What is the most humane way to "brain" a rat?

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Originally Posted by Reinz

Oh I forgot, those 300 parts per million!

The same ones I have been breathing for over 50 years.

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I'm almost hesitant to ask, but oh well: You've been in a closed environment sucking in exhaust directly from the pipe for 50 years?

He likes to party. I'm down. Jokes.

Foolish1 - big of you to apologize.

I was unaware of previous threads and content. I understand your frustration.

Hey, I've been around!:)

Same discussion. I chime in on page 2.
http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...Ugh-help/page2

Originally Posted by Foolish1http://ball-pythons.net/forums/image...post-right.pngI drive 2 hours for food twice a week. My babies like the heart still beating. I hold the mouse by its tail and smash it against the wall quick to break their neck. That way they don't injure my friends. A lot of time the twitching from the neck break stimulates feeding response. If she still won't eat, take her out for a half hour while someone else cleans everything I'm her cage. They won't eat if it smells like their filth. If they smell it prey smells it so it shuts them off. Clean everything out, add a hide for her. Break the mouses neck, throw it in tank, put your baby in the tank and cover it with a towel for 2 hours. I did this step by step and broke a 3 week no eating habit on my smallest girl. Cheers.





Not posted by Deb.

Really??? You smash the poor mouse up against the wall!!! There are far more humane ways to kill a prey item. This is just barbaric. Please find better ways to euthanize a mouse. To the OP, please DO NOT do this to a live mouse. Stick with other advice you have been given

My response

Barbaric? I run an organic farm. I love and care for every one of my animals. Snapping it's neck is the fastest way for it to not feel pain. Takes literally a half a second before it's stops sending electrical impulses. I would rather break the mouses neck quick than have it take a chunk out of a two thousand dollar snake. Barbaric! Haha. Send them off to the showers for gassing. That's humane right. Last time humans did that everyone was really happy. Please.

My first interaction with Deb.

http://ball-pythons.net/forums/image...quote_icon.png Originally Posted by Foolish1 http://ball-pythons.net/forums/image...post-right.png
Honestly blown away right now. There's proper protocol for humanely killing feeder mice? I understand not torturing them, but the amount of time they realize they have been picked up to the time they are unable to process thought or pain is within a second. Ever been chocked by someone trying to kill you? I have. It is very fun to say the least. Jokes. You literally gasp and fight for every last breath hoping it isn't your last. Hell when it's my turn to go, PLEASE break my neck. Don't let me suffer.

Edit. Spelt unable wrong.



Be blown away all you want smashing an animal's head against a wall is inhuman.

You either let nature take it's course or you respect the prey and euthanize it humanely this means cervical dislocation (only people efficient at it should attempt it) and CO2

My reply quoted with her response.

http://ball-pythons.net/forums/image...quote_icon.png Originally Posted by Foolish1 http://ball-pythons.net/forums/image...post-right.png
Let nature take its course on captive born and raised animals. Okay hun. I don't want to derail this thread and I am not trying to offend. The English method of killing chickens is a quick neck break. Wonder why.



Number 1 not your Hun number two read again, cervical dislocation is considered human not throwing an animal on a wall.

And than people wonder why people have such a negative view of snake keepers....could not possibly be because of people like you?

Instantly attacks me.

My reply with her comment

http://ball-pythons.net/forums/image...quote_icon.png Originally Posted by Foolish1 http://ball-pythons.net/forums/image...post-right.png
If c02 was humane. We would use it on death row inmates.

Quoted from other forums
One of the main objections to gas chambers in general is that the person being executed doesn't cooperate (which really shouldn't be a surprise). If the person being executed would breathe normally, or even close to it, the currently used methods are painless and humane. What happens instead is that the victim struggles painfully not to breathe and ends up thrashing around and gasping for breath. I've never watched a gas chamber execution (and have no desire to do so) but from what I've read they are quite gruesome to watch. It's definitely not a quick and painless death in practice.

Carbon monoxide was one of the gases used by the Nazis in WWII. It is currently used in some animal shelters, but there is a push by animal activists to ban gas chambers for animal euthanasia which is causing a decline in their use.

CO₂ ??? What inhumane idiot suggested that? Of course the animals go nuts. Their entire respiratory system is telling them that they are dying. They die frantic and in pain. CO is, as the OP suggest the humane gas. Or N₂. I can't help but wonder if somewhere down the line somebody with less than useful knowledge in physiology missed the significant distinction.

In all seriousness, I would be wanting a talk with the ethics committee overseeing the research.

There have been threads before on this, and generally N₂ seems about as humane as you could get. A gradual increase in concentration over time might avoid the worst issues. Given this is GQ I will grit my teeth and refrain from further comment on executions.

