Pit Bulls

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Originally Posted by nebby3103

This is starting to remind me of the nature/nurture debate. It's NOT JUST THE OWNERS, and it's NOT JUST THE DOGS. The dogs are predisposed to be aggressive. They can range from not very aggressive to killers on leashes. They are not born a blank slate, the are born with an aggressive instinct. Can you completely destroy that instinct through good training and responsible ownership? Probably not. But you can reduce the degree to which the trait is expressed.

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I have to completly agree on this!

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Originally Posted by lillyorchid

Great post Tyree! I too worked at a shelter actually for the SPCA for a few months when I was 17. I know A LOT of pits were put down because no one wanted them. I also know that a lot of the other breeds of dogs that were adopted many came back to us. I didn't work there long because I couldn't handle their rules (pretty much just do what you are told and ask no questions about anything and god forbid it was about a certain cat or dog!!) and just being in that kind of environment really takes a toll on one's emotions.

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thats exactly what happen at my shelter! nobody cared anymore, and i was there for the animals......we had no say on who was put down, and if you had a favorite....on your day off they would PTS without telling you......you come in looking for your buddy, and he's gone! THE WORST THING EVER! ----my manager was stealing the money people would bring in, for the shelter....i got into a fist fight with him before i left! (i'm not condoning fighting, and by no means am i a fighter but this guy had it coming)


he was fired soon after for his actions........oh and was brought up on chargers for his actions!

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Originally Posted by nebby3103

This is starting to remind me of the nature/nurture debate. It's NOT JUST THE OWNERS, and it's NOT JUST THE DOGS. The dogs are predisposed to be aggressive. They can range from not very aggressive to killers on leashes. They are not born a blank slate, the are born with an aggressive instinct. Can you completely destroy that instinct through good training and responsible ownership? Probably not. But you can reduce the degree to which the trait is expressed.

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You have to show the animal the right way to behave! just like any dog! but what were trying to say is Pit Bulls are very strong dogs (will and strength) and they need a little more attention then your average dog! simple you will not train a pit in one session of (Pet Smart training) not gonna happen.....you need continuous, training........and these idiots (not all but most that have them) need training themselves!

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Originally Posted by nebby3103

This is starting to remind me of the nature/nurture debate. It's NOT JUST THE OWNERS, and it's NOT JUST THE DOGS. The dogs are predisposed to be aggressive. They can range from not very aggressive to killers on leashes. They are not born a blank slate, the are born with an aggressive instinct. Can you completely destroy that instinct through good training and responsible ownership? Probably not. But you can reduce the degree to which the trait is expressed.

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I know I said I was done, but great post. Also, I don't know why some of you are still comparing Pits to toy dogs. Even if they were as instinctively aggressive as pits, which they aren't, I think a pit would be the last dog on a list of dogs I would want to attack me. If a poodle ever bit me I would probably laugh before picking it up by it's scruff and tossing it into a tree. Most dogs, even if they are little hellions, are not anywhere near as dangerous as a pit bull. Do a Google Images search for pitbull bite, then do the same for poodle bite. Case and point.

Wow, aren't we nasty.

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Originally Posted by nebby3103

You must've been the single child-victim of a poodle attack since 1982. I'm sure the 495 children who've been attacked by pitbulls would really sympathize.

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And yeah, if you were a little kid and a poodle attacked you, you probably wouldn't laugh.

My Pit bull spent Easter Sunday in a back yard playing ball with 6 kids only one of which he knew and was as gentle as a kitten.
One of the problems with Pits, Rots, Shepards or really any dog is people don't teach the rules, what is acceptable behavior. Sometimes that takes a little tough love but that how their brains work. Pack leaders don't hand out happy face stickers to the pack to enforce behavior. Dogs are starving for guidance, it's how they are wired and how the survive in a pack. If you don't dominate, control and teach your dog correct behavior he will make up his own rules and enforce them on any one he feels is below him in the pecking order.
Like snakes people get animals and don't understand behavior, don't educate themselves about the animal and even reward aggressive behavior because it's cool. It's true Pit's have very competitive behavior. When that is fed, uncontroled and allowed you have a problem. My dog trainer told me don't even play tug of war with a dog. You are insighting competitive behavior which is how dogs learn who is the pack leader. Dogs compete by biting and aggressive behavior, the winner becomes pack leader. You must teach your dog that it is not acceptable behavior and your dog will not be aggressive. My Vet has been bitten by Chiuwahwa"s(spelling check) more than any other dog because owners let them get away with murder. Any dog can do harm but obviously big ones more. It is the responsibility of people to educate themselves before getting any animal but we all know that it is rarely done. My pit behaves like a soldier and is as cuddly as a kitten and has a great life because he was taught how to have one. He goes to work with me everyday and is everybodies best friend. When we have no guidance we have chaos.

