Let's Discuss Dietary Requirements for Ball Pythons

Interesting topic and something I also wondered. I never was able to feed my adults weekly as they just wouldn't be hungry that often.

Do you think there might be any link between fasting ball pythons and being overfed?

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Originally Posted by Kaorte

Interesting topic and something I also wondered. I never was able to feed my adults weekly as they just wouldn't be hungry that often.

Do you think there might be any link between fasting ball pythons and being overfed?

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I don't know, but I've heard tell of a link between overfeeding and putting on too much fat, and fasting. I've also heard tell of a link between a female being too fatty and being more likely to throw slugs or fail to eggs at all.

Just from my own observation again, but I've never been able to consistently feed adult BPs rats 10 - 15% of their body weight. They would take one or two, usually just one, over a couple weeks and then stop eating. My only exception to that at this point is a rather large male. So I, too, feed smalls (like, 35-45 gram smalls) to all the ball pythons a year and over, offered once a week unless the snake is in shed or some other snaky life event is going on. (For instance, I didn't offer any food to Dahlia while she was brooding her eggs.)

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Originally Posted by Alicia

I don't know, but I've heard tell of a link between overfeeding and putting on too much fat, and fasting. I've also heard tell of a link between a female being too fatty and being more likely to throw slugs or fail to eggs at all.

Just from my own observation again, but I've never been able to consistently feed adult BPs rats 10 - 15% of their body weight. They would take one or two, usually just one, over a couple weeks and then stop eating. My only exception to that at this point is a rather large male. So I, too, feed smalls (like, 35-45 gram smalls) to all the ball pythons a year and over, offered once a week unless the snake is in shed or some other snaky life event is going on. (For instance, I didn't offer any food to Dahlia while she was brooding her eggs.)

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I think its highly likely. They have so much fat built up that they are just like "dude, I'm cool for a bit". I've had a BP go off feed for over 8 months. She lost a little weight, but nothing noteworthy. One day she just felt like eating again.

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Originally Posted by Kaorte

Interesting topic and something I also wondered. I never was able to feed my adults weekly as they just wouldn't be hungry that often.

Do you think there might be any link between fasting ball pythons and being overfed?

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How long does it take a ball python to digest an "appropriately" size meal?

What does that length tell us about the metabolism of a ball python? What does the speed of metabolism tell us about their dietary requirements?

If a psammophylax acutus - a fairly active African colubrid - digests a meal in under 48 hours and a ball python which is fairly inactive takes 10 to 14 days, what logical conclusion could we draw from that?

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Originally Posted by Skiploder

How long does it take a ball python to digest an "appropriately" size meal?

What does that length tell us about the metabolism of a ball python? What does the speed of metabolism tell us about their dietary requirements?

If a psammophylax acutus - a fairly active African colubrid - digests a meal in under 48 hours and a ball python which is fairly inactive takes 10 to 14 days, what logical conclusion could we draw from that?

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That they really don't NEED to eat every 7 days! ~gasp~

:gj:

I remember a guy at NARBC giving a talk about his feeding habits and it went a little something like this... "when I remember" LOL

Aerobic and Anaerobic Metabolism During Activity in Snakes - John A. Ruben - Journal of Comparative Physiology 1976

Bottom Line: energy production correlates directly and irrefutably with their activity modes.

For example, are they active or passive hunters? Do they den or roam? In other words, the more activity they require to successfully survive, the more energy they need...

...and the faster they burn (metabolize) that energy.

A coachwhip needs more food than a rosy boa.

So if:

1. We always hear the 10% to 15% rule thrown out there.
2. Studies were done decades ago that illustrate that metabolism is linked with energy requirements which are linked to activity.
3. The speed of that metabolism correlates to same.
4. The studies have been done on enough snake species to draw some intelligent conclusions.
5. Studies have been done on enough snake species to have an intelligent discussion.
6. Overfeeding is enough of an issue that vets note it as do many keepers.

Why do we not come up with a new guideline to advise new keepers?

I thought the 10-15% rule was for babies/juveniles up to 500 grams, and then offering a small rat weekly after that was sufficient for males, while a building female could take a medium rat weekly and look for more, but otherwise a small was fine.


As a sidebar to the input side of the digestion equation, has anyone else noted that just prior to ending a months-long fast that their BP's go poop?

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Originally Posted by Skiploder

Why do we not come up with a new guideline to advise new keepers?

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I dunno! Lets do it.

I would assume we would have to address the feeding amount for hatchlings, juveniles, and once they are mature, adult females and males all separately.

Hatchlings
Juveniles
Adult Males
Adult Females

What would you consider an approximate gram weight to be for each of these groups? I assume the line between Juvies and Adults to be blurry between males and females since males are generally 'mature' at a smaller size.

Once that is figured out, we could approximate a a gram amount (or percentage) of rodent that the animal needs based on their activity levels.


This is an important topic. I haven't used the 10-15% rule in many years because I just eyeball it or feed whatever is on hand. I know I have seen many obese ball pythons. You can't just feed them every time they are hungry. Its like giving a kid as much food as they want and being confused when they get fat. I even saw one posted on the forum today, and the keeper was proud of their size. :( People will overfeed hoping to breed them sooner, but all that ends up happening is they slug out.

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Originally Posted by bcr229

As a sidebar to the input side of the digestion equation, has anyone else noted that just prior to ending a months-long fast that their BP's go poop?

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I have one girl that's going to be absolutely starving come feeding day following her 2+ month fast and massive BM this week. How does something poop so much when they haven't eaten in so long? Metabolism is a funny thing...

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Originally Posted by Eric Alan

I have one girl that's going to be absolutely starving come feeding day following her 2+ month fast and massive BM this week. How does something poop so much when they haven't eaten in so long? Metabolism is a funny thing...

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Eric, studies have been done on pythons with regards to seasonal changes in body temperature, which affect many biological functions - most noteworthy - digestion.

These studies proved that elevated temperature was associated with a faster and larger metabolic increase after ingestion. They also showed that the time required to return to fasting levels was measurably longer at lower temperatures.

The term specific dynamic action (SDA) is used to describe the increase in metabolism following food ingestion. This specific study showed that the integrated SDA response was not affected by temperature. The conclusion was drawn that specific snake species choose to raise their body temperatures during digestion to reduce the overall time required for digestion.

What does this gibberish mean?

Higher temps mean faster digestion. The studies species of python did not, however, need elevated temperatures to digest. Which may be the sane answer to the oft asked question "Why is my snake on the cold side after eating?"

Snakes who were held at lower temperatures digested their food more slowly and needed to eat less (returned to fasting levels - which indicates CO2 Uptake and oxygen levels measured prior to feeding).

Bottom line, the longer the snake takes to digest there food, the less they need to eat.

Which leads me to my next question. Ball pythons do not bask. They are nocturnal and den during the day, specifically seeking burrows within a specific temperature range. The question therefore is:

Why provide a basking (hot spot)?

Several successful keepers do not do it, digestion of food is not dependent on it and they do not do it in the wild.

Also, how many new keepers incorrectly use uncontrolled heat sources and injure or kill their animals while trying to provide a husbandry parameter that this particular species does not need.