Animal Rights Groups Discussion

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Originally Posted by Lizardlicks

It's going to be a mix of australorps, sliver laced wyandottes, buff orpingtons, and speckled sussex. I already have a slw roo and hen, and a buff orp hen, but I'm really excited for the australorps and sussex! I'm probably just going to keep a couple I like of each and sell the rest. Might also try hatching out some of my own eggs this year.

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Lucky! Wyandottes are my favorites. I also love buffs...:)

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Originally Posted by FlynnTheBP

I find that the smaller private owned welfare groups are the best. They usually have similar principles to what we've discussed so far. There is also a lot of misinformation about the exotic pet trade and trafficking. Lots of groups, like said PETA, spread this misinformation for their own purposes. Many snakes in the pet trade are either CB or harvested ethically from the wild. There are always exceptions, but they are less common then you would think.

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While I agree with the fact that most captive bred animals likely come from humane conditions, or at least would hope that is true, most wild caught species will experience some sort of unethical treatment at some point or another. Whether it be in the way they are caught or shipped to not receiving the care they deserve once they arrive at the distribution center. Most of these species are not well understood or are very cheap so they be subjected to substandard conditions even once they arrive into someone's collection. I honestly think it is more likely mistreatment of animals is more common than you think.

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Originally Posted by bcr229

Many of the exotic animals we keep originate in parts of the world where people treat each other with less regard than we treat our pets. I won't argue that that side of the industry doesn't have its issues - because it does - but for that reason I also don't purchase from those sources.

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This is very true but as hobbyist who have a deep care for these animals we must take a stand against this mistreatment. I think your stance of not buying from these sources, if done widespread through out the hobby, is a great way to accomplish this goal. Once they can no longer sell animals in substandard condition they will change their practices to match our standards, if only for the money. The way it is now if you purchase from any large online retailer of wild caught species you are more than likely supporting this terrible side of the industry.

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Originally Posted by AntTheDestroyer

While I agree with the fact that most captive bred animals likely come from humane conditions, or at least would hope that is true, most wild caught species will experience some sort of unethical treatment at some point or another. Whether it be in the way they are caught or shipped to not receiving the care they deserve once they arrive at the distribution center. Most of these species are not well understood or are very cheap so they be subjected to substandard conditions even once they arrive into someone's collection. I honestly think it is more likely mistreatment of animals is more common than you think.



This is very true but as hobbyist who have a deep care for these animals we must take a stand against this mistreatment. I think your stance of not buying from these sources, if done widespread through out the hobby, is a great way to accomplish this goal. Once they can no longer sell animals in substandard condition they will change their practices to match our standards, if only for the money. The way it is now if you purchase from any large online retailer of wild caught species you are more than likely supporting this terrible side of the industry.

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Sorry I wasn't more clear, I did not mean that the actual wild trade was not ridden with issues, I meant that a lot of people think that most of snakes are WC when so few actually are these days. Still way too many, but also a small fraction of the pet population. Just in my experience though, a lot of guests and even family members tell me my CB leopard geckos or CB Greek tortoise were smuggled in/captured by poachers. :rolleyes: Nope, they were most certainly not.

Poultry keeper here. Current flock is Silver Dorkings, with an older buff Orph. and an elderly bantam cochin. Would like to get ducks, but they can really raise the feed costs, and then there is the mess! I also want pigeons, but right now we are focused in getting the milk goats back into production. One can only deal with so many projects at once.

WHO on Earth could possibly think domestic ducks could survive "free"?
Wow.

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Originally Posted by distaff

Poultry keeper here. Current flock is Silver Dorkings, with an older buff Orph. and an elderly bantam cochin. Would like to get ducks, but they can really raise the feed costs, and then there is the mess! I also want pigeons, but right now we are focused in getting the milk goats back into production. One can only deal with so many projects at once.

WHO on Earth could possibly think domestic ducks could survive "free"?
Wow.

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Exactly. They just aren't wild animals. Once we domesticate something, we need to take full responsibility of it. That means keeping them safe and secure, not just throwing them out. Oh, and the ducks are very messy and food is expensive, but it can really cut down costs to let them range and forage all day. I also supplement their diet with veggies, greens, and a little fruit. I've always wanted pigeons as well, particularly homing pigeons. Unfortunately I have my hands full; too many pets I guess. :D

My chickens are all heritage breeds and forage wonderfully, so with their roo, if they ever decided screw the humans, I wouldn't doubt they'd go feral and start a population easily. Ducks tho, that's just. What. I've seen people try to do the same with rabbits. They just let them go into the woods and three weeks later bunny is food or road kill or frozen bun-cicle because they haven't got any survival instincts.

(Aaaah I want goats, I'd love a little herd of nubians with a boer stud. Raise the babies for meat, keep the good milkers that get big and try for a nicely balance meat/dairy cross).

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Originally Posted by Lizardlicks

My chickens are all heritage breeds and forage wonderfully, so with their roo, if they ever decided screw the humans, I wouldn't doubt they'd go feral and start a population easily. Ducks tho, that's just. What. I've seen people try to do the same with rabbits. They just let them go into the woods and three weeks later bunny is food or road kill or frozen bun-cicle because they haven't got any survival instincts.

(Aaaah I want goats, I'd love a little herd of nubians with a boer stud. Raise the babies for meat, keep the good milkers that get big and try for a nicely balance meat/dairy cross).

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Yep. I had friends, notice the past tense, who released their rabbits and guinea pigs, as well as a baby corn snake outside. I can 200 percent guarantee you that none of those animals lasted a night outside. I felt absolutely terrible about the snake, they didn't tell me before the kids did it or else I would have taken it in temporarily. I really dislike rabbits and guinea pigs, but I still feel bad for them as well. The friends found the remains of a few. The rest were never seen again.

Depending on the area, the corn snake might have. They are native to the US and have a pretty broad range in the south. Unless it was one of those non-wild type morphs that would look like a glowstick to a predator.

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Originally Posted by Lizardlicks

Depending on the area, the corn snake might have. They are native to the US and have a pretty broad range in the south. Unless it was one of those non-wild type morphs that would look like a glowstick to a predator.

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Yes, this. This is why I have no doubt there is at least one berm within 200 yards of where I sit right now. Some animals have zero problem going back to the wild. Snakes, lizards, cats, pigs have zero problem thriving if the environment is right.

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Originally Posted by JodanOrNoDan

Yes, this. This is why I have no doubt there is at least one berm within 200 yards of where I sit right now. Some animals have zero problem going back to the wild. Snakes, lizards, cats, pigs have zero problem thriving if the environment is right.

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Poor thing was an albino. He stuck out like a sore thumb.