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Re: Euthanization Methods - Which do YOU think is right?
All this is fine and dandy for the people who have a few snakes but what about the big guys??
I know for a fact that many breeders who produce hundreds if not thousands of reptiles a year do not inject or gas. This is much too costly and not proven to end the animals life quickly. You need to think about it on a larger scale. I doubt you will see any large scale breeders replying to this post in a serious manner if at all. When you have to cull multiple animals per year due to birth defects or injury everything changes. Bigger breeders stay away from questions like this due to the backlash. This is true for many topics in fact..
My choice is not listed. I would first put the animal in the refridgerator for awhile. Then the freezer. This would cause a type of forced hybernation. No these snakes do not hybernate but cold does shut them down. The body would be completely unresponsive and freezing would then have no ill effects.
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Re: Euthanization Methods - Which do YOU think is right?
I actually did a bit of reading and asked a question or two of a colleague and found a very complex issue. It seems there is problems with most ways. Decapitation isn't great as the brain can live for as long as an hour! Decapitation followed by pithing that seems far too blood thirsty I can ever imagine that.
"Euthanasia can be done by destroying the brain with a sharp blow to the head, on the middle and just posterior to the eyes" Steve Barton DVM. He goes on to state that a weak or mis directed blow may no be lethal.
Gas as well but not co2 (I stand corrected from my previous post) chloroform, methoxyflurane and carbon monoxide. I don't think that would be readily available.
"Freezing has been used as a humane method to kill small reptiles under one pound in weight. Although low temperatures do result in a state of torpor, the formation of ice crystals in the tissue is quite painful. Freezing should only be done to anesthetized animals"
Injection seems ok but a vet must perform the task. In my case that means waiting for a vet.
"In a perfect world euthanasia would never be necessary. Since it sometimes is, the goal of this column is to promote the use of humane methods and to educate readers that some commonly used methods, such as freezing and decapitation, are inappropriate."
Steve Barten, DVM
Again I hope that this never becomes necessary!
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Re: Euthanization Methods - Which do YOU think is right?
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackcrystal22
No offense, but that is terrible.
CO2 is NOT an option for reptiles. Similar to the injection, the slow metabolism prevents them from dying at the same rate as mammals. You cannot compare mammals and people to reptiles. Reptiles do not need nearly as much oxygen, and therefore would feel the suffocation very slowly and painfully.
If anything is inhumane, that is it.
Funny how if anything is inhumane that is it huh???
Well unfourtunately for you this method takes a matter of seconds and they are rendered lifeless. So as for your respiration rate of a reptile I guess it will have many factors to way on other than your voiceless opinion on the most inhumane way............ Which I feer not to say has never used this method nor seen it used and therefore have no clue...it will depend on a few factors.
1.)As to the amount of saturation the gas has on the containment system used. I USE 5000PPM INSTANTANEOUS.
2.)Stress level of the animal changing its respiratory rate. Heavy breathing from stress. HEAVY BREATHING
3.)Also considered as many have done in there post is the method of ending pain ever going to be as bad as suffering??? NO
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Re: Euthanization Methods - Which do YOU think is right?
Would you choose being locked in an airless room over your head crushed before you even know it?
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Re: Euthanization Methods - Which do YOU think is right?
It happens within seconds and there is air in the container, however moments later it is all removed by displacement so yes you are correct airless but not when I place the reptile in the container. I like to think of it as a final hiding place. Nice, Dark, Bedding and then sleep.
On the other hand I think I would feel quite evil after smashing the head.
To each there own, as like I said before any of these methods are better than the continued suffering.
I prefer this method it is clean and works with no clever or mallet involved. I feel that if I breed them and raise them it is also my duty to dispatch them when the time comes if needed.
J
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Re: Euthanization Methods - Which do YOU think is right?
Quote:
Originally Posted by jallenfl
It happens within seconds and there is air in the container, however moments later it is all removed by displacement so yes you are correct airless but not when I place the reptile in the container. I like to think of it as a final hiding place. Nice, Dark, Bedding and then sleep.
On the other hand I think I would feel quite evil after smashing the head.
To each there own, as like I said before any of these methods are better than the continued suffering.
I prefer this method it is clean and works with no clever or mallet involved. I feel that if I breed them and raise them it is also my duty to dispatch them when the time comes if needed.
J
Well, this isnt about how YOU feel after wards. Its about what causes the least amount of tension/stress/pain to the animal.
"however moments later it is all removed by displacement.."
Moments later. Speak to anyone that was in a near fatal accident of any kind and they will tell you that seconds feel like hours. Moments later can be an eternity knowing that your suffocating. Make no mistake, they know when they cant breathe. Not to mention you STILL have oxygen in your body that keeps you alive for a few more seconds/minutes.
I understand for YOU its easy to turn on a valve and 30 seconds later see a dead snake and think "well that was quick and painless". But your not the one suffering.
Have you ever been under water to the point you were panicking for air? Well, snakes also use a much smaller oxygen percentage then we do and takes longer for the oxygen to fully dissipate in the body. Just because its not messy, doesnt mean its not stressful or painful.
Its not pretty, but smashing a skull and the brain cavity just might be the best FOR THE ANIMAL... Co2 simply doesnt make much sense to me given the nature of how reptiles utilize oxygen in the first place.
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Re: Euthanization Methods - Which do YOU think is right?
Foschi, I'm sorry, but all indicators are that the last thing to shut down due to cold in a reptile is the brain. There is no evidence that they're insensate or incapable of feeling pain simply because they were refrigerated first. Cold reptiles actually show the ability to respond, albeit slowly. Test this next time--take the refrigerated animal, and pinch its tail--I bet you will see it flinch in response, even if it's greatly delayed.
There is no way to make freezing humane for reptiles.
Remember, reptiles do NOT hibernate. They brumate. Brumation is a slowing of the metabolism while the animals is CONSCIOUS. They do not go to sleep and stay asleep.
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Re: Euthanization Methods - Which do YOU think is right?
I can hold my breath for a minute and a half and remain conscious. I can't imagine going any longer or actually trying to breath and getting no oxygen. I can't imagine how long a reptile can actually go like that.
Suffocation and freezing have got to be some of the worst ways to die, for any creature. Just smash it's head and end it's suffering in less than an instant.
I'm stepping out now.
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Re: Euthanization Methods - Which do YOU think is right?
Wow! Thanks for all the input, everyone! :gj:
Personally, this is a hard subject to talk about for myself, despite being the one who created such a thread. I love all my animals, and I wouldn't be very loyal if I couldn't bring myself to end their suffering. I'm a very emotional person; having watched my own dog die with his head in my lap, I have experienced death.
I would much rather be with my pet during their last moments should euthanasia be the only option, rather than just handing it off to a vet and feel the guilt. With dogs or cats, you have that option. But injection is not the best method for any reptile, in my opinion. Albeit a bit disturbing and heart-wrenching, I would euthanize my own snake with the quickest possible method, should the time ever come.
It's probably the best time and place to use that unusual age-old phrase: "I love you to death."
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Re: Euthanization Methods - Which do YOU think is right?
Yeah and sometime you may have a situation where waiting for a vet might not be humane for the snake. Some vets won't take reptiles, or it might be after-hours or the weekend when you can't find an open vet, or an emergency vet that will take in reptiles.
In those cases, having something predetermined can really help both you and the snake, you for not making it quite as traumatic because you've considered it, and the snake for not having as much time to suffer until you decide.
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