cruel world

One thing I always tell people is that a pair of snakes got on Noah's Ark.

lol i never thought of that one.

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Originally Posted by qiksilver

Education is great, but it won't reach everyone, this family is a perfect example. They were probably not afraid of your snakes, they were probably just reacting to poor information and the stigma surrounding these animals. People like that often will not change their ways either.

sorry for the rant.

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Or, just a step to right, they actually are ignorant louts. It is well within the realm of possibility that they feel just fine about speaking as and how they did, knowing that for an instant or two they were the centers of attention and now having bragging rights with all the other right thinking friends they have about having had the stones to speak up in public.

These people may well be misinformed but who is to blame for that? Anyone who hasn't figured out that a single source is not a verification is either an ignorant lout or mentally lacking.

I see folks like this on occasion. I liken them to landmines in the dogpark. Watch where you step and you're ok. Don't watch were you step and you've got poop on your shoes.

I hate getting poop on my shoes.

I prefer being barefoot, but that is another subject all together and I don't want to hijack this thread.

lol i am glad that most people see the good in what i try to do and support us for it. as for the ones who say i am wrong for taking my snakes into public, the way i see it is if someone doesnt go out and show that snakes arent evil, bad, and mean the more likely we are to have restrictions put on our hobby. if we reach the right people when it comes up in conversation at a higher party that person may stand up and say look i have seen kids with snakes and i dont see any harm they are causing

yeah i've had that happen.. i take my boa in pet stores when i need to buy stuff and its nice out.. an old lady called me a sick-o.. i got called a crazy bastard.. you name it.. i got it.. the managers know me.. they tell me to let it go.. i know how frustrating it feels:mad:

i havent taken my snake out yet, and i would expect one person in about 15 to be nagative about snakes and reptiles in general, but thats fine keep it to yourself and dont go out of your way to make a scene like a lot of them seem to do.

Ya their are lots of these type of people in this world that are like that towards reptiles period. I do alot of showings my self, mostly with in the school system. I get and answer many questions to things like those comments. You just have to bit your tongue and let it go. I know it is very hard to.

Personally, I don't agree with taking snakes into 'public' places like you did. It is that sort of stuff that causes problems.

...last time we had to go to Baton Rouge to protest the restrictive legislation was because some guy kept a burm in his back yard and the neighbor decided they should be illegal to own because they could harm his kids.

...next time we will probably have to go fight legislation because a pissed off old man saw a guy walking around with a snake on his shoulder in public and was offended.

Keep your snakes at home. They are not dogs you take for a walk.

Not to mention the health risks to the reptile by being dragged around without proper conditions....

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Originally Posted by daniel1983

Personally, I don't agree with taking snakes into 'public' places like you did. It is that sort of stuff that causes problems.

...last time we had to go to Baton Rouge to protest the restrictive legislation was because some guy kept a burm in his back yard and the neighbor decided they should be illegal to own because they could harm his kids.

...next time we will probably have to go fight legislation because a pissed off old man saw a guy walking around with a snake on his shoulder in public and was offended.

Keep your snakes at home. They are not dogs you take for a walk. Not to mention the health risks to the reptile by being dragged around without proper conditions....

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so just because i dont own the normal pet it should be banned to stay in a cage. i disagree with you and i feel that education the public is very good and if more people would do it we may not would have such a problem with things like this. i have brought my snakes out for years and have not had one get sick or die ever so it must not be to hard on them. when they go to the vet they always get a perfect bill of health.

honestly, not shocking how people can react. i heard if all before and i just laugh about it. i learn to realize that 1.some people are affraid(thats fine) 2. alot of people dislike them due to the lack of knowledge about snakes 3. alot of times what is shown on T.V. & Movies, it puts a negative outlook in peoples mind about them. sometimes, they can get the best of us because our passion & love for reptile are very strong. sucks to be them, they're just missing out on out a really Kool Addiction !

Many adults are too set in their opinions to have an open mind about new things. As they see it, you're flaunting these evil disgusting creatures in front of their faces and they aren't going to take it well.

Nobody is saying don't educate people. Go to schools. Cub Scouts. Brownies. Reach the children who don't already have this bias against reptiles. Most of the adults that react negatively, always will. And it's most likely because they had little to no exposure to snakes their whole lives. That combined with the stigma surrounding them, adds up to a deep seeded hatred for these animals that we love so much.

