Getting hatchlings to feed

Yeah my breeder animals did come from a large breeder (who will not be named- he's a great breeder but obviously does not have the time to feed his animals f/t, which I understand). I have a normal pet bp I got off of Craigslist before I started breeding, and she is an incredible feeder- eats f/t every five days and has never refused a meal. When I put her in her feeding container, she gets into striking position before she even sees the rat. If only my current breeders were like that... that's the kind of feeding response I'm aiming for in the breeders I hold back from this next generation though.

And you're not "breaking" anything to me. As you can see, I am fine feeding live when it is the only option but why you would rather deal with live animals who poop, smell, require housing and care, and suffer when they are killed when you could instead have a freezer full of humanely killed frozen rats is beyond me, unless you are a large scale breeder (which I am not). I will feed live when necessary and one of my breeders eats live for every meal, but it seems a bit strange to me to care so much about the treatment of the snakes and not at all about their prey. They're animals too. Again, I do both because feeding f/t is not possible will all snakes, but given the choice, I will always choose the easier, cleaner, safer, more humane option.


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I didn't have much trouble feeding F/T to my hatchlings (and these are my first 3 clutches ever). I get that people do different things, but I don't understand why it seems so frowned upon when some want to feed their hatchlings F/T. I had some that struck right away and some that had to be worked with a bit. I'm absolutely not an expert, but it's worth it to me to have them eating F/T from the start when that's the plan for them down the road.

I'm not knocking what others do... I'm just not getting the "you have to feed hatchlings live" thing. I like that there are many right ways to do things in this hobby. I just find it disappointing when some put others down for doing something different. I completely understand what Corey said about the 200 hatchlings... but for someone with 20 or less, I don't believe it's that hard to feed F/T (if that's what you choose to do).

Best of luck to everyone and their different methods in this hobby. I think the most important part is having the pride that your little babies are eating and getting bigger and stronger with every meal :-) .

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Originally Posted by maximum411

...and suffer when they are killed when you could instead have a freezer full of humanely killed frozen rats... They're animals too. ...I will always choose the easier, cleaner, safer, more humane option.

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Please keep in mind that these are all your opinions. Pythons are incredibly efficient at what they do and their prey typically suffers cardiac arrest and dies within seconds of being constricted. Just because you didn't see the f/t prey die doesn't mean that it was any more or less humane. Suggesting that those who responsibly feed live don't respect their prey couldn't be further from the truth. Feeding live can be just as easy, clean, and safe as feeding f/t - maybe not for you, but certainly for some. Your choice is just that - your choice. I would simply recommend that it's based on as much factual information as possible when it comes to your animals.

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Originally Posted by Creepy Alien

I'm just not getting the "you have to feed hatchlings live" thing. I like that there are many right ways to do things in this hobby. I just find it disappointing when some put others down for doing something different.

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I don't see that anyone's said anyone has to do anything (other that not being too quick to force feed) or put anyone down. If anything, the ethics of those who feed live have been questioned. When the options in the OP were presented as f/t or force feed, the better alternative (for the animal) was given to feed live. Force feeding should only be a last resort option - not the second choice. Also, feeding hatchlings f/t isn't exactly "doing something different". There are plenty who do so with great success. What is different is choosing to put personal bias ahead of what is best for the animal, and that I will never agree with.

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Originally Posted by Creepy Alien

I think the most important part is having the pride that your little babies are eating and getting bigger and stronger with every meal

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Take the pride part out of it and I agree with you. ;) I think the most important part is that your little babies are eating and getting bigger and stronger with every meal. :)

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Originally Posted by Creepy Alien

I didn't have much trouble feeding F/T to my hatchlings (and these are my first 3 clutches ever). I get that people do different things, but I don't understand why it seems so frowned upon when some want to feed their hatchlings F/T. .

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Its not frowned upon. What is unethical would be making the choice to breed ANY animals but not prepared for possible outcome.
I don't care what or how you get them eating but "you" made a choice to create and might not be able to get a food source that might be needed?!?!
That in itself should be a deciding factor. Just my thoughts.

