Saving a Life! (Graphic images)

Tim, It sounds like you have done a wonderful job so far with this girl. I am glad to see a good update today. I have been thinking about her. Best wishes to you both.

Kristy

Holy moley! What an awesome snake daddy you are!
Most definitely keep up the progress reports.

BTW, does the liquid band aid seem to be holding?

Tim, you best give us regular updates! There's a whole bunch of us prayering and hoping for this little snaker. I can't wait for the post one day showing her beautifully healed belly. :)

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Originally Posted by frankykeno

Tim, you best give us regular updates! There's a whole bunch of us prayering and hoping for this little snaker. I can't wait for the post one day showing her beautifully healed belly. :)

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Ditto!

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Originally Posted by muddoc

MONDAY UPDATE:
She is still looking as if she is ready for the long haul. It appears that the hernia is getting drier and closing up very well. I think it may take a while for the scales to grow back together, but I have a lifetime to wait. It also appears that she may have some bruising ahead of the hernia (at least I hope it is bruising, as it could be internal bleeding, but I don't think so), but looks well overall. She is starting to look a little dehydrated from being in a dry environment, so I held her head near the water bowl while supporting her body, and she stuck her head in and appeared to drink for about 20 seconds. I did get to see her flick her tongue today, and watched her for quite a while to see if she crawled normally, as She normally stays in one spot. I put her in the front of the tub and watched her crawl to the rear near the heat, so that is fine as well. Since the wound appeared to be drying nicely, I went ahead and put a small amount of Neosporin on it today, to help with infection and protect the wound. I will keep up with the updates as long as anyone wants to read them.

Sincerely,

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I'm so glad she's still doing well for you!

Tim, a little trick I learned on Utube. They'll take water from an eyedropper (or syringe)! Nothing wrong with how you did it, just thought I'd throw this in, in case you wanted to try it.

Please, keep updating us on this one. There's probably more people interested in this snake's well being than any other!

My kids came to visit me once when they were little. My daughter brought her hamster with her. I noticed that the hamster was losing a lot of blood. The amount of blood in its cage was such that I didn't know how the hamster was still alive. The three of us sat on the floor holding the hamster and prayed our hearts out for that little creature. The next morning, the hamster was fine, no longer bleeding. It lived for about another year and a half. Prayer works!!!!

Steve

Wow; your work with that little snake is admirable. I am glad that this was a good update. I hope that she continues to improve :)

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Originally Posted by Shadowspider

BTW, does the liquid band aid seem to be holding?

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The Liquid Band-aid appears to be holding the knot in place just fine.

No worries everyone, I'll definitely keep up with the updates. I didn't realize everyone was as concerned as we are, but I definitely appreciate all of the concern. Another update to come this evening.

Its wonderful to hear she is doing well. I couldn't stop thinking about her last night. You have Super Snake Healing Skills Tim!:D

awesome story man (and such a beautiful snake)
good job :)

Good luck with her. When I first started reading this post I was not expecting to see anything as bad as what your pic showed. I am wondering if you may run into a problem if the wound is not pretty much totally healed by the time she goes through her 1st shed.

John,
I did call and talk to Ralph about her yesterday. According to him, the first couple of sheds may be crappy, and he fed his normal meals (i.e. hopper mice). He said though that using your best judgement, after it appears that she is over the hump, misting isn't a problem, and her dehydration and dry sheds would no longer be a problem.

I think that a couple of stuck sheds is a small price to pay if she lives. I just want to fix one problem at a time. Get her hernia healed first, then get her eating and then get her shedding good. Time will tell.

We're pullin' for her man!
She's such a gorgeous girl and obviously with a will to live so I'm keeping my fingers crossed for her and you.

Baby steps to heal...baby steps to heal....

This is a fantastic thread and I'm glued to it. I've been checking back more than twice a day to see how everything is going and I'm moved by all the compassion and support that everyone is showing. This is truly one of the best forums I have joined in recent times and I wish you both all the best as she really is an amazing animal.

This reminded me of a similar birth at a breeder close to me that had a positive outcome. You can read about it here http://www.ballpython.ca/miracle.html

:rockon: Tim, were all pulling for you!