I guess what I'm saying is go to the root of the problem. Expose people to snakes and other reptiles before they decide not to like em. Call up schools or different organizations and offer to bring a few snakes to show the kids. Don't just take your snakes wherever and expect sunshine and daisies. Because, as you've seen firsthand, that's not always the case.

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Originally Posted by daniel1983

Personally, I don't agree with taking snakes into 'public' places like you did. It is that sort of stuff that causes problems.

...last time we had to go to Baton Rouge to protest the restrictive legislation was because some guy kept a burm in his back yard and the neighbor decided they should be illegal to own because they could harm his kids.

...next time we will probably have to go fight legislation because a pissed off old man saw a guy walking around with a snake on his shoulder in public and was offended.

Keep your snakes at home. They are not dogs you take for a walk.

Not to mention the health risks to the reptile by being dragged around without proper conditions....

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AGAIN, comparing Burms to Balls, is like comparing house cats to Tigers. Not very good comparison at all. try again.

If it were me, i would have lashed out and said something like "Ask yourself: Are you a man or a mouse?" or something witty like that, because I'm not very good in situations like that and usually the person dies a little bit on the inside. Oh, and just for the record, I have a German shepard, and it is the friendliest dog you would ever meet, so I'm not sure if you were being serious or not but I apprieciate you not saying that dogs are gonna eat me at night. Every german shepard I have met is so friendly.

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Originally Posted by daniel1983

Personally, I don't agree with taking snakes into 'public' places like you did. It is that sort of stuff that causes problems.

...last time we had to go to Baton Rouge to protest the restrictive legislation was because some guy kept a burm in his back yard and the neighbor decided they should be illegal to own because they could harm his kids.

...next time we will probably have to go fight legislation because a pissed off old man saw a guy walking around with a snake on his shoulder in public and was offended.

Keep your snakes at home. They are not dogs you take for a walk.

Not to mention the health risks to the reptile by being dragged around without proper conditions....

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EXCELLENT POST!

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Originally Posted by python.princess

Many adults are too set in their opinions to have an open mind about new things. As they see it, you're flaunting these evil disgusting creatures in front of their faces and they aren't going to take it well.

Nobody is saying don't educate people. Go to schools. Cub Scouts. Brownies. Reach the children who don't already have this bias against reptiles. Most of the adults that react negatively, always will. And it's most likely because they had little to no exposure to snakes their whole lives. That combined with the stigma surrounding them, adds up to a deep seeded hatred for these animals that we love so much.

I guess what I'm saying is go to the root of the problem. Expose people to snakes and other reptiles before they decide not to like em. Call up schools or different organizations and offer to bring a few snakes to show the kids. Don't just take your snakes wherever and expect sunshine and daisies. Because, as you've seen firsthand, that's not always the case.

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I'm 14 and got my snake when I was 13 and my parents had nothing against snakes and reptiles.

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Originally Posted by CRAZY

I'm 14 and got my snake when I was 13 and my parents had nothing against snakes and reptiles.

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I'm not sure how that's relevant. We're talking about people who DO have something against them.

Exactly. We weren't saying that ALL adults have that pre-programmed hatred. But there's a lot of them out there.

I agree that going to the young source is the best way to educate. I shall tell a story:

Working at the zoo, I loved teaching about reptiles in particular. We had a wonderful Ball python named Naomi (the one who got me hooked on the species), adult female about 4' long, who was an excellent 'teaching snake'. Well, I had her outside on my lap one afternoon on the zoo grounds, letting older kids come up and pet her, and just talking about her to the public...when this 5-6 year old boy walked up with a torn look. When I told him he could over and see her, he told me that his parents had told him snakes were bad and would hurt him. Naturally, I checked a huge sigh and proceeded to explain that not ALL snakes were like that. I let him know that he should stay away from Rattlesnakes and the like since THEY could hurt him, but that Naomi and other snakes like her were good snakes. I had to keep my words simple, but oh man the results were great! The look in that kid's eyes was wonderful!
Well, he ran off to a woman I hadn't noticed standing quite a ways away, giving me 'that look'. You know, the one that says 'OMG how can you hold that thing'... The boy rushed over and started telling her that not all snakes are bad, and this one is really nice, and all that. Well, in the end she came a bit closer and eventually let me know that she had been bitten by a bull snake as a young child. That had given her the dislike of all snakes. She listened to what I had to say, and even let her son touch Naomi (I had sanitizer right next to me, of course). After all was said and done, I think she was ready to allow her son to like snakes...which I could tell he did before but felt bad about.

