BP not Eating

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thomas S

ok, im new you can all laugh at me, but what is "VIV"?

---

Apologies ..

Viv is short for vivarium ... some use plastic boxes ( RUBs) to house their reptiles though of course .

It’s like the way we all shorten thermostat down to ‘stat’ .

Sorry !


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thomas S

ok, im new you can all laugh at me, but what is "VIV"?

---

I'm not laughing- you shouldn't be afraid to ask an honest question & some of these abbreviations do easily cause confusion, especially for a new keeper. Thank you for reminding us. :gj:

Incidentally, the worst abbreviation here that I can think of is "PAM", as when people are discussing the treatment of snake mites. Just so you know, that's NOT the oily cooking spray they're talking about, & I fear that some have actually tried that on their poor snakes. "PAM" is short for a pesticide product to kill mites called "Provent-A-Mite". :snake:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bogertophis

Incidentally, the worst abbreviation here that I can think of is "PAM", as when people are discussing the treatment of snake mites. Just so you know, that's NOT the oily cooking spray they're talking about, & I fear that some have actually tried that on their poor snakes. "PAM" is short for a pesticide product to kill mites called "Provent-A-Mite". :snake:

---

That one really got me wondering for a while, because who would spray silicone on their poor snake? :O

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Spicey

That one really got me wondering for a while, because who would spray silicone on their poor snake? :O

---

Ew! I've never used the stuff, & I assumed it was all vegetable oil but apparently you're correct. I found this: https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/s...Jzp97CmQsTDbq5

Ingredients: Canola Oil*, Palm Oil*, Coconut Oil*, Lecithin from Soybeans (Non-Stick Agent), Dimethyl Silicone (For Anti-Foaming), Rosemary Extract (Preservative). CONTAINS: SOY. Also contains propellant to dispense spray. *Adds a trivial amount of fat.



THIS PRODUCT ^ ^ ^ IS NOT FOR USE ON SNAKES FOR ANY REASON! :O

I had problems posting pictures in the past, im not to computer savy(among other things, lol) so there is a problem with that..the snake never comes out from her hide, i have found small pieces of skin but nothing big, i dont want to lift her hide off her to see if any skin is buried in there, i guess i will have to sooner or later? saturday will be 2 weeks since last feeding, she has shown none of the hunger "Signs" yet, but if i offer her a live mouse on saturday, i wont know if she is truly not hungry or still in the shed process, if she declines the mouse, the breeder who i bought her from said they fed her every 10-14 days, and we know she can go a LONG time without eating if something is bothering her?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bogertophis

Ew! I've never used the stuff, & I assumed it was all vegetable oil but apparently you're correct. I found this:

Ingredients: Canola Oil*, Palm Oil*, Coconut Oil*, Lecithin from Soybeans (Non-Stick Agent), Dimethyl Silicone (For Anti-Foaming), Rosemary Extract (Preservative). CONTAINS: SOY. Also contains propellant to dispense spray. *Adds a trivial amount of fat.



THIS PRODUCT ^ ^ ^ IS NOT FOR USE ON SNAKES FOR ANY REASON! :O

---

Well at least PAM (the people version) has No Calories, Sat Fat or Sodium :O:rofl:

are you talking about that "Stuff" BP owners spray on the snakes skin during shedding? I wouldn't even think about that unless her shed process takes A Long time....

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thomas S

I had problems posting pictures in the past, im not to computer savy(among other things, lol) so there is a problem with that..the snake never comes out from her hide, i have found small pieces of skin but nothing big, i dont want to lift her hide off her to see if any skin is buried in there, i guess i will have to sooner or later? saturday will be 2 weeks since last feeding, she has shown none of the hunger "Signs" yet, but if i offer her a live mouse on saturday, i wont know if she is truly not hungry or still in the shed process, if she declines the mouse, the breeder who i bought her from said they fed her every 10-14 days, and we know she can go a LONG time without eating if something is bothering her?

---

I mean, in my opinion if you're finding small pieces of shed she's probably already shed and may have some stuck shed. It may be worth taking a peek just to be safe. I like to, and I'll preface this by saying I've only had one bad BP shed, but I like to inspect mine after every shed just to be safe. If there's an issue I'd rather address it right away than let it sit. Fortunately I haven't had any, and in the event that you do I'll let more experienced keepers walk you through some methods on getting stuck shed off. Thankfully someone was here on this site to get me through my first stuck shed, and that's been the only one I had to deal with.

