Re: crossing state borders with pythons and reticulated pythons
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JoshSloane
Having a Burmese python or retic in the car when pulled over does not incriminate you for crossing state lines with one. Who is to say that you didn't purchase the python in the state that you got pulled over in? The arresting authorities would have to physically catch you in the act of crossing the state line in real time.
This is an unenforceable law.
Correct Josh,
But it is enough to establish reasonable suspicion and followup questions will follow and if probable cause is established things will go down the drain from there. It is the same for various other crimes that are not committed in the presence of law enforcement.
Being the violation is a felony, more time may be put into the investigation to determine where it came from, where the person in question is from and where they are going.
While it is probably the last thing on the minds of officers, it is a crime at this time.
Some folks troll these boards acting like they are into the hobby, but they are secretly building ammo to use against us. It is easy to pull up a history of posts here and use it against somebody down the road.
I think what the MODS are saying is don't draw attention to the board or yourself by advocating illegal transport, and I'm not saying you are.
I know you are "venting" man and I agree with you 100%. Far too many stupid laws and infringements on our rights is becoming the norm.
But the good news is we are fighting this the right way and appear to be making progress.
I joined USARK last year because I was tired of the BS and felt like standing up for our hobby.
I think our efforts will pay off soon!
Re: crossing state borders with pythons and reticulated pythons
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JoshSloane
Having a Burmese python or retic in the car when pulled over does not incriminate you for crossing state lines with one. Who is to say that you didn't purchase the python in the state that you got pulled over in? The arresting authorities would have to physically catch you in the act of crossing the state line in real time.
This is an unenforceable law.
State and county LE doing traffic duty probably won't know (or care) whether or not you are legally transporting a Lacey species.
OTOH Tinley is coming up soon and it's already been reported on some forums that FWS will have a presence there. It would be absurdly easy to walk through the parking lot and note any out-of-state license plates on vehicles.
Re: crossing state borders with pythons and reticulated pythons
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bcr229
State and county LE doing traffic duty probably won't know (or care) whether or not you are legally transporting a Lacey species.
OTOH Tinley is coming up soon and it's already been reported on some forums that FWS will have a presence there. It would be absurdly easy to walk through the parking lot and note any out-of-state license plates on vehicles.
You still do not have a functional understanding of incrimination in a legal setting. Being from out of state and having a lacey act species does NOT incriminate you. These are CRIMINAL charges, not civil. They would have to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that you actively transported banned species across state lines. That means EVIDENCE directly showing you PHYSICALLY crossing the state line with species in hand. Showing up at a reptile show from out of state with banned species doesn't prove a thing. You could have picked them up ten feet across the border.
Re: crossing state borders with pythons and reticulated pythons
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JoshSloane
You could have picked them up ten feet across the border.
A smart and responsible keeper would not put themselves in that situation to start with.
My only questions are: Why are we still discussing illegal activity? AND Why do you continue to support trying to make those that are doing right look bad knowing there are so many good people fighting to have these laws overturned the correct way?
Re: crossing state borders with pythons and reticulated pythons
Uhhhg... Well I appreciated the humor.
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Re: crossing state borders with pythons and reticulated pythons
Quote:
Originally Posted by
PitOnTheProwl
A smart and responsible keeper would not put themselves in that situation to start with.
My only questions are: Why are we still discussing illegal activity? AND Why do you continue to support trying to make those that are doing right look bad knowing there are so many good people fighting to have these laws overturned the correct way?
Because it breaks my heart to have to see people leave their beloved pets behind due to absurd laws created by an administration that tramples our constitutional rights.
The politicians on the hill in DC are not going to overturn this inane act just because all of you are good boys and girls, and don't break their illegal and intrusive laws. You all seem to think that if you just tow the line, and point out the law breakers amongst the reptile community, that they will pat you on the head and give you what you want. Wake up. Writing your innocuous letters and sending 20$ to USARK is worthless.
Use your brain, make your own fundamental decisions as to what is right and wrong.
Re: crossing state borders with pythons and reticulated pythons
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JoshSloane
You still do not have a functional understanding of incrimination in a legal setting. Being from out of state and having a lacey act species does NOT incriminate you. These are CRIMINAL charges, not civil. They would have to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that you actively transported banned species across state lines. That means EVIDENCE directly showing you PHYSICALLY crossing the state line with species in hand. Showing up at a reptile show from out of state with banned species doesn't prove a thing. You could have picked them up ten feet across the border.
You're thinking about the wrong end of the transaction. Buying one from out of state and being caught on dash-cam leaving the state with it in your car would be the problem.
Re: crossing state borders with pythons and reticulated pythons
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bcr229
You're thinking about the wrong end of the transaction. Buying one from out of state and being caught on dash-cam leaving the state with it in your car would be the problem.
Yes, that would be incriminating. But imagine the man power it would take to follow every single person who purchased a snake at the event, and video them all the way to the state line. Even at that, there would be no just cause for a search and seizure.
Re: crossing state borders with pythons and reticulated pythons
Quote:
Originally Posted by
gtrdeath87
Uhhhg... Well I appreciated the humor.
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At least someone has a sense of humor and perspective here.