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Originally Posted by muddoc

John,
I did call and talk to Ralph about her yesterday. According to him, the first couple of sheds may be crappy, and he fed his normal meals (i.e. hopper mice). He said though that using your best judgement, after it appears that she is over the hump, misting isn't a problem, and her dehydration and dry sheds would no longer be a problem.

I think that a couple of stuck sheds is a small price to pay if she lives. I just want to fix one problem at a time. Get her hernia healed first, then get her eating and then get her shedding good. Time will tell.

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I was actually thinking more about pieces of the shed skin getting stuck in the wound if it is not closed but it sounds like you still have a little time before worrying about that.

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Originally Posted by shag

This reminded me of a similar birth at a breeder close to me that had a positive outcome. You can read about it here http://www.ballpython.ca/miracle.html

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Thanks Shag. I read Mark's story years ago when he first posted about it, and it is indeed a great story. Thanks for the compassion.

I apologize for not posting an update yesterday, so here it is now.
TUESDAY UPDATE:
There really isn't much to say today, as she still looks to be doing very well. I am hoping that she is starting to get to the period of time that she has passed the hump, and is coasting towards a healed wound. She does seem to move around her tub a little bit more, which makes me believe that she is more comfortable than she has been in the past few days. I put her by her water again and she drank a little, which I was glad to see, as I already believe she is going to have some slight dehydration problems over the next month while I am keeping her enclosure so dry. The stitches appear to be doing good and the wound looks to be healing on track. Now I just need to sit back and monitor the wound and make the judgement call on when I think it will be safe to feed her. I did put a little more Neosporin on the wound yesterday evening. I think I am going to put up a pic tonight for the update, so check back later.

keep fighting the good fight Tim :rockon:

Thanks for the update Tim. It sounds like she's doing well and will be chowing down rats in no time. Congratulations, Doctor!!

Woot! Update! Glad to hear she is doing better. Healing wounds are no fun for anyone and she sounds like she's taking it well.

wow, i just saw this thread............nice work! i think i would need something stronger than a beer though, maybe a shot or two!


will you have to remove the stitches or will they dissolve?

Tyree,
They will not dissolve, but according to everyone I talked to, I just need to leave them in there for quite some time and they will fall out eventually. I will keep an eye on them to make sure though.

WEDNESDAY UPDATE:
She apperas to be doing better today, and the wound looks as if it is healing nicely. I am including an udpdated pic today. If you look close, you can see the front stitch coming untied a bit more. I hope I don't need to replace it, but so far it looks like the hernia has closed enough that it won't require replacement. Also, the back stitch looks a little green, almost like there may be some infection present, but if you look under the stitch, it doesn't look like there is any infection in the wound.

Everyday that goes by gives us more hope, as she seems to do a little better each day. She even was hiding under her papertowel today almost as if saying "Ok, I've had enough attention, why don't you leave me alone. I'm fine!".
http://www.baileyreptiles.com/pics/hernia4.jpg

I wish I could just buy this one when she gets healthy and take care of her! What a story!

YEY! Good to hear she's still kickin' strong. :D
errr, well, slithering as it were.

Tim,


Is that just muscle tissue peeking out of the wound at the anterior (head end) of the stitches??? Or is it a small spot of her heart that's squeezed out? Either way, she looks like she's doing awesome, but I'd be concerned about that tissue drying out and dying.


(oh, ;) :D BTW.....It's caJones, not ca h ones) :):P


Tim, you and Monica are the bestest!:carrot: :carrot: :pinkele: :pinkele:


RuLyn:sunny:

RuLyn,
It appears to my naked eye as muscle tissue. It is a much lighter color than the heart. I think that muscle tissue is just poking out a bit because that forward stitch has loosened up. But it appears that the tissue is holding together very well, so I'm not too concerned about the stitch. Me and Monica were just talking about the possibility of having to resuture that one spot, and I'm not to thrilled about doing it, so we will just watch it closely.

As for the drying out thing, it looks like it is staying soft enough from the Neosporin applications once a day that the wound will be ok. thanks for the concern.

Such a sad sight, she is so precious. Your her hero, a a model of doing what it takes if you really love these creatures. She is in my prayers.

This is one of the coolest stories I have ever heard. You guys are awesome. How still does a snake stay when you are sticking needles in it? That couldn't of been easy. Great job on that one!