I wouldn't get too stressed about her "never" leaving her hide. There's a good chance that she's out at night and you just miss her, there's also a good chance that she's going from hide to hide and you just don't see it. As I'm typing this, my BP who's been in his middle hide all morning, moved into his warm hide and I caught just the tip of his tail going in. Had I not looked behind me at just the right moment I never would have seen him.

whats the new skin supposed to look like? i assume really "shiny"?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thomas S

I had problems posting pictures in the past, im not to computer savy(among other things, lol) so there is a problem with that..the snake never comes out from her hide, i have found small pieces of skin but nothing big, i dont want to lift her hide off her to see if any skin is buried in there, i guess i will have to sooner or later? saturday will be 2 weeks since last feeding, she has shown none of the hunger "Signs" yet, but if i offer her a live mouse on saturday, i wont know if she is truly not hungry or still in the shed process, if she declines the mouse, the breeder who i bought her from said they fed her every 10-14 days, and we know she can go a LONG time without eating if something is bothering her?

---

You NEED to CHECK on her- she's likely stuck in her "old" shed! Do not offer live food until you KNOW she has fully shed, otherwise she'll refuse & a live mouse could be chewing on her!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thomas S

are you talking about that "Stuff" BP owners spray on the snakes skin during shedding? I wouldn't even think about that unless her shed process takes A Long time....

---

They sell something called "Shed-Aid" (I think?) but it's no better than just water- don't waste your $

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thomas S

whats the new skin supposed to look like? i assume really "shiny"?

---

Snakes are not usually shiny, at least not BPs. (not counting those species with iridescence) But their colors look deeper, brighter & clearer, not dull as in shed.

You also need to check after a snake sheds to be sure their old eye-caps and tail tip came off in the shed. Especially keeping a BP, because they're prone to stuck eye-caps (& they cause problems like future loss of sight if ignored), and they can lose their tail tips to gangrene (death of tissue) after only one or a few missed sheds remaining.

Check a snake after every shed...it's your job as a keeper. Snakes are low-maintenance pets, not "no-maintenance" pets!

[QUOTE=Bogertophis;2755899]They sell something called "Shed-Aid" (I think?) but it's no better than just water- don't waste your $ [/QUOT]


I've used Shed-Ease, but I agree, water does just as good a job.

ok i will..i was reading that the whole shed process should??? last no more than 14 days, i should be ok by this weekend but I will check to be totally sure, before i offer anything...1 more week of no eating wont hurt as much as a Mouse bite could

OR? i could go with a Blind Rat Pup which is relatively safe because their eyes are not open yet, but she might not like the way the Rat pup smells compared to a mouse, big gamble there, not worth it

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thomas S

OR? i could go with a Blind Rat Pup which is relatively safe because their eyes are not open yet, but she might not like the way the Rat pup smells compared to a mouse, big gamble there, not worth it

---

When they're in shed it's not about what they eat, but the fact that they eat. Both shedding and digestion both take a lot of water, and snakes aren't always the best multitaskers, so you don't want to steal from peter to pay paul, so to speak. I would just leave her be until you know for sure she's done shedding.

My first bad shed with my BP came from feeding during shed. Something someone here was kind enough to educate me on. My BP surprisingly is one of my best eating snakes, and will take a feeder while in shed with no complaints, but after learning that this could cause issues, and seeing it first hand, I just started skipping meals when I knew he was in shed. Like I said before, I've had no other shed issues since then.

they say Young Ball Pythons shed the most often because they are in the growing phase of their lives, my snake is shedding already and its not growing, if anything it might have lost some weight while i had my feeding problems with her, go figure...

I remember when i was young, my snake experience was with Garter Snakes, i would catch them, keep them in cardboard boxes most of the time, feeding was easy, drop a worm in the cage and forget about it..No heat lamps, no humidity worries, and most of the snakes would shed in 1 or 2 big pieces...Ball Pythons come from far away countries and there is just soooo much that they have to adjust too, not fair when you think about it...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thomas S

they say Young Ball Pythons shed the most often because they are in the growing phase of their lives, my snake is shedding already and its not growing, if anything it might have lost some weight while i had my feeding problems with her, go figure...