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Originally Posted by westcoastjungle

My Pit bull spent Easter Sunday in a back yard playing ball with 6 kids only one of which he knew and was as gentle as a kitten.
One of the problems with Pits, Rots, Shepards or really any dog is people don't teach the rules, what is acceptable behavior. Sometimes that takes a little tough love but that how their brains work. Pack leaders don't hand out happy face stickers to the pack to enforce behavior. Dogs are starving for guidance, it's how they are wired and how the survive in a pack. If you don't dominate, control and teach your dog correct behavior he will make up his own rules and enforce them on any one he feels is below him in the pecking order.
Like snakes people get animals and don't understand behavior, don't educate themselves about the animal and even reward aggressive behavior because it's cool. It's true Pit's have very competitive behavior. When that is fed, uncontroled and allowed you have a problem. My dog trainer told me don't even play tug of war with a dog. You are insighting competitive behavior which is how dogs learn who is the pack leader. Dogs compete by biting and aggressive behavior, the winner becomes pack leader. You must teach your dog that it is not acceptable behavior and your dog will not be aggressive. My Vet has been bitten by Chiuwahwa"s(spelling check) more than any other dog because owners let them get away with murder. Any dog can do harm but obviously big ones more. It is the responsibility of people to educate themselves before getting any animal but we all know that it is rarely done. My pit behaves like a soldier and is as cuddly as a kitten and has a great life because he was taught how to have one. He goes to work with me everyday and is everybodies best friend. When we have no guidance we have chaos.

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Good post :D

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Originally Posted by reediculous

thats exactly what happen at my shelter! nobody cared anymore, and i was there for the animals......we had no say on who was put down, and if you had a favorite....on your day off they would PTS without telling you......you come in looking for your buddy, and he's gone!

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YES! The SPCA around me did the SAME THING! We were not able to ask about the animals, also we were not allowed to tell people why they were surrenderer or their past history.... then again we weren't supposed to know anything ourselves. Were not allowed to ask why said dog or cat was not there the next day, were not allowed to know if it was adopted or PTS, etc. HORRIBLE HORRIBLE things went on behind those closed doors. I was there for the animals, but the people working there made me HATE every second of it. I use to come home and just cry my eyes out to my father and boyfriend at the time!!!

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Originally Posted by PythonWallace

People can make all the same arguments about anacondas compared to, let's say ball python. Yes there are some docile ones out there, they aren't all bad or mean, but they will still both attack more often and do way more damage than a ball python period.

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Bad analogy, IMO. (not to pick on you :D ) Yes pit bulls were bred to fight back in the day, and are still bred irresponsibly today by the most IGNORANT of thugs and sold to all their buddies as status symbols because these men are generally lacking manhood and need a dog to make up the difference for them. I have 4 female pits/ pitXs in my house and not one of them is inclined to attack ANYTHING! Oops, ok one of the pit mixes will attack rats and gobble them up like skittles or did as a puppy. LOL

I'll concede that a pit and an anaconda will do significant damage, but that is the only thing that gives your analogy any credence what so ever... IMO you can't really compare snakes to dogs... A pit who is unstable is a HUGE danger and a major safety concern. Pits were bred to be dog aggressive though, not human aggressive, and if you study the history a little you'll see that they washed the opponents' dogs before matches and that there were dogmen, not necessarily the owners, in the pits breaking up the fight if a dog fanged or something... if a dog attacked a dogman, it was culled and no decendents were produced... these days thuggish trash breeds FOR those traits and sells the offspring to the dumbest SOBs they can find and guess what?! Someone gets hurt...

Pits aren't more inclined to attack, check out their standings with the American Temperment Testing Society atts.org I believe. They beat out mutts, if I recall correctly.

Unfortunately pits are owned by and large *with glaring and wonderful exceptions* by the WORST dog owners out there... These people have their own theories on how to raise a dog be it simple neglect and a miserable life on a chain, physical abuse, denied socialization, fed gun powder... teased till they bite and then rewarded for it... or some mess with the puppies till the whine and then they beat them for weakness... I've seen pics of bait dogs with no nose who was euthanized just after the evidence photos were taken... dogs with drains running out of them on the mend from the horrors that are dog fighting...