I noticed u said feeding tub. Are you trying to feed the hatchlings in a different tub?

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The feeding tub is for the well-trained adult because she's used to it.

And I think it's pretty dishonest to suggest that prey constricted by a python doesn't suffer. I don't see how you can hear them scream when they are grabbed and kick for a minute afterward and come to the conclusion that they're not suffering. I do think there is a mental resistance to feeling as if you're responsible for an animal's suffering, because nobody wants to feel like a bad person, which is understandable. However, it is better to acknowledge that yes, being constricted by a python is not the most humane death, but sometimes it is necessary to keep the snakes healthy. People need to be adults and acknowledge what they're doing rather than bash anyone who suggests that f/t is a more humane alternative to live feeding. I am not suggesting that anyone change their own feeding methods, but just providing justification for my own. It's pretty well established that f/t is preferable to live when possible (keyword when possible). It may be easier to get untrained ball pythons to eat live, but that doesn't mean f/t isn't superior to live feeding in many other ways.


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As a side note, I have watched many live rodents killed by snakes, and I have worked in a lab and watched many rodents killed by CO2 euthanasia, and it's pretty clear that gassing is the less stressful of the two.


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Train...... LoL

Gassing can be more inhumane when not done correctly too. ;)
We can agree to disagree and I will remain unethical as you call myself and many others :rofl:

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Originally Posted by Eric Alan

I don't see that anyone's said anyone has to do anything (other that not being too quick to force feed) or put anyone down. If anything, the ethics of those who feed live have been questioned. When the options in the OP were presented as f/t or force feed, the better alternative (for the animal) was given to feed live. Force feeding should only be a last resort option - not the second choice. Also, feeding hatchlings f/t isn't exactly "doing something different". There are plenty who do so with great success. What is different is choosing to put personal bias ahead of what is best for the animal, and that I will never agree with.

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I'm not sure it's been in this thread as much as I've seen it in other threads, but I have seen it stated many times that feeding hatchlings live is the only way to do it.

I agree with you about putting the animal first, no matter what your beliefs. I'm not trying to bash anyone in this thread at all. I've gotten some GREAT advice and learned very much from this forum. I was just giving my opinion (as a non-expert... just as a guy that is lucky maybe? :) ).

I do think "force feeding" is wrongly used in place of "assist feeding" sometimes. I've assist fed a few times where I've taken a non-eater and just barely put a F/T rat into the mouth and had a snake coil and eat immediately (and then after that the snake would strike and eat completely on it's own). I don't think that it's something that everyone should do, but I've been successful with some non eaters. As far as force feeding goes, my opinion is that is a giant no-no as a ton can go wrong.

The live vs F/T is a completely personal choice and that's not a debate I want to be in. Both can be successful, but it's not my business to say either way... everyone can justify what they do at the end of the day, and it's too easy to judge others when you want to have your own opinions heard and accepted as correct... and that will never happen with everyone I'm sure ;) .

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Originally Posted by Eric Alan

Take the pride part out of it and I agree with you. ;) I think the most important part is that your little babies are eating and getting bigger and stronger with every meal. :)

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Fair enough :) .

Anyone who questions the morality of feeding snakes live rodents better be themselves on a raw vegan diet, otherwise the hypocrisy meter is going to explode.

From my experiences, feeder rodents sometimes have a much better end of life than their counterparts in biomedical research. I induce EAE (Experimental Autoimmune Encephalomyelitis), essentially multiple sclerosis, in mice by the hundreds every month, for our research projects. These mice suffer hind limb paralysis and for weeks drag themselves around by their front limbs, until we euthanize and harvest tissue for biochemical analysis. This isn't even the worse possible fate for a research animal. Point is, feeding live simulates nature, albeit not 100%, but it is a much better end than the majority of rodents bred.

The key is to maintaining suitable and ethical living situations for them until they meet their ultimate demise.