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thomas S

I remember when i was young, my snake experience was with Garter Snakes, i would catch them, keep them in cardboard boxes most of the time, feeding was easy, drop a worm in the cage and forget about it..No heat lamps, no humidity worries, and most of the snakes would shed in 1 or 2 big pieces...Ball Pythons come from far away countries and there is just soooo much that they have to adjust too, not fair when you think about it...

---

Young Ball Pythons do shed more frequently than adults but you dismissing her as not growing when you've only had her for about several weeks isn't accurate either. She could very well be growing in length and not girth, especially if she is having issues with feeding recently, so you wouldn't necessarily notice it.

Also, what is not fair? Ball Pythons are definitely higher care than a Garter Snake but that doesn't make it an impossible task. They've been captive bred for decades, so most of the Ball Pythons you see were born and raised outside of their native country of Africa. What's not fair is any animal being in the care of an owner who is not fully prepared and there's not much adjustment when their enclosure is meeting all their needs that they would get in the wild and then some.

Excuse me??? I take it that you were "Fully" prepared Before you got your first BP? I admit, I am far from perfect, but i continue to read all i can because there are some topics that work for some snakes but do not work for others..I come to websites like BP Net, i ask questions, i do what i can to become a better owner.. I will probably learn more things down the road about BP care just when i might think i know it all... Nobody is perfect, except you?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thomas S

Excuse me??? I take it that you were "Fully" prepared Before you got your first BP? I admit, I am far from perfect, but i continue to read all i can because there are some topics that work for some snakes but do not work for others..I come to websites like BP Net, i ask questions, i do what i can to become a better owner.. I will probably learn more things down the road about BP care just when i might think i know it all... Nobody is perfect, except you?

---

I simply responded to the statements you made as they are not accurate, nobody is saying anything about perfection. That's again a statement YOU are making. Fully prepared =/= Perfect. Fully prepared is doing your research heavily and testing out your enclosure prior to receiving your snake as well as having the appropriate tools and resources at your disposal in case things didn't go to plan. Nothing about that requires perfection, just time and diligence.

Everyone has room to grow and learn, you taking offense to what im saying is not my concern though as what I stated was for correction and reflection on your perspective to Ball Python care. I applaud you for wanting to keep learning, just don't expect your statements not to be challenged when they're inaccurate.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RickySRonin

Fully prepared =/= Perfect. Fully prepared is doing your research heavily and testing out your enclosure prior to receiving your snake as well as having the appropriate tools and resources at your disposal in case things didn't go to plan. Nothing about that requires perfection, just time and diligence.

---

100% agree. Thomas I understand that this has been a pretty stressful situation, but you have to stop taking responses as attacks. There's a big difference between being educated, as I think Ricky was doing, and being attacked, which no one has done to you. I understand it can be hard on the internet to recognize tone, but no one here is trying to take shots at you, everyone is doing their best to teach you. As we've told you before, everyone here has your animal's best interest at the front of their mind, and that generates blunt and direct feedback for you, because your feelings are not what's important here.

I told you before, most of the questions you've asked here, and most of the things that you got wrong with husbandry and your enclosure set up, are clearly explained in almost every care guide you can find anywhere online. We've discussed your set up when this thread started, and let's be honest, even the most basic, low level, box pet store, care guide would have told you that your enclosure was not ready for an animal. Absolutely any online resource that's not 10 years old would have told you not to move your snake to a separate container to feed them. From the outside looking in, it didn't/doesn't seem like much research was done prior to your snake coming home.

The point is, you weren't prepared for this snake, there's no arguing that. You're doing the right thing now by asking questions and making corrections, which isn't the ideal order to do things, but you're making it happen. Please try not to take everything so personal. You did a great job taking responsibility for your mistakes, don't ruin that now with a poor attitude.

UPDATE: 2ND Live Feeding went well, BUT, my BP looks more like the Ambush style eater, She waits at least 10 minutes before striking..Trying to convert her to F/T is going to be a real challenge, she eats live mice not rats yet, in the dark, my arm may fall off shaking a mouse in front of her waiting for a strike..She will be 1 year in july so mice might not be big enough for her by then? unless i double feed Mice? I envy those owners who can waive a heated F/T in front of the snake and get a quick strike...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thomas S

UPDATE: 2ND Live Feeding went well, BUT, my BP looks more like the Ambush style eater, She waits at least 10 minutes before striking..Trying to convert her to F/T is going to be a real challenge, she eats live mice not rats yet, in the dark, my arm may fall off shaking a mouse in front of her waiting for a strike..She will be 1 year in july so mice might not be big enough for her by then? unless i double feed Mice? I envy those owners who can waive a heated F/T in front of the snake and get a quick strike...