This is not a breed for just anyone. They need to be fully stimulated and socialized. They need to be neutered (IMO) and not faced with excess frustrations like living on a chain etc. You need to be on your A game all the time (esp. at first) as their leader to ensure that when they're too big and strong for you to physically handle that they already understand that they're YOUR SUBORDINATE. You pretty much need to know what you're doing and be responsible... but boy are they worth it! I'm 5'2 and I can walk all four of the dogs ranging from 50-70 pounds (I can't believe the puppy is already 50 pounds OMG she's going to be huge!) The neighbor kids come over and run and play with them. I foster cats and kittens and Proof -the biggest one, my soul mate, from game lines- is the best kitten mommy you've ever seen. I've seen her defend kittens from overzealous dogs as well as just generally nurture kittens, she'll groom them and carry them in her mouth (scary sight, but the only damage is a wet kitten) Matter of fact, Proof has helped break up one huge dog fight and she's also laid out a dog who attacked another one of my dogs and my ex on a walk. She's never drawn blood though... ever. The other day the neighbor kids walked each of the dogs in a rotation around the block (with me there of course!) Their parents have asked that when I replace the fence that I put in a gate so their kids can still come over and play with my pit bulls.

I have sooo much to say on this subject, but I know if I keep going on and on that people will not read my posts LOL, so I'll cut it short (heh)

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Originally Posted by gibbrishclown

Bad analogy, IMO. (not to pick on you :D ) Yes pit bulls were bred to fight back in the day, and are still bred irresponsibly today by the most IGNORANT of thugs and sold to all their buddies as status symbols because these men are generally lacking manhood and need a dog to make up the difference for them. I have 4 female pits/ pitXs in my house and not one of them is inclined to attack ANYTHING! Oops, ok one of the pit mixes will attack rats and gobble them up like skittles or did as a puppy. LOL

I'll concede that a pit and an anaconda will do significant damage, but that is the only thing that gives your analogy any credence what so ever... IMO you can't really compare snakes to dogs... A pit who is unstable is a HUGE danger and a major safety concern. Pits were bred to be dog aggressive though, not human aggressive, and if you study the history a little you'll see that they washed the opponents' dogs before matches and that there were dogmen, not necessarily the owners, in the pits breaking up the fight if a dog fanged or something... if a dog attacked a dogman, it was culled and no decendents were produced... these days thuggish trash breeds FOR those traits and sells the offspring to the dumbest SOBs they can find and guess what?! Someone gets hurt...

Pits aren't more inclined to attack, check out their standings with the American Temperment Testing Society atts.org I believe. They beat out mutts, if I recall correctly.

Unfortunately pits are owned by and large *with glaring and wonderful exceptions* by the WORST dog owners out there... These people have their own theories on how to raise a dog be it simple neglect and a miserable life on a chain, physical abuse, denied socialization, fed gun powder... teased till they bite and then rewarded for it... or some mess with the puppies till the whine and then they beat them for weakness... I've seen pics of bait dogs with no nose who was euthanized just after the evidence photos were taken... dogs with drains running out of them on the mend from the horrors that are dog fighting...

This is not a breed for just anyone. They need to be fully stimulated and socialized. They need to be neutered (IMO) and not faced with excess frustrations like living on a chain etc. You need to be on your A game all the time (esp. at first) as their leader to ensure that when they're too big and strong for you to physically handle that they already understand that they're YOUR SUBORDINATE. You pretty much need to know what you're doing and be responsible... but boy are they worth it! I'm 5'2 and I can walk all four of the dogs ranging from 50-70 pounds (I can't believe the puppy is already 50 pounds OMG she's going to be huge!) The neighbor kids come over and run and play with them. I foster cats and kittens and Proof -the biggest one, my soul mate, from game lines- is the best kitten mommy you've ever seen. I've seen her defend kittens from overzealous dogs as well as just generally nurture kittens, she'll groom them and carry them in her mouth (scary sight, but the only damage is a wet kitten) Matter of fact, Proof has helped break up one huge dog fight and she's also laid out a dog who attacked another one of my dogs and my ex on a walk. She's never drawn blood though... ever. The other day the neighbor kids walked each of the dogs in a rotation around the block (with me there of course!) Their parents have asked that when I replace the fence that I put in a gate so their kids can still come over and play with my pit bulls.

I have sooo much to say on this subject, but I know if I keep going on and on that people will not read my posts LOL, so I'll cut it short (heh)

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Beautiful :sweeet: :sweeet: very nice post!