Live Feeding Morally Wrong???

I'm sorry. Dogs and cats on a vegetarian diet is just cruel. While a dog can survive on a vegetarian diet doesn't mean its the best thing for them and those who feed their dogs a vegetarian diet are forcing their beliefs on an animal that needs to be eating meat. I am vegetarian myself but ANY animal in this house that eats meat, gets meat. I even have to cut up bloody pieces of meat for my ferret because I know thats the best thing for her. And as far as cats on a vegetarian diet, that is cruel, plain and simple. That's like feeding a ferret corn on the cob for the rest of its life.

As for snakes and live feeding, several of ours get live. Some get f/t. It all depends on who wants what. While I am against animal abuse, my snakes eating a live mouse is natural and therefore I'm not out to force my snake to eat a carrot. And I'm so tired of people going "Oh, poor defenseless mouse. I can't believe you are going to let your snake eat that cute thing." I really just want to shout "Well at least the mouse won't suffer very long. That steak you just bought for dinner. Yea, that cow was tortured while it grew up, yanked from its mother at a young age, fed a horrible diet, was injected with hormones and antibiotics, cramped into horrible living conditions while it grew up, crowded onto a nasty truck, carted to a slaughterhouse where it received a bolt through its head (but sometimes they missed) and then strung up by its hindleg, had its throat slit but sometimes that didn't work so well and the cow was there, hanging by its hoof, bleeding to death for you to have your steak." I think that would make them shut up long enough for me to buy my feeders and go.

(sorry for the long rant about the production of beef. I just can't stand how people go on and on about how much a mouse suffers at the mercy of my steak, yet they go home and have no second thoughts about that steak they are eating. It just really gets my blood boiling.)

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Originally Posted by Jay_Bunny

I'm sorry. Dogs and cats on a vegetarian diet is just cruel. While a dog can survive on a vegetarian diet doesn't mean its the best thing for them and those who feed their dogs a vegetarian diet are forcing their beliefs on an animal that needs to be eating meat. I am vegetarian myself but ANY animal in this house that eats meat, gets meat. I even have to cut up bloody pieces of meat for my ferret because I know thats the best thing for her. And as far as cats on a vegetarian diet, that is cruel, plain and simple. That's like feeding a ferret corn on the cob for the rest of its life.

As for snakes and live feeding, several of ours get live. Some get f/t. It all depends on who wants what. While I am against animal abuse, my snakes eating a live mouse is natural and therefore I'm not out to force my snake to eat a carrot. And I'm so tired of people going "Oh, poor defenseless mouse. I can't believe you are going to let your snake eat that cute thing." I really just want to shout "Well at least the mouse won't suffer very long. That steak you just bought for dinner. Yea, that cow was tortured while it grew up, yanked from its mother at a young age, fed a horrible diet, was injected with hormones and antibiotics, cramped into horrible living conditions while it grew up, crowded onto a nasty truck, carted to a slaughterhouse where it received a bolt through its head (but sometimes they missed) and then strung up by its hindleg, had its throat slit but sometimes that didn't work so well and the cow was there, hanging by its hoof, bleeding to death for you to have your steak." I think that would make them shut up long enough for me to buy my feeders and go.

(sorry for the long rant about the production of beef. I just can't stand how people go on and on about how much a mouse suffers at the mercy of my steak, yet they go home and have no second thoughts about that steak they are eating. It just really gets my blood boiling.)

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No real argument from me here, but just wanted to say.. Not all beef is put in horrible conditions before it's slaughtered. Where I live (North Texas) there's beef cattle all over the place, and most of them are in large fields and grow up with their parents. They are still taken, sold and slaughtered, but the majority of them don't suffer until the very end.

I'm not standing up for these fools, and I've even mentioned the beef thing, but just wanted to clear the air, that's not how all beef cattle is kept.

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Originally Posted by MarkS

You feed your snake what it's willing to eat, but you will still never convince some people about the necessity of feeding live.... And by the way, feeding live because it's 'natural' is NOT a good enough reason. BUT... why on earth do people feel the need to film it and put it on YouTube? I think a lot of the reason some people do that is for the shock value anyway, so the comments they are getting is just what they're looking for. Do people film their dogs eating a can of alpo and put THAT on YouTube?? NO..... So why snakes? It's NOT necessary and it's NOT needed to film this. If you want to impress somebody, film your boa taking a dump and put THAT on YouTube.