I really gotta say it again; that is awesome, what you are doing for that little snake :) It literally brings a happy tear to my eye. And I have no doubt that you're doing better for her than any vet I can think of.

She is a beauty. I hope everything is well with her. You and she are both in my thoughts!

I was curious about what the best way to suture reptile skins was as I remember being told a long time ago that their was a specific way that is best. So I dug around a little and in a reptile mag. i found a article about an iguana with a bladder stone. During the closing of the incision it stated that reptile skin heals differently than mammalian skin and needed to be sutured with edges everted apposed underside to underside.(it looks like the skin was folded out slightly and the undersides of the dermis layer was stitched together) This was to promote a stronger bond and prevent inward healing but it didn't explain why or if inward healing was bad. Temperatures sure be held at the warmer end too as this helps promote healing which should take 4-6 weeks.

Now none of this really helps after the fact and the best effort was put forth in this emergency. I'm just wondering if anyone can confirm what I've read and maybe explain better just in case anyone else has a similar emergency that would require the suturing of an open wound. I only have one bp but I'm thinking of hitting up a nurse friend of mine for suture kit just in case and hope I never half to use it.

Great Job Tim, sorry I could not post sooner as we have been on vacation. Keeping my fingers crossed for you and the little spider girl.


Neil

This one of those storys that all i can say is AWWWWWW.. :oops:

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Originally Posted by Royalherper

This is one of the coolest stories I have ever heard. You guys are awesome. How still does a snake stay when you are sticking needles in it? That couldn't of been easy. Great job on that one!

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Jason,
Believe it or not, she held almost perfectly still through the whole process. This was fortunate for us, as it was hard enough with her being so little.

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Originally Posted by shag

I was curious about what the best way to suture reptile skins was as I remember being told a long time ago that their was a specific way that is best. So I dug around a little and in a reptile mag. i found a article about an iguana with a bladder stone. During the closing of the incision it stated that reptile skin heals differently than mammalian skin and needed to be sutured with edges everted apposed underside to underside.(it looks like the skin was folded out slightly and the undersides of the dermis layer was stitched together) This was to promote a stronger bond and prevent inward healing but it didn't explain why or if inward healing was bad. Temperatures sure be held at the warmer end too as this helps promote healing which should take 4-6 weeks.

Now none of this really helps after the fact and the best effort was put forth in this emergency. I'm just wondering if anyone can confirm what I've read and maybe explain better just in case anyone else has a similar emergency that would require the suturing of an open wound. I only have one bp but I'm thinking of hitting up a nurse friend of mine for suture kit just in case and hope I never half to use it.

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Maybe I am reading it wrong, but I am not sure exactly what you are trying to say. However, I appreciate the thought, and as you stated, I have never had to do this before, and had to do something. I also am planning to do the same as you and get a suture kit with the hopes that I never have to use it.

Sincerely,

Thanks Neil and amber. I have not checked on her yet today, but I will post an update tomorrow morning.

I'm just anal about being prepared for the worst and this is something i never thought I'd have to worry about so I'm trying to get as much info as possible, maybe i have a little OCD. How is the beautiful girl doing?

I found a pic of the suture method so everyone can see what I can't explain.
http://www.lbah.com/reptile/iguanastone.htm

Thanks Shag, for the link, it was very informative. I understand what you were trying to sya now. For the time being she is doing fine. Her clutch mates shed yesterday, but she is showing no signs of shedding, which I always have a few hatchlings that were "programmed" incorrectly each year, and do not shed shortly after hatching. I was going to evaluate her condition tomorrow, and decide if I was going to feed her with her clutch mates. I will post a better update tomorrow.

How's she doing?

Denise,
I'll post a better update of her this evening after I check on her, but yesterday when I checked her, she is just starting to turn blue and enter her first shed (note: al of her clutch mates shed on Thursday). Her wound seems to be healing very nicely, and she has started to move around more and like a typical hatchling. She tongue flicks alot more and seems curious about her surroundings like a normal snake. She likes to push her water bowl around now and hide behind it. I am truly amazed at how well she is doing so quickly, but I am pretty confident that if I can get her to eat, she will be fine. She is noticably better than she was a week ago.

Hey Tim! How 'bout an update on this little one?!?!?!?

How's she doing???