So, there are victories to be won...you just have to pick your battlefields carefully.

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Originally Posted by CRAZY

If it were me, i would have lashed out and said something like "Ask yourself: Are you a man or a mouse?" or something witty like that, because I'm not very good in situations like that and usually the person dies a little bit on the inside. Oh, and just for the record, I have a German shepard, and it is the friendliest dog you would ever meet, so I'm not sure if you were being serious or not but I apprieciate you not saying that dogs are gonna eat me at night. Every german shepard I have met is so friendly.

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I am 30 years old and have very pronounced scars on the back of my head from being attacked by a German Shepherd when I was 3 years old. It took 170 stitches and 8 hours of surgery to put me back together. It just further proves that one specimen doesn't define the breed.

when i made that post about german shepards i just picked a large breed i love dogs, but in all honesty i am more caustious around large gods than i am around my snakes. i know a girl that is disfigured for life due to a dog attacking her face as a child and a friend of mine had to have like 25 staples in his head from one. now thats 2 people in this small town im in and i know no one that has been seriously hurt by snakes. but i have large dogs and my brother and brother in laws raise pit bulls and even mastifs so i pretty much love all animals. but i do own the most vicsious animal alive she would rather kill you than to look at you, we call her the doodle. i will post a pic asap

Keep your snakes at home.

You and your snakes will be much happier and safer.

You have to respect the fact that many people will never accept them and may even try to do them(and you) harm.

Expecting people to think like you is asking alot of them.

I dont even let my neighbors know I have them because I dont expect everyone to understand.

Never under estimate the power of stupidity, it can be quite a powerful force!

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Originally Posted by nchapa

AGAIN, comparing Burms to Balls, is like comparing house cats to Tigers. Not very good comparison at all. try again.

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a snake is a snake to most people regardless of its size. whether they are 3ft or 30ft, they are all venomous and they can all kill you. just keep them in the privacy of your own home. theres no benefit to you or the animal to parade around with a snake around your neck.

When you take your snake into public, your forcing the public to see your snake. It's intrusive, and most likely does more damage than good.

For every person that came up to you to say hi and chat, I'd say easily 10 did not approach and are appalled by you bringing this animal into public and will vote in favor of damaging legislation to our hobby.

For real, be smart and keep our strange or exotic animals at home. The public isn't going to suddenly trust you because your snake hasn't killed you in the few seconds they've seen it, they will cast judgements on the entire industry as crazy snake people that put others in danger by toting around their animals.

People are generally ok seeing them on TV, but heaven forbid if they have to walk by one in a store.

Why does it seem no one understands that concept?

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Originally Posted by dmaricle

so just because i dont own the normal pet it should be banned to stay in a cage.

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Banned in a cage? This isn't a dog we're talking about here, it's a snake. A wild, primitive snake. A species of snake that across the board has been shown to prefer sleeping in a hide rather than taken out, handled and on top of that into less than ideal conditions. It's majorly stressful on the animal, and that affects them, mostly for the worse.

Also, how is your home not a large enough space anyways? Does the animal HAVE to go outside? Does it have to go to a store for stimulation? :rolleyes: That's the worst excuse I have seen besides one other person that lets their BP's sleep with them and never cages them.

To all you people that are telling the OP to keep his pets at home. SHAME ON YOU!!! You are acting no better then the people that insulted him. If he wants to share his passion for reptiles with others and is doing it in an appropriate manner then who are you or anyone else to tell him that he can't or shouldn't do that. It's not like he had them in a eating establishment or even a public park. They were in a PET STORE!! Where people should come expecting to see pets. If you have to hide what you love, then maybe you really don't love it that much.

:rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by snakecharmer3638

To all you people that are telling the OP to keep his pets at home. SHAME ON YOU!!! You are acting no better then the people that insulted him. If he wants to share his passion for reptiles with others and is doing it in an appropriate manner then who are you or anyone else to tell him that he can't or shouldn't do that. It's not like he had them in a eating establishment or even a public park. They were in a PET STORE!! Where people should come expecting to see pets. If you have to hide what you love, then maybe you really don't love it that much.

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Shame on me for being smart and trying to avoid having all our rights taken away? By understanding that in general people are VERY afraid of snakes and do not like seeing these animals in public?

You believe I don't love my pets because I'm not taking them out of their specific husbandry and habitat requirements and showing them off to a less than friendly public?

Shame on me for loving my animals so much, I don't want them taken from me because I decided to take a stroll with them in front of those who would see my animal as dangerous and a killing machine?

