Het clown markers

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Originally Posted by grcforce327

Wouldn't common sense tell you to post pics side by side,so people could see the difference?

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Well, excuse me. I am posting from my ipad on tapatalk, as I am out of town. I don't have a pic of a non-het Mojave available and figured something was better than nothing. Guess that's what I get for trying to be helpful....

In the text book world there is recessive where the hets are completely normal 100% of the time and co-dominant where the hets are always clearly visible. As inconvenient as it is for those with a high need for order it seem in the real world it's much messier with a continuum between recessive and co-dominant. Pied was originally considered recessive but IMHO it has some strong co-dominant tendencies. No, it's not all the way to the co-dominant end of the spectrum like say pastel (maybe that's not even a good example as seems I've seen some posts questioning pastel and super pastels). I think hypo also has some fair co-dominant tendencies but maybe not showing quite as regularly as het in pieds. I'm only starting to work with clown so really don't have a feel for how often het clown shows through and which other morphs might make it more likely to show. Some even claim to be able to pick het albinos although I'm a little skeptical on that thinking albino may be very close to the text book recessive end of the spectrum.

Here is a picture of a 3 year old prooven breeder Pastel 100% het clown - that's how we bought him from a reputable breeder. We will prove him ourselves hopefully this year. We are also just starting the clown projects, so I don't know what to look for in het clowns :). Here is a picture:

http://www.gpreptiles.com/foto/kolekcja/pastel1.jpg

For me it looks like a regular pastel, but I have no eye for picking up Clown markers :).

I know this thread is a little dated, but I wanted to chime in too because I think there is a lot of good information and interesting hypotheses related to what's being discussed here.
From my experience working with clowns, there is no way for me to identify, with 100% certainty, which animals carry the clown gene from those that do not. I agree that het clowns often do influence the "look" of a snake, but I don't think that it can be used as a generalization for all het clowns and definitely not as a way to sell a possible het as a 100% het.
I can lay down a few examples of snakes in front of people, some that are hets and some that aren't, and the difference may be so minimal that it could be regarded as a natural variance in the morph or combo. I've hatched out some amazing possible het clown combos that I would bet money they were carrying the gene, but I wouldn't gamble my reputation on it.
It would be an interesting, though lengthy, experiment for someone to test their theory on identifying het clown genetics and I'd love to see what the results were.
Good stuff!!
Thanks,
John

thanks john for your post. it s not outdated at all. many hobbyist would like to be able to pick up their het. clown female to make their own clown with their little budget. So if people keep posting informations on this thread it will benefit to all the little one like many who dreams about their own clown but can t offer to buy 100% het couple.

Het clown not only changes pattern but it changes color too, especially in some morph hets.

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So basically a "het clown" is actually a "clown" and a "visual clown" would be a "super clown"? That is what this theory means?

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No, a het clown is a heterozygous trait and the clown is a super/homozygous trait.
No different than a pastel is a heterozygous trait and it's super/homozygous trait is a super pastel.

It influences yellowbelly's to the extreme ...

2 different lines of yellowbelly moms with their yellowbelly 100% het clown offspring ...
http://i968.photobucket.com/albums/a...s/PICT9430.jpg
http://i968.photobucket.com/albums/a...ps991c0254.jpg

Lots to learn still but I hardly believe het clown is a recessed trait ... low visual heterozygous trait I can believe, hidden recessive trait I don't buy.

Jerry, do you have any pictures of the hets vs non-hets at the same age?

http://market.kingsnake.com/detail.php?cat=32&de=998792 just perusing kingsnake, and that doesn't look like any bumblebee i've seen. a screaming het, imho.

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Originally Posted by nykea

Jerry, do you have any pictures of the hets vs non-hets at the same age?

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The mom hasn't changed too much in color since she was the same size as the daughter yb het.
This is her at 19 months old, sort of close to the same age as the yb het daughter is in the mom daughter pic.
She's a little darker at 4 years old now, but she was never even close to as bright as the yb het daughter.

http://i968.photobucket.com/albums/a...4/PICT4230.jpg