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Thanks for all the responses!!! I wanted to respond to yours Mark... I'm not sure I quite understand what you mean by saying that feeding live is becasue it's natural is NOT a good enough reason. I by no means am attacking your oppinion ...My personal feeling is that just because a snake will eat dead does not mean that is what is best for the snake... Often times in that situation F/T is all they are offered until they cave in to eating it, probably because they are starving. There are pro's and con's to both ways of feeding. There are nutritional benifits to feeding live vs F/T. But when feeding live there is always a small risk of your snake become harmed from defensive prey. My opinion is that considering the pro's and cons of both feeding methods... The fact is that it is part of their natural behavior to hunt and kill live prey... That Is the deciding factor for me in how I choose to feed.

As far as posting video's of this on youtube... I can see how some people could want to see this out of some sick pleasure. But speaking for myself as the owner of a constantly growing Large RTB that will probably have to gradute to eating larger prey items in the near future, I was excited to learn that I could find videos that allowed me to observe this. I had never had the opportunity to watch the feeding of a 12 foot albino burm... It was very facinating.

Frankly, I stated to them that if they could not resist clicking on links that offend them... Then they should really stop playing on the internet. I had a hard time seeing a pig get slaughtered for food... But fact is that this is what is necessary to eat, So while the image was incredibaly disturbing... I also found it educational. Over the last hundered years our society has learned to shelter us from most of the ugly details, where before if you couldn't handle killing an animal for food... you would most likely starve to death. I find nothing wrong with posting snake feeding videos on the internet... Especially with all the material on the web that is actually intended for sick demented pleasures of messed up people. Fact is you could probably post a video of any random thing at all... and there will always be someone who is offeneded. These people are just showing off there snakes... I don't mind seeing the snake being handled, or just sitting in its enclosure... But honestly, I would rather see it in action... doing what it does best. Sorry for the long winded reponse ... I type quick

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Originally Posted by Skoalbasher

No real argument from me here, but just wanted to say.. Not all beef is put in horrible conditions before it's slaughtered. Where I live (North Texas) there's beef cattle all over the place, and most of them are in large fields and grow up with their parents. They are still taken, sold and slaughtered, but the majority of them don't suffer until the very end.

I'm not standing up for these fools, and I've even mentioned the beef thing, but just wanted to clear the air, that's not how all beef cattle is kept.

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Oh I know, but for most thats how it is. I would really like to find a place to get good quality, cruel free meat for my animals, especially since we plan on getting more ferrets (the main raw meat eater in the house. The cats get dry cat food)

There is absolutely nothing "morally" wrong about it.
This is Nature. If you don't want to read something that may offend you, please stop now and do not read the rest of my post. Also...its really long because I'm bored at work...

I am constantly astounded at the inability for most people to have a rational viewpoint on anything. Inconsistency in one's beliefs is the fastest way to tell if someone is just flat-out immature or a completely irrational person. I wonder if these same people, who cry over a "cute" mouse being eaten by a "mean" snake would say that those mother mice who eat their babies should "burn in hell?" What about male lions who will kill their own cubs if the cub is young enough?

Just remember, it's okay for humans to torture animals from the moment they're born for our own benefit, because we are special. We need our McBurgers and our chicken finger boxes. It does not matter how the cow died, because it's not as cute as a little mouse! It does not matter if the chickens suffer in cages that are too small and that their beaks are cut. Pass the BBQ sauce! Don't get me started on the veal calf. If they are so concerned about the poor, pathetic, helpless little mouse, where is their anger for these helpless creatures?

Do these kids who post barely understandable comments on YouTube flip out about endangered species? Where is their indignation for the people who destroy rain forests? What about the snow leopards? Do they get angry about the wolves who are being killed in Alaska right now? How about the dwindling biodiversity in Alabama's rivers?

As long as we are far removed from an issue that could cause us to feel sick to our stomachs, we are free to ignore it. Iraq is way over there ---> Many people who eat burgers have never touched a cow or fed a chicken. If you're not a biologist or a sport fisher, then what do you care about trout? Grown wolves (not cute puppies!) kill people and are "mean" so they must not have any valuable place in the environment, right?
I grew up on a farm. I've milked cows and I've hunted deer. I am not far removed from what I eat, so when I see a snake make its kill it is not a shock to me. It's no different than when a coyote takes one of your sheep. My boyfriend, however, refuses to watch my snake eat. So yes, I can see how people might get upset about it if they have no idea what their steak dinner went through - or if they don't care to acknowledge it, but to say that it is morally wrong for a natural predatory creature to do what nature meant it to do is pure ignorance.

I think that the reason people get upset over snakes feeding is because it is so visceral and so real. It is one thing to watch a cheetah on the TV, in all her beauty, capture a baby impala and carry it over to her young so they can learn to hunt. People love to watch crocs lie and wait in the water, their eyes and nostrils above the surface calculating their assassination of that ugly wilder beast. It is another thing altogether to watch someone take his/her pet out of its cage and allow it to do what it has evolved to do - predate. That gets into their hostile heads and makes the reality of the suffering they introduce into the world too real.