Right.... I must be off my rocker! :rolleyes:

So you think hiding it is going to make people forget it is there and keep them from taking it away. Maybe the better thing to do is to educate which is what the OP was doing. Again I will say, in an appropriate setting, A PET STORE!! :gj:

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Originally Posted by snakecharmer3638

So you think hiding it is going to make people forget it is there and keep them from taking it away. Maybe the better thing to do is to educate which is what the OP was doing. Again I will say, in an appropriate setting, A PET STORE!! :gj:

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And my point was, I don't think a pet store is an appropriate setting. Neither for the snakes health, or for the reason of forcing other people to see the animal out from behind the glass cage.

I chalk it up to difference of opinions.

There are other more effective ways of educating people. Not shock and awe.

Then I guess we agree to disagree. Which is what makes this such a wonderful place to live. But lets not try to tell someone what they should or shouldn't do. Just because it's not what we agree or disagree with. GOOD DAY;)

Well, I agree that non-dangerous pets should not be hidden for fear of what a few ignorants may think. Education is the key to changing some of these peoples' minds. Although, there are some out there that do have a profound fear of snakes, and we also need to respect that. But, again, if many of these people understood that BPs are not venomous, not aggressive, and usually just roll up into a ball when scared, then perhaps they would react differently (or a few of them anyway).

However, I think it is very dangerous-to the snakes- to be removing them from the safe environment in which they are housed. It is especially dangerous when exposing them to an environment in which other snakes with contagious diseases may be present. There is a show down here at the local museum of science, called Snake Day, and everyone is encouraged to bring their snakes. In fact, they receive free admission for 2 when you bring your snake. At first, I thought it would be really neat. Then I realized that I could be exposing my snake to potentially life-threatening diseases, so I chose no to go.

Anyway, I do absolutely agree that no one should insult anyone else for taking their non-venomous snake to a pet store. That was totally uncalled for, and extremely rude.

Personally, I don't see anything wrong with taking your pet bp on an outing to the pet store with you, provided the weather conditions are suitable for taking your bp outside. Especially if they sell that species at said store. Now, once you open the door and step out of your private life and into the public eye, you should expect to be met with mixed reactions. Everyone does have an opinion, and some individuals seem overly inclined to express EVERY opinion or thought that that passes through their mind. It's just something you have to take as it comes, and let slide off your back. I would say to beware of taking your snake into a pet store, not because of the reactions of people, but due to the possibility of picking up some unexpected hitchhikers.

I don't personally feel that telling people to keep their snakes inside and out of the public eye is going to help beat uneducated legislation however. That's just my opinion though, so take it for what it is...

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Originally Posted by snakecharmer3638

To all you people that are telling the OP to keep his pets at home. SHAME ON YOU!!! You are acting no better then the people that insulted him. If he wants to share his passion for reptiles with others and is doing it in an appropriate manner then who are you or anyone else to tell him that he can't or shouldn't do that. It's not like he had them in a eating establishment or even a public park. They were in a PET STORE!! Where people should come expecting to see pets. If you have to hide what you love, then maybe you really don't love it that much.

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What we are saying is what is best for the pet and the OP. If you want to share your passion for reptiles then do it with people that accept reptiles, for example here on this forum or in person with other reptile lovers. Forcing people to be around animals they hate is not the way to "share your passion" but most likely to get people to want these animals banned because they feel threatened. There is a time and place for everything. I like to listen to loud hardrock music so that does that mean I can go around blaring my music in a music store(since they sell music) because I want to share my passion? No of course not. It is about being considerate of others, not imposing our hobbies on others and causing negative feedback to the reptile community.

What we are saying is being a responsible reptile owner and not a "hey look at me reptile owner". That gives us a bad rap.

In other words share your passion responsibly.

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Originally Posted by West Coast Jungle

What we are saying is what is best for the pet and the OP. If you want to share your passion for reptiles then do it with people that accept reptiles, for example here on this forum or in person with other reptile lovers. Forcing people to be around animals they hate is not the way to "share your passion" but most likely to get people to want these animals banned because they feel threatened. There is a time and place for everything. I like to listen to loud hardrock music so that does that mean I can go around blaring my music in a music store(since they sell music) because I want to share my passion? No of course not. It is about being considerate of others, not imposing our hobbies on others and causing negative feedback to the reptile community.

What we are saying is being a responsible reptile owner and not a "hey look at me reptile owner". That gives us a bad rap.

