ben Siegel Reptiles
T MINUS 1 HOUR TILL 7 DAYTIME REPTILE AUCTIONS-----maybe we are going to try something new today everyone----you all pay me---i dont know--lets say 50 cents everytime you bid---bid alot---then whoever bids at the last minute might win the reptile in question? unless the bids automatically get extended by another bid within 15 seconds----at which point we will have a round robin style table silent auction bid-----AFTER that the final 3 people can have a greco roman style wrestling match-----once the winner of the match is determined-------then that person can place his one remaining POWER bid to get the actual animal in question! We will then have a one final contest where challengers can gather to challenge the actual winner to a thumb wrestling contest if they can guess the number I am thinking during a round of rock, paper scissors.
OR you could just come to our wall and bid on the first, best and most reliable DAILY reptile auctions that put up high end animals and ball python morphs EVERY DAY at no reserve. HAVE TO SAY--the first option is quite tempting-...... hmmmm-----NAH!! Ill go with the second! — with Joseph Laubscher.



Lmao this just made my day

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Originally Posted by Don

One more thing I just noticed. Avi, have you posted anywhere under Zach's name and passed yourself off as him? I find it very odd that your grammar, spelling and sentence structure are fairly well formed and presented. Zach, on the other hand, cannot spell or put sentences together without serious grammatical errors and spelling errors. Yet, there are posts here under Zach's banned accounts that have very well written posts.

It is not just here. I've noticed on other sites, when the real Zach posts, his sentences are fragmented, spelling is awful and he is unable to express himself in writing. When you post, the sentence structure is good, spelling is proper and grammar is much better.

I think you may have been passing yourself off as Zach. For example, here is a thread supposedly from Zach from his banned account:



Here is a post from the real Zach (which I think you helped him correct):


Here is a thread from the real Zach without your help from a thread last year:


See the difference? It is not just here, but pretty much everywhere I look at in the on-line community of reptiles. Avi, have you been posting as Zach?

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Good luck getting an honest answer...

These guys are a real piece of work. They are genius when it comes to getting attention but are absolutely not good for our hobby in my opinion. At this point, Mr. Wilbanks has chosen not to speak on this matter, either on his forum or facebook page. To Zach and Avi, I say to do the reptile community a big favor and just go away

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Don

One more thing I just noticed. Avi, have you posted anywhere under Zach's name and passed yourself off as him? I find it very odd that your grammar, spelling and sentence structure are fairly well formed and presented. Zach, on the other hand, cannot spell or put sentences together without serious grammatical errors and spelling errors. Yet, there are posts here under Zach's banned accounts that have very well written posts.

It is not just here. I've noticed on other sites, when the real Zach posts, his sentences are fragmented, spelling is awful and he is unable to express himself in writing. When you post, the sentence structure is good, spelling is proper and grammar is much better.

I think you may have been passing yourself off as Zach. For example, here is a thread supposedly from Zach from his banned account:



Here is a post from the real Zach (which I think you helped him correct):


Here is a thread from the real Zach without your help from a thread last year:


See the difference? It is not just here, but pretty much everywhere I look at in the on-line community of reptiles. Avi, have you been posting as Zach?

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I noticed that as well.

given Avi's brief experience with this industry, it might go a long way in explaining why the one user-one account rule was "overlooked." especially after Zach had been through precisely the same ordeal last year and was warned about it after the administrators merged his two accounts.

edit: the previously documented obdurate and deliberate ignorance also could be to blame as long as we're just speculating.

LOL at Ben's facebook!

Hi I am Zach....Good grief that should tell you something from the get go...Read through the first few pages and could not believe this mess... Good for a laugh though. Just hope to many people dont buy into this nonsense but people always do and that's why these types are still around after all of this time...

This thread delivers!!!:popcorn:

I agree these guys need to go away and go back to whatever they were doing before,just stay away from snakes though.They have been put on blast on like every forum not actually answering the questions they try to but they just say the wrong answers, the whole reptile community is onto them. .I haven't even been doing this hobby for that long and i even know more then they do about husbandry and the care for the snakes.And the only people that are actually bidding on these "snakes" obviously aren't joined in any forums because they wouldn't even participate if they were.Sooner or later EVERYONE will catch on ,than what are they going to change it from bp's to some other animals.

I have a new business idea for you guys go have a penny auction for like some wrapping paper or Mcdonalds.

I love the bp world and i love my snakes and for you guys to pretty much make a mockery of it pretty much pisses me off and the sad thing is this thing is already getting pretty viral i just hope you guys get caught and this doesn't negatively effect the reptile community in any way,which who knows it could of been your plan the whole time since you did leave a little hostile from here.

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Originally Posted by wwmjkd

don took care of most of what I was thinking about after reading the updates.

one question lingers though, aside from the discrepancy in avi's statements regarding refunds from the server-crashing auction: who, if anyone, actually won last night?

this business model should fade away entirely, and should not have been appropriated to sell any live animals in the first place.

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Looks to me like a friend of theirs supposedly won last night but they decided to reauction the snake that she supposedly won...

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f1...2/0a65cc20.jpg

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Originally Posted by Boanerges

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f1...2/0a65cc20.jpg

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If that is not incriminating (showing there was a real scam, not just uninformed goofs getting in over their head) then it is extremely suspicious. Where did it come from?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Don

If that is not incriminating (showing there was a real scam, not just uninformed goofs getting in over their head) then it is extremely suspicious. Where did it come from?

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it appears to be the facebook page for the company.

thanks to Robin for her persistence and dealing with flack from uninformed and potentially complicit people.

Yes it came from the ballbids facebook page. More comments have been written. I am pretty much confused on completely what is going on now though :confuzd:

OK, just went over and read more than I care too of that wall. It is mighty suspicious that one of his biggest defenders won the auction and that a friend of hers was the other top bidder. I really thought this was a venture started out by two young guys who just didn't do their homework and didn't understand the industry - trying to get rich quick. Now, I'm moving away from that to thinking that there is a real scam going on.

Also, notice how the posts on the Facebook page there are no spelling errors and the grammar is pretty good, but everything posted is signed "Zach"? That is not Zach writing. I've seen enough of Zach's writing to spot it. He doesn't have the writing skills to respond like that. It is Avi. Why the deception?

I suspect those on Facebook defending them are investors in the scheme, or family members. They must have put out some real money to get this thing ramped up so quickly. They must feel sick seeing the response Ballbids is getting from the reptile community as their investment crumbles.

I love this hobby/community. Thanks to everyone who outed these greedy individuals who want to prey on the ignorant and naive to line there pockets.:salute:

Everyone here is doing a great job at pointing out there lies and deceptions. I would just like to add that I will "Blacklist" ANYONE who provides these individuals with animals for there shady practices.

These are living creatures that they are treating like laptops. Support BREEDERS who work hard to provide quality animals, not some computer savy (not really) individual and a newb who does not even understand basic husbandry that want to prey on the ignorant.

Anthony