Pjen wrote: "The unspoken rule is that the person must be aware of what is happening and suffer enough to satisfy death penalty proponents, but not so much that it offends death penalty opponents."



This is me talking now. Again I don't wish to derail or offend. I love chemicals and physics and biology. C02 is cruel.



And there we go comparing apple to oranges last time I check the national veterinary association was not in charge of death row inmates????

Comparing humans to animals in this case just made you lose the very little newbie's credibility you had ;)

Again attacked.

Me trying to be civil.

I don't bludgeon them against a wall. I know how to quickly snap their neck with a fast precise motion. I feel like we are attacking each other for no reason. People don't like snake keepers because of me? That's not quite the moderator response. Do you know me? Do you know how passionate I am about animals and predators who are cast bad judgment. I don't run a shelter for Wolf dogs or take people's snakes they can't care for. That wouldn't be me. I don't go around my town and talk with locals every day about reptiles. I don't change people's minds and lives by letting them experience my best friends. That isn't me. Come on. Let's not get personal. I called you hun as a way like I would call someone bud, or darling. Just my way of speaking. Again no offense was intended

Well there it is. If I get banned or another infraction so be it. I just want to share knowledge and love to the world. I sincerely apologize to anyone I have offended with my tactics. I love this community and every one. Community advances the world. Happy days and much love all.

Her replies are in italics.

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Originally Posted by Deborah

Have you done it yourself?

I can tell you that everyone you talked to does not do it right and too much CO2 is filling the kill tank at once hence the gasping and panic.

When done right they will slowly fall asleep, this can be achieve with a CO2 regulator, than again people need to educate themselves. :rolleyes:

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And SLOWLY is not what we want !!! We want FAST and PAINLESS !!

But I did some reading on that AVMA link that you posted, and Manually Applied Blunt Force Trauma, is an ACCEPTED METHOD !!!!


M3.4 MANUALLY APPLIED BLUNT FORCE TRAUMA TO THE HEAD
Euthanasia by manually applied blunt force trauma to the head must be evaluated in terms of the anatomic features of the species on which it is to be performed, the skill of those performing it, the number of animals to be euthanized, and the environment in which it is to be conducted. Manually applied blunt force trauma to the head can be a humane method of euthanasia for neonatal animals with thin craniums if a single sharp blow delivered to the central skull bones with sufficient force can produce immediate depression of the CNS and destruction of brain tissue. When properly performed, loss of consciousness is rapid. Manually applied blunt force trauma to the head has been used primarily to euthanize small laboratory animals with thin craniums.334,340,341 It has also been ap:cens0r:plied for euthanasia of young piglets.

Thank You for posting that link

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Originally Posted by albinos_rule

I think you are confusing braining with dispatching the rat before you feed it.

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Yes that what I meant. I have always been told by my dad that it was braining. TIL

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Originally Posted by mohawk

And SLOWLY is not what we want !!! We want FAST and PAINLESS !!

But I did some reading on that AVMA link that you posted, and Manually Applied Blunt Force Trauma, is an ACCEPTED METHOD !!!!


M3.4 MANUALLY APPLIED BLUNT FORCE TRAUMA TO THE HEAD
Euthanasia by manually applied blunt force trauma to the head must be evaluated in terms of the anatomic features of the species on which it is to be performed, the skill of those performing it, the number of animals to be euthanized, and the environment in which it is to be conducted. Manually applied blunt force trauma to the head can be a humane method of euthanasia for neonatal animals with thin craniums if a single sharp blow delivered to the central skull bones with sufficient force can produce immediate depression of the CNS and destruction of brain tissue. When properly performed, loss of consciousness is rapid. Manually applied blunt force trauma to the head has been used primarily to euthanize small laboratory animals with thin craniums.334,340,341 It has also been ap:cens0r:plied for euthanasia of young piglets.

Thank You for posting that link

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I don't think it is possible for me to laugh any more. Already laughing out loud and rolling on the floor laughing. Lol and rofl accomplished.

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Originally Posted by Deborah

It is barbaric and inhuman and you have NO BUSINESS feeding pre-killed or f/t if you cannot euthanize the prey HUMANELY which means CO2 or cervical dislocation.

Owning snakes means having respect for the prey item also, wonder why people look at us snake owners the way they do,

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Okay Deborah I understand that you have been here longer than me and respect your opinion but in my original post I politely asked to not be attacked for my choices as I am trying to be better educated in care for both feeders and snakes. So Deborah if you can't resist attacking me for not doing something "right" (the way you do it) then just don't reply please. Again I am new to the hobby so I am still learning. I understand what you are trying to do but judging me on how I feed my snakes is not the way to do it, besides it's not like I microwave them or make them suffer besides the minute or two they are conscience and I agree that that is too much suffering for any animal.

Who can we message about being attacked by mods? I have seen this for a month now.