Steve

Steve,
I will be updating soon. She is doing fine, and the wound appears to be closing and getting better every day. What I have been waiting on prior to posting an update, is that she should be shedding today or tomorrow. After that, I was going to attempt a feeding. I will take some updated pics of her once she sheds, as she is a very pretty Spider. I think her sister, after shedding, might be the best looking Spider I have ever produced, and this girl is going to give her a run as well. Updated pics coming tomorrow probably, and hopefully a farily uneventful shed (I say that because I am quite sure that there will be a few shed problems near hear sutures).

Glad to hear she's still doing well! I kinda wondered about shedding around those sutures too. The shed skin is pretty fragile, and its already got holes in it, so hopefully there won't be problems!

Steve

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Originally Posted by hoo-t

Glad to hear she's still doing well! I kinda wondered about shedding around those sutures too. The shed skin is pretty fragile, and its already got holes in it, so hopefully there won't be problems!

Steve

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Steve,
Funny you should metion it. I've got some Not good news (I say it tht way, because I don't believe it is bad, but not what I wanted). She shed today. When I opened her tub, there was a very small ball of shed skin, which I did not think was enough to be whole. However, after I picked her up, I was amazed at how well she shed, with her humidity being so low. When I flipped her over to look at her underside is when my heart dropped. During the shedding process, she ripped all of the sutures out of the left side of the wound. They were all matted in with some shed pieces and hard to discern. I went ahead and carefully removed all of the sutures from her since they were no longer doing any good. The positive news is that that the skin appears to be healed very well over the hernia, but the scales are not healed and helping to protect the fragile inner layer of skin. I know that snakes are very resilient, and that skin is tougher than we give it credit for, but I feel that she is still in a fragile state, until she gets some more protection in that area. The portion over her heart is healthy looking, but still somewhat thin, as I can see her heart beat fairly well. What I am hoping for now, is that the scales will start to grow together from the backside of the opening, and work there way closed toward the head, without the aid of sutures to help hold them together. I say this, because it appears to me that the most inward pushing out stress is at the front of the hernia directly over the heart.

With all of that said, I still have faith that she is a strong one, and will pull through just fine, but she can still use all of the prayers that you guys can send. I was telling Monica today, that if the scales do not appear to be growing towards each other in the next 6 to 8 weeks, I am probably going to take her to LSU School of Veterniary Science, and see if they can cut her back open and put some better sutures in the hernia. I know that if she has made it this far with everythig she has gone through, then she deserves to live, because she has heart.

Sincerely,

Seems like she is a fighter and I really hope to see her pull through so I am sending good vibes your way.

Thanks for the update and please keep them coming.

Will keep sending prayers and vibes.
She seems to be a little warrior.

what a tough little girl. :)

one of my crested geckos had surgery a few days ago to remove a bunch of eggs that she was unable to lay and the vet gave me something called "Tissuemend II" to use in case the stitches started to loosen or come out too early. from what he told me it is basically like a sterile type of super glue. anyhow, i mention it in case you think something like that might be helpful in your girl's case.

Something my vet gave to me when Kisasa had a wound on top of her face is called Collasate Dressing. It's specifically for dressing postoperative wounds, and if I remember correctly, it acts like an additional layer of skin. Not an adhesive, but an extra layer of protection over the wound that will allow the scales to grow together correctly.


It worked very well in K's face. Up til I started using it, the wound was getting bigger with each shed because the shedding process would tear off freshly healed stuff before the wound could close completely. This helped it heal faster and the next shed went fine.

Tim, thanks for the update! At least the "wound" is staying closed even without the sutures! You aren't still planning to feed her right away are you?
And she will continue to be in my prayers!

Steve

Tim, from the first post about this snake I've nicknamed her "your little Brittany snake". The reason being my brother's baby daughter Brittany was born 3 years ago with what's called a "giant omphalocele" which means her liver and connective tissues were outside her abdominal wall. Your snake has what in a human baby would be called "ectopia cordis" being that it's the heart and not the abdominal organs involved. Anyways...

I hope that your little "Brittany snake" does as well as my beautiful niece did. She's in our hearts, that little snake, and we watch every day for news she's still making it.

What's the plan for getting nutrients into her? Some sort of slurry tubed into her? I can't imagine constriction or swallowing would be a good idea at this point.