Thoughts on Ralph Davis' newest controversial youtube video?

Just out of curiosity, do any of the vets on here have a comment? And I worng here? I am not trying to say he should not have saved the snakes life, I am just saying he put the snake at just as much risk with HOW he did it.

did he do all that....probably not...who knows though. I by no means was there so I cannot comment. However I do see your point but I also know that there are docs. working in third world countries that don't have that either and treat ppl with success all the time. I would indeed be mad if I went to a vet and that happened as I pay for those machines to sterilze everything perfectly ....its part of my office visit charge.

If the snake did in fact get an infection I am pretty sure he has the medicine to be able to treat the infection as well. Look I am not trying to argue at all....I just think you do what you have to do to save the snake.

i have an excellent reptile vet and i have had several conversations with him on reptile surgeries and other topics realted to the big no no E word (thats...ear muffs reptile evolution).

according to him there is a low survival rate for sedation on reptiles. sedation is really hard on their systems. even during a "routine" procedure, the surivial rate is low.

also, there are new finidngs in scientific journals that the primative nerves of reptiles don't really feel pain as higher order animals. makes sense when you think about how a snake or lizard will burn itself do death on a heat rock.

Sterile is actually hard to do in a hurry, I think that as clean as you can plays in here. I think I would have worn gloves but then again they are in an open box in the snake room and are not much better than my hands. I have a handful of disinfectants but no sterilants. I would guess if any here had the cash sitting around we would buy an ultrasound machine over an autoclave. We can do the best we can and hope it works out. Mr. Davis describes doing the same operation before and apparently it has worked before, and seems to have worked this time as well who am I to complain about the if he used sterile equipment or not.

I have found many breeders whom care for the animals they work with without thought to how much it is worth. How many breeders loose money on normals every year? A normal worth 40 dollars costs quick quickly more than that in food, power, and labor, yet there they are. I hope it never changes, anyone looking at the pet industry at all should take heart with the state of the reptile breeders in general. PETA open your eyes and see!

Sorry rant... :oops:

Lucas....thank you for clarifying that for me. I knew I had heard it somewhere.

I think it is great that he sewed her up, he is a big name breeder who doesnt need to save them for profit and the fact that he showed her and took the time to try to save her instead of just giving up on her, says something about him.

as for the people commenting that he didnt sanitize, if you listen to him revisiting her in the second video, he talks about finding her full of vermiculite and needing to sterile flush etc, so he did sanitize he just didnt film it. He might not have had sterile equipment, but having a sterile field in the snake room would have been next to impossible to just have on stand by. If he hadnt sanitized some how the likelihood of her survival was minimal and I am sure he wasn't worried about if people watching would really think that he washed his hands etc.. but more about putting the baby back together.

I give him :gj::gj: for showing people what their options are when they get a hatchling out that is less than perfect, instead of just culling it.

I can see I am on an island by myself here. I feel he should have taken her to a qualified vet and to post this kind of video can lead others into thinking they can do the same thing could lead to a snake being handled wrong and suffering.

The fact that in the first video he is attempting to "put her guts back in" as he states, only to have someone point out find half of what he was trying to replace in here was indeed yolk and NOT intestines says he was ill-equipped to do this proceedure. He got lucky in the animal not getting an infection, plain and simple. Had he placed the yolk inside, it may have well just absorbed or it may have led to sepsis. I'm not a vet, but I am hard pressed to think of ANY vet who would agree with what he did!

I raised and bred ferrets about 25 years ago, long before they were popular in most pet stores. I've handled thousands and would bet I know more about them then some vets do. However, I would NEVER qualify myself as being able to perform surgery on one just because I bred them and knew more then the avarage joe. And to be honest, surgery is what he preformed. Sans sterilty or even the proper needle or sutures.

I commend him in wanting to save a "$40" normal as someone put it on here. It says a lot of his character and integrity AS a breeder. I just think his method was irresponsible AS a breeder. Let a qualified, trained, LICENSED vet do surgery, or at the VERY least, don't post a video showing how and lead others into trying the same thing at home! There is a reason vetrinarians go to school for four plus years to learn this sort of thing.

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Originally Posted by BroknBusted

I can see I am on an island by myself here. I feel he should have taken her to a qualified vet and to post this kind of video can lead others into thinking they can do the same thing could lead to a snake being handled wrong and suffering.