---

Many royals prefer to strike from within the security of their hides ( ambush)


I thaw the mice (in the afternoon) and in the snake room to get the snakes into feeding mode !

As long as you feed evenings , in dim or low light , ensure the snake is well settled under a hide .. quick hairdryer blast and INSTANTLY dangle it in front of the hide entrance... BOOM :)



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

how long do you blast for, how many seconds usually?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thomas S

UPDATE: ... my arm may fall off shaking a mouse in front of her waiting for a strike...

---

So get in shape, lol. You think you're the only person that ever had this issue? If you're not already a ninja-warrior, keeping snakes will get you there! :rofl:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thomas S

how long do you blast for, how many seconds usually?

---

5 to 10 seconds on the head region mainly


Last feed I did four in less than two minutes .. see below

(I put the light on afterwards just to take the photo )

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...d7ca8729d2.jpg

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

LOL, you got that right! before i got my B.P, all the Info i read on them is that they are Beginner/Easy pets to care for? Wait a minute, are they easier than Dogs? With dogs all you have to do is drop a bowl of food in front of them, and they will eat it 99% of the time, hot/cold doesn't matter!!!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thomas S

LOL, you got that right! before i got my B.P, all the Info i read on them is that they are Beginner/Easy pets to care for? Wait a minute, are they easier than Dogs? With dogs all you have to do is drop a bowl of food in front of them, and they will eat it 99% of the time, hot/cold doesn't matter!!!

---

Yeah, I've seen where people call ball pythons a good beginner pet and I don't agree. On one hand, when their needs are all met, they don't need a whole lot of interaction. They don't need walked every day...or fed every day...etc. But, when they have problems, it can take a lot of work to get things right. You're right, with a dog you just stick the food in front of them and go to town. But you can't leave a dog alone in a room for 3 days while you go out of town for a quick vacation...

My favorite part of every “my snake won’t eat” thread is when ALL the snakes eventually eat! I’m glad that in this case it didn’t take long at all.

OP- If you’re cool with continuing the live feedings then carry on. If/when you decide to transition to f/t, it may take a little more tough love, but the end result will be the same if you stay the course. In an eat or starve scenario, outside of failure to thrive critters, any healthy animal will eat. Sometimes it takes longer than others but the hunger ALWAYS wins.

I do go to Pet Stores at least 2 times per week, and all of them only have 1 hide for snakes in them do to limited space, i guess? I know now you need 2 obviously, but as a Early potential buyer at the time, i believed that the pet stores i visited had it "right"... so new BP owners should be aware of any advice or visual examples given by Pet Stores, yes???

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thomas S

I do go to Pet Stores at least 2 times per week, and all of them only have 1 hide for snakes in them do to limited space, i guess? I know now you need 2 obviously, but as a Early potential buyer at the time, i believed that the pet stores i visited had it "right"... so new BP owners should be aware of any advice or visual examples given by Pet Stores, yes???

---

Na .. you’re best doing loads of research many pet store assistants know less than zero about snakes or only give misinformation out .

One of our local stores had a viv containing about 7 young snakes !

Even more incredible is there was a mix of Royal pythons and baby Boas !!

One hide had two snake heads protruding .. one Royal and one Boa !!

To the untrained eye they were all happy as Larry but I doubt that all the Royals were eating regularly ( if at all ) .


Many still sell the snake , viv/tank and a heat mat but no thermostat. (Plus they sell those useless, plastic stick-on Exo Terra thermometers ! )


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thomas S

I do go to Pet Stores at least 2 times per week, and all of them only have 1 hide for snakes in them do to limited space, i guess? I know now you need 2 obviously, but as a Early potential buyer at the time, i believed that the pet stores i visited had it "right"... so new BP owners should be aware of any advice or visual examples given by Pet Stores, yes???