*Please also note that I’m not saying that either live or F/T or P/K food is better or worse (I’d love to get mine eating F/T eventually) I am only attacking the YouTube people who don’t mind saying, “i hope u die and i hope ur F******snake dies you ****** burn in hell if i was there i'd kill ur snake f*****, etc.”

One more thing about Marks comment... I did see several videos that people posted of their pet cat or Dog toruring and killing a snake in the Yard while everyone stood around and laughed. Not bashing cats and dogs ...just making a point.

A great fact is that in the US yearly... The common house cat makes more live prey kills (be it a bird, wild snake, rat, or somebodys pet rodent), than any other animal in the wild or in captivity. My snakes eat once a week... while I had a cat who would leave a pile of kills by the slider in one day.

Food for thought.

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Originally Posted by Jay_Bunny

I'm sorry. Dogs and cats on a vegetarian diet is just cruel. While a dog can survive on a vegetarian diet doesn't mean its the best thing for them and those who feed their dogs a vegetarian diet are forcing their beliefs on an animal that needs to be eating meat. I am vegetarian myself but ANY animal in this house that eats meat, gets meat. I even have to cut up bloody pieces of meat for my ferret because I know thats the best thing for her. And as far as cats on a vegetarian diet, that is cruel, plain and simple. That's like feeding a ferret corn on the cob for the rest of its life.

As for snakes and live feeding, several of ours get live. Some get f/t. It all depends on who wants what. While I am against animal abuse, my snakes eating a live mouse is natural and therefore I'm not out to force my snake to eat a carrot. And I'm so tired of people going "Oh, poor defenseless mouse. I can't believe you are going to let your snake eat that cute thing." I really just want to shout "Well at least the mouse won't suffer very long. That steak you just bought for dinner. Yea, that cow was tortured while it grew up, yanked from its mother at a young age, fed a horrible diet, was injected with hormones and antibiotics, cramped into horrible living conditions while it grew up, crowded onto a nasty truck, carted to a slaughterhouse where it received a bolt through its head (but sometimes they missed) and then strung up by its hindleg, had its throat slit but sometimes that didn't work so well and the cow was there, hanging by its hoof, bleeding to death for you to have your steak." I think that would make them shut up long enough for me to buy my feeders and go.

(sorry for the long rant about the production of beef. I just can't stand how people go on and on about how much a mouse suffers at the mercy of my steak, yet they go home and have no second thoughts about that steak they are eating. It just really gets my blood boiling.)

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this is another one of those things that there are a few places that do it and they only show those few and people lean to think that its all of most of the places that do it that way. while yes there are a few places like this most of the farmers tend to treat their cattle very well this is their job and their source of income if they were to treat the cattle the way we see on tv they would not produce the quality of meat that people want and they would lose money in the long run. i have spent alot of time around beef farms i have assisted giving birth to a calf that i later called a t-bone steak, and spent countless hours with several farmers and any of them would be the first to call anyone out for the mistreatment of any cattle.

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Originally Posted by SoCaliSon

One more thing about Marks comment... I did see several videos that people posted of their pet cat or Dog toruring and killing a snake in the Yard while everyone stood around and laughed. Not bashing cats and dogs ...just making a point.

A great fact is that in the US yearly... The common house cat makes more live prey kills (be it a bird, wild snake, rat, or somebodys pet rodent), than any other animal in the wild or in captivity. My snakes eat once a week... while I had a cat who would leave a pile of kills by the slider in one day.

Food for thought.

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"domestic cats have been documented as the greatest single cause of bird mortality across the us. bird kills by other human causes including hunting, collisions against windows and communication towers and kills by cars all combined are less than a 1/3 of the cat predation. domestic cats of the us kill on the order of a billion 1,000,000 birds annually"

and thats all just for fun for the cat but then again cats are cute and snuggle in your lap and purr sweet nothings in your ear, so thats cool.

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and thats all just for fun for the cat but then again cats are cute and snuggle in your lap and purr sweet nothings in your ear, so thats cool.

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And then they attach themselves to your face, doling out bite wounds that become infected and actually require antibiotics for. And who cares that our lovely dogs and cats can carry rabies and other diseases that can be passed on to us.. Oh well! They're cute and fuzzy.. :confused:

Another thing I hear when I say "It is nature" is "Keepign a snake in a littel tankis not nature" As if they could differenciate a den from a hide in the wild.


Can they?:weirdface

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Originally Posted by _Venom_

Another thing I hear when I say "It is nature" is "Keepign a snake in a littel tankis not nature" As if they could differenciate a den from a hide in the wild.


Can they?:weirdface

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I Don't think most captive snakes would considering that life as they know it has always been in an enclosed environment.