In other words share your passion responsibly.

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Again, agree to disagree. I just don't feel we as a community should say don't do it because we don't agree with it. He wasn't blaring his snake in the pet store he was sharing it with a select few who wanted to here it and someone didn't like it so they want to try and make him quit listening. Well maybe they should go to the other side of the store where they can't here it.:D

Sorry I meant hear not here.:rolleye2:

We will never change the opinions and fears that people have about snakes. We won't "educate" them, or "change their minds"

I think the safest thing we can do as snake keepers is to "keep" them to ourselves. My neighbors don't even know I keep snakes. Someone once asked me where all the used bedding in my mulch pile was coming from and I told them I was babysitting a friends hampster. The less your community know about your addiction the better off we will all be. Whenever I see someone out in public with a snake I am reminded that snakes have no ego.

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Originally Posted by West Coast Jungle

What we are saying is what is best for the pet and the OP. If you want to share your passion for reptiles then do it with people that accept reptiles, for example here on this forum or in person with other reptile lovers. Forcing people to be around animals they hate is not the way to "share your passion" but most likely to get people to want these animals banned because they feel threatened. There is a time and place for everything. I like to listen to loud hardrock music so that does that mean I can go around blaring my music in a music store(since they sell music) because I want to share my passion? No of course not. It is about being considerate of others, not imposing our hobbies on others and causing negative feedback to the reptile community.

What we are saying is being a responsible reptile owner and not a "hey look at me reptile owner". That gives us a bad rap.

In other words share your passion responsibly.

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yes I agree with this line of reasoning wholeheartedly, while I sympathise somewhat with the way they were treated ( sorry forgot the names) I also see the other side of the coin in that people do not want to feel something is forced upon them.

It is hard to educate people that dont want to be, especially when there is fear and loathing involved.

I dont know what the pet stores are like in the USA but here in the UK the stores I frequent or have visited are pretty cramped for space so even taking a pet in there would force people to be uncomfortably close to them.

I take my snakes to schools and cub scout meetings etc to focus on the youth growing up and try to educate them, although I have not done any this year due to various reasons.

You could arrange an open day and hand out leaflets for example to show or teach people about your snakes, just an idea.

Personally I dont think its a good idea to take your snakes out in public just to take them out or in the hope to educate those thatt will listen simply because you are whatever way you dress it up forcing your animals within proximity of those that will not appreciate it and as has been mentioned the possibility of damaging your pets health inadvertenly.

I am not criticising the people who do this just offering my view.

I think teaching people is excellent and worthwhile I just dont know that doing like that is the answer. I would rather stick with the schools and such like or arrange open days yourself for people to come to you and see what amazing animals you have and the knowledge you have to pass on.

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Originally Posted by Jenn

We will never change the opinions and fears that people have about snakes. We won't "educate" them, or "change their minds"

I think the safest thing we can do as snake keepers is to "keep" them to ourselves. My neighbors don't even know I keep snakes. Someone once asked me where all the used bedding in my mulch pile was coming from and I told them I was babysitting a friends hampster. The less your community know about your addiction the better off we will all be. Whenever I see someone out in public with a snake I am reminded that snakes have no ego.

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Same here, my neighbors have no idea because I don't think they would understand. They would think that the snakes were going to escape & eat them while they slept. Sad, but true. I am slowly educating my family & co-workers about them, but this has not required that I take my snakes out in public at all. & I don't expect any of these people to go out & now get themselves a pet BP. But at least they also know that they are not 'killer' snakes.

There are things that can be done to educate some of the public (to a degree), but it does not need to endanger the animals.

Everybody that I know on a personal level knows that I have pet snakes. Most are surprised, some and interested, some thrilled, and some repulsed. There's no reason to hide it- just don't go and shove em in people's faces. And whether you want to admit it or not, that's what you're doing when you take them out in public.

Again I will say- NOBODY IS SAYING NOT TO TRY AND EDUCATE THE PUBLIC! Just be smart about it. Set something up with the local schools or different organizations like Cub Scouts, Girl Scouts, Brownies, etc. You could maybe even set something up with that pet store you can't seem to keep your animals out of. Set up a date and time and put posters up for people to see. That way, the people interested can make sure to come and the people who aren't can't say they weren't warned! I'm all for education but I just feel that there are better ways to go about it than your current method.

I never said your pet should be 'banned' to a cage. I will say that you need to be more responsible with your pet before your activities effect the rest of the community.