---

Yes. As Zinc already noted, pet stores are there to SELL things. Very few of them know what they're talking about when it comes to proper snake care- the employees are mostly doing what they're manager has told them & have little or no other experience with snakes at all. I've seen absolutely atrocious care of snakes in pet stores, which is why I seldom go in them any more. If they were receptive to education I'd try though, for the sake of the snakes.

And as far as pet stores making sales: Consider that they may want to sell you a snake that gets much bigger than you really want or can handle, just so you'll be back buying more food all the time, or new enclosures when it outgrows them. Remember that pet stores have a lot of "overhead" (costs of running a "brick & mortar" storefront) so they need to make sales to stay open, much less make a profit. Rather than tell you the BEST products for your pets needs, they're going to want to push whatever they have in their store. Never forget that...;) Their "advice" is profit-motivated.

Some of them (employees or managers/owners) may mean well, but do your own research anyway- don't risk your pets doing what you see them doing.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bogertophis

Yes. As Zinc already noted, pet stores are there to SELL things. Very few of them know what they're talking about when it comes to proper snake care- the employees are mostly doing what they're manager has told them & have little or no other experience with snakes at all. I've seen absolutely atrocious care of snakes in pet stores, which is why I seldom go in them any more. If they were receptive to education I'd try though, for the sake of the snakes.

And as far as pet stores making sales: Consider that they may want to sell you a snake that gets much bigger than you really want or can handle, just so you'll be back buying more food all the time, or new enclosures when it outgrows them. Remember that pet stores have a lot of "overhead" (costs of running a "brick & mortar" storefront) so they need to make sales to stay open, much less make a profit. Rather than tell you the BEST products for your pets needs, they're going to want to push whatever they have in their store. Never forget that...;) Their "advice" is profit-motivated.

Some of them (employees or managers/owners) may mean well, but do your own research anyway- don't risk your pets doing what you see them doing.

---

Painfully accurate explanation of what goes on, especially at the big box stores, but sometimes just as bad if not worse at smaller pet shops. My local reptile place has stopped me from buying things a few times and given me some DYI advice or a cheaper product that works just as good. That's why I keep going back. They're breeders and know what works and what expensive products I can skip on and still provide the same level of care.

My opinion is if you can find a shop that tries to get you not to spend money, that's the shop where you should be spending your money.

Before i bought my 1st and only BP, i asked A LOT of questions..I remember 1 pet shop employee telling me that these are good questions that i was asking and as she was answering them only after searching her phone for a few seconds, but she was trying..I also was told not to buy some of the Reptile Habitat Enclosure "Kits" because they contained things i did not need, or cheap versions of the temperature/humidity guages, lighting, bedding and so on, they were being quite honest, that really surprised me...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thomas S

Before i bought my 1st and only BP, i asked A LOT of questions..I remember 1 pet shop employee telling me that these are good questions that i was asking and as she was answering them only after searching her phone for a few seconds, but she was trying..I also was told not to buy some of the Reptile Habitat Enclosure "Kits" because they contained things i did not need, or cheap versions of the temperature/humidity guages, lighting, bedding and so on, they were being quite honest, that really surprised me...

---

Yea sometimes you can find a good deal on a "kit" but they're a tad misleading to a new keeper. I think a lot of folks see "snake kit" and assume it has everything that they need in it, only to find out later that they're missing stuff or got equipment that isn't ideal, those stick on temp/humidity gauges are a good example. Now I've purchased kits on sale at box stores before, but only because I was getting the enclosure cheaper than if I bought it by itself.

I hate to keep bragging on my local reptile place, but what they do is do bulk orders on 10 gallon tanks, and then they create their own starter kits out of them with appropriate sized hides, good substrate, digital gauges, I mean a dream set up for a hatchling snake. Of course they grow out of that 10 gallon relatively quick, but it's a great and safer way to get people into the hobby.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hugsplox

Yea sometimes you can find a good deal on a "kit" but they're a tad misleading to a new keeper. I think a lot of folks see "snake kit" and assume it has everything that they need in it, only to find out later that they're missing stuff or got equipment that isn't ideal, those stick on temp/humidity gauges are a good example. Now I've purchased kits on sale at box stores before, but only because I was getting the enclosure cheaper than if I bought it by itself.