The fact that in the first video he is attempting to "put her guts back in" as he states, only to have someone point out find half of what he was trying to replace in here was indeed yolk and NOT intestines says he was ill-equipped to do this proceedure. He got lucky in the animal not getting an infection, plain and simple. Had he placed the yolk inside, it may have well just absorbed or it may have led to sepsis. I'm not a vet, but I am hard pressed to think of ANY vet who would agree with what he did!

I raised and bred ferrets about 25 years ago, long before they were popular in most pet stores. I've handled thousands and would bet I know more about them then some vets do. However, I would NEVER qualify myself as being able to perform surgery on one just because I bred them and knew more then the avarage joe. And to be honest, surgery is what he preformed. Sans sterilty or even the proper needle or sutures.

I commend him in wanting to save a "$40" normal as someone put it on here. It says a lot of his character and integrity AS a breeder. I just think his method was irresponsible AS a breeder. Let a qualified, trained, LICENSED vet do surgery, or at the VERY least, don't post a video showing how and lead others into trying the same thing at home! There is a reason vetrinarians go to school for four plus years to learn this sort of thing.

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I have seen all of your comments here on this thread. Just some food for thought. The video was a documentation of what he did. Whether you agree or not, it can be used in the future as a very good tool for someone that may need this type of help. I had the same situation happen to me, and it was on a Saturday. I went to my local vet in an attempt to get a suture kit, and they would not sell me one. I then asked if they would do the surgery for me, and they told me that they would not do it. Therefore, I could let the animal die, or try myself. It just so happens that I talked to some friends that had relayed Ralph's story to me, and I used the info from this event to determine my course of action.

Some vets may decline to do the surgery for whatever reason, and if you are stuck trying to do this yourself, I think the video is invaluable.

Just my .02,

Yes vets go to school for years for this sort of thing( I am in the process as we speak), and as the person above me said they decide where to draw the line of what they will and wont do based on their opinion...in that school they get told to draw the line at a certain point, a point that they decide for themselves based on their years of schooling. How is their years of schooling more validated than years of seeing, breeding and working with these animals?

Ideally Ralph would have had a surgical suite attached to his snake room whisked the little one in there documented from start to finish his entire clean up, sterilization, and wound closure and made a public service announcement saying that this had a risk of septicemia, infection, dehession and various other complications and had his DVM.

How ever what he did was fairly similar to what would have been done if a vet would have agreed to complete it for him ( and when you first saw that wound, that would have been a BIG IF). They would have cleaned the wound, put what they needed to back inside and stitched her up. Yes they would have worn gloves and had an operating room, but the actual procedure is the same thing.

I still say he did the right thing and that the choice he made was far better than just culling the little thing without giving it a chance, and just look at her now.. an gly tummy but a wonderful looking snake!

sorry for the rant.

Muddoc, while I am truly sorry the vet didn't agree to do the surgery, do you understand there is a reason WHY he refused to give you a suture kit? Because you are not QUALIFIED nor TRAINED to do surgery. If it were that easy, sterile sutures kits would be available in the local pet store or CVS!

If you had a dog that you felt needed surgery and the vet declined due to the fact the surgery may not work or the dog could suffer more, would you take the dog home and do it yourself?

Even if snakes do not feel pain in the sense that we do, I am willing to bet the feel something. There was a gentleman here who posted of a snake being chewed by a mouse left in the cage. Just about EVERYONE stated this guy should have taken the snake to the vet and some were pretty nasty in how they said it. How is THIS any different? Just because the guy breeds them? He is STILL not a vet!

Again, just because this proceedure done the way he did it worked doesn't make it right. Even if it worked out well 9 of 10 times, the one time that a snake gets an infection due to lack of sterility and proper techniques by someone following his video is one time to many. And thus, irresponsible to show it.

Muddoc, you say this happened to you this past Sat. I truly truly wish you and your snake all the best! However, if you find that tomorrow this snake has a very bad life threating infection, would you STILL agree that what he did was right in HOW he did it ( I am NOT arguing that the snake should not have been saved, just saved by a qualified vet)?

Please keep us updated on your snakes progress and please post pics as well of your sutures on him/her.