I hate to keep bragging on my local reptile place, but what they do is do bulk orders on 10 gallon tanks, and then they create their own starter kits out of them with appropriate sized hides, good substrate, digital gauges, I mean a dream set up for a hatchling snake. Of course they grow out of that 10 gallon relatively quick, but it's a great and safer way to get people into the hobby.

---

Thomas S, I know your snake has taken several meals now. However, this is great advice and might also help you convert your snake onto frozen/thawed if you choose to try that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a-aU7VJLvaY

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by mlededee

Thomas S, I know your snake has taken several meals now. However, this is great advice and might also help you convert your snake onto frozen/thawed if you choose to try that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a-aU7VJLvaY

---

This reminds me of some posts (by Deborah, I think?) along the same lines, including the last desperate measure of taking a snake for a 30 minute ride in the car to basically change things up, & also a discussion of some research about doing a thorough cleaning of their enclosure. Good stuff! :gj: I like his explanation & it bears repeating. We all have to become snake psychologists. :D

(As far as the "ride in a car" technique, I've never tried that & wouldn't be eager to do so- you also have to think about the weather- if it's cold, any exposure could backfire. My initial reaction to the idea was that it sounded crazy, but after watching this video above, it sorta fits the same idea and this video explains it far better than previous observations & speculation did.)

A good deal on a snake "Kit" is one thing, How about a good deal on a BP? The Pet------ store near me has a Black Pastel just like my BP for $49.99! I paid $149.99 + $50.00 shipping for my Pastel, I think im going to get seriously sick....

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thomas S

A good deal on a snake "Kit" is one thing, How about a good deal on a BP? The Pet ------ store near me has a Black Pastel just like my BP for $49.99! I paid $149.99 + $50.00 shipping for my Pastel, I think im going to get seriously sick....

---

Yea but you get what you pay for. You paid $100 more for the animal, but you also got it from a trusted breeder, who you can trust took good care of it before it came to you. You paid more, but I can almost guarantee that you got a healthier snake. Plus you know for sure what genes that snake is. You can ask them about the breeding pair it came from, you can verify FOR SURE what genes you're working with with that snake, etc etc. A pet store snake is just whatever they were told it is, or what they think it is. You can't ask them for breeding records like you can a good breeder.

You gotta stop thinking so negative about this stuff. You got a healthy snake, it's eating, and you found a great herp community to get advice from. You're doing fine bud, don't get hung up on "should have, would have, could have" stuff.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thomas S

A good deal on a snake "Kit" is one thing, How about a good deal on a BP? The Pet------ store near me has a Black Pastel just like my BP for $49.99! I paid $149.99 + $50.00 shipping for my Pastel, I think im going to get seriously sick....

---

When you buy a snake from a pet store, you often get far more than you bargained for. Mites for one thing, but also a very stressed animal that's been shipped & exposed to many other snakes that were sick & even dying along the way, & carrying diseases & parasites, & then far more stressful conditions once they arrive to a pet store. Stress lowers their immune function just as it does our own- keep that in mind. I'm not saying that things never go wrong when you buy from a private breeder, but it's just that the odds are far greater when your snake comes from a pet store. So if you "save" a lot of money buying a bargain snake in a store, but then have to take it to the vet for health issues, did you really save any money? ;)

i didn't mean anything bad by using the symbols in my last post, i just didn't want to use the Pet Stores name, they ain't getting any free advertising from me....

yeah i know, she seems healthy and very docile, I am waiting for my first Bite, lol...if it happens i just got to remember NOT to pull back out of fear..getting back to the pet store snakes, they do offer a 30 day return option, Wilbanks does not take snakes back even for Free! which don't make any since at all, they can fix eating or behavior issues Quickly and resell the snake for at least what they charged before depending what type of BP it is? So if your a new owner struggling with a snake that wont eat or is very bad behaving you can always bail out..just because one owner cant get it right with their new BP, its not going to scar the snake for its entire life..Sending a snake back to a pet shop would be a horrible thing to do to it, but whats worse is having a new owner who doesnt know how to make it happy?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thomas S

yeah i know, she seems healthy and very docile, I am waiting for my first Bite, lol...if it happens i just got to remember NOT to pull back out of fear..getting back to the pet store snakes, they do offer a 30 day return option, Wilbanks does not take snakes back even for Free! which don't make any since at all, they can fix eating or behavior issues Quickly and resell the snake for at least what they charged before depending what type of BP it is? So if your a new owner struggling with a snake that wont eat or is very bad behaving you can always bail out..just because one owner cant get it right with their new BP, its not going to scar the snake for its entire life..Sending a snake back to a pet shop would be a horrible thing to do to it, but whats worse is having a new owner who doesnt know how to make it happy?

---

So we're back to talking about returning animals? As far as Wilbanks' reason for not accepting animals back making no sense to you, if you read their return policy they make it very clear.

"All returns of live animals are strictly at the discretion of Wilbanks, Inc. We cannot guarantee your husbandry practices and therefore there is no guarantee longer than 24 hours. We must be notified within 24 hours of any concern for an exchange to be considered. Once an exchange is agreed to by Wilbanks, Inc. we will send you an invoice for the shipping payment to be made prior to us sending the return labels. Upon receipt we will email you a Fedex return label to return your animal to us. Once we receive the animal we will make arrangements to ship your exchange animal to you."

Source: https://www.wilbanksreptiles.com/return-policy

what return policy? 24 hours for a exchange? what can you find out in a animal in 24 hours? nothing except it is really scared when you take it out of its travel "sack"... they just pump out the hatchlings like a assembly line and dont care if one of their animals is happy or not....

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thomas S

what return policy? 24 hours for a exchange? what can you find out in a animal in 24 hours? nothing except it is really scared when you take it out of its travel "sack"... they just pump out the hatchlings like a assembly line and dont care if one of their animals is happy or not....

---

You yourself told us that Wilbanks told you they'd take the snake back if you couldn't get it to eat. The text from the return policy that talks specifically about feeding issues is at the link I just gave you, but I've copied it below for your convenience. They don't say they won't exchange the snake after 24 hours, they say an exchange isn't guaranteed after 24 hours. There is a difference between exchanges when we're talking feeding issues vs the live arrival guarantee and satisfaction with the animal. Obviously feeding issues aren't something you're going to find out about in 24 hours, which is why they tell you that they'' consider exchanges after they've exhausted other options.

"In some cases we will agree to an exchange for temperament after we have exhausted other efforts. Occasionally when a reptile is moved into a completely new environment feeding issues can arise. We take these very seriously and will be here every step of the way to help resolve these issues. If we have tried to resolve the feeding issue and the animal still will not eat, we will be happy to exchange the animal for you. We will send you a return label and once the animal is received we will ship your replacement animal."

It's your responsibility to do the research not only on the animal but the breeder before you buy anything. If you weren't comfortable with their return policy you should have went elsewhere.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thomas S

....getting back to the pet store snakes, they do offer a 30 day return option, Wilbanks does not take snakes back even for Free! which don't make any since at all, they can fix eating or behavior issues Quickly and resell the snake for at least what they charged before depending what type of BP it is? So if your a new owner struggling with a snake that wont eat or is very bad behaving you can always bail out..just because one owner cant get it right with their new BP, its not going to scar the snake for its entire life..Sending a snake back to a pet shop would be a horrible thing to do to it, but whats worse is having a new owner who doesnt know how to make it happy?

---

The idea is to thoroughly research a new pet BEFORE you bring it home or have it sent to you. You clearly didn't do that, making it harder on your snake & yourself.

You are totally mis-representing what Wilbanks says about about returns.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thomas S

what return policy? 24 hours for a exchange? what can you find out in a animal in 24 hours? nothing except it is really scared when you take it out of its travel "sack"... they just pump out the hatchlings like a assembly line and dont care if one of their animals is happy or not....

---

You can find out a great deal upon receipt of a newly arrived snake: their overall health- good vs poor body weight- possible defects (such as kinks), mites, respiratory or other obvious signs of illness, the general accuracy of the description as sold (does it match or is it possibly the wrong one?), etc.

Your comment "they just pump out the hatchlings like a assembly line and dont care if one of their animals is happy or not...." is utterly ridiculous & borders on defamation- I suggest you stop attacking the source of your snake here immediately, as they aren't responsible for the issues you have...YOU are.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thomas S

i didn't mean anything bad by using the symbols in my last post, i just didn't want to use the Pet Stores name, they ain't getting any free advertising from me....

---

Thanks. In that case, it would be better to use all dashes or stars, to indicate missing letters, like this: *********** or --------------- Otherwise, I have to assume, just as others will too. ;)