I understand the need to educate. However, most education needs to take place in some sort of controled environment (i.e. a classroom, seminar, etc.)....for your reptile's safety and our hobby's future.

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Originally Posted by nchapa

AGAIN, comparing Burms to Balls, is like comparing house cats to Tigers. Not very good comparison at all. try again.

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Not a good comparision for an educated reptile keeper, but that is not your 'audience' in most public situations.

Your audience consists of the uneducated when you take reptiles out in the public.

Most people do not know the difference between a ball python and a burm. Most people know the difference between a tiger and a house cat. Not a good comparision at all. Try again.

For all you know, that guy was complaining because he thought they were handling a copperhead sabertooth cobra.

I have seen people terrified of corn snakes because they thought they were venomous. All that matters is the 'public perception'....

Please give an explanation why it is not a good comparision in the given situation.

ok for all the people who say im shoving snakes in peoples face, you have no clue what you are talking about i did not go up to people and say look at this i did not enter the store with plans to talk to people i walked in and the workers came running so we stepped off to the side and talked kids came running and their parents followed they asked questions i gave answers. the store is huge plenty of room the stay the hell away from me. if you dont like it like i said get the hell away from me. as for the couple of people who make sure no one knows they have snakes lol thats sad i dont give a rats ass if people dont like what i keep in my house if you dont like it then move!!!! i force nothing on noone. and its not like i live in canada or some place where its cold here we maintain a 60 to 80 percent humidity and about 90 to 95 degrees so im not taking them out in the snow. im not putting them down to play with the other 3 snakes that are in that huge store. so if you dont like the things i do keep thats you i could care less. as far as im concerned i care more what my rats think than most of the people here. have a nice day

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Originally Posted by dmaricle

ok for all the people who say im shoving snakes in peoples face, you have no clue what you are talking about i did not go up to people and say look at this i did not enter the store with plans to talk to people i walked in and the workers came running so we stepped off to the side and talked kids came running and their parents followed they asked questions i gave answers. the store is huge plenty of room the stay the hell away from me. if you dont like it like i said get the hell away from me. as for the couple of people who make sure no one knows they have snakes lol thats sad i dont give a rats ass if people dont like what i keep in my house if you dont like it then move!!!! i force nothing on noone. and its not like i live in canada or some place where its cold here we maintain a 60 to 80 percent humidity and about 90 to 95 degrees so im not taking them out in the snow. im not putting them down to play with the other 3 snakes that are in that huge store. so if you dont like the things i do keep thats you i could care less. as far as im concerned i care more what my rats think than most of the people here. have a nice day

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No one said you are 'shoving snakes in peoples face'. You seem to enjoy taking things personally when someone offers you an opinion.

People are asking you to be a little more respectful...thats all.

Your attitude of 'i dont give a rats ass' is what ruins this hobby.

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Originally Posted by dmaricle

ok for all the people who say im shoving snakes in peoples face, you have no clue what you are talking

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Wrong again. Do you have any phobias? Fears are not always rational. Just because YOU know your snake won't fly 30 feet across the room at them, doesn't mean they're not going to be afraid of the possibility. Just because YOU know your snake isn't venomous, doesn't mean they're not going to be afraid it's going to strike at and kill their child. Just because YOU know that your snake will only ever get 5' doesn't mean that they don't think it's going to grow into a 30' monster with an appetite for little children.

Like I said. Instead of just waltzing in with the snakes, set it up ahead of time. Post something on the door advertising it. That way the people who are uncomfortable with it, can avoid it. It's that simple.

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Originally Posted by daniel1983

No one said you are 'shoving snakes in peoples face'. You seem to enjoy taking things personally when someone offers you an opinion.

People are asking you to be a little more respectful...thats all.

Your attitude of 'i dont give a rats ass' is what ruins this hobby.

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Actually, SOME people are asking him to do something, what I'm not exactly sure.

You see, no one who has not seen how he behaves when he has his snakes in public actually knows any facts.

I say take them out and edumacate the public if you can. He seems to have a place where he is expected, enjoyed and appreciated.

It's a bloody pet shop that carries reptiles. That is one of the best places I can think of to do the showing and telling that he has spoken of. He's not going to the grocery store and losing it in the ice cream aisle, he's responsibly taking it to a place he knows he will be appreciated in.

Lighten up guys.

Having someone who is the ed clark type of person, all bullsnot and lies, doing most of what he does solely for the attention and not to actually be helpful to the public, THOSE are the types who should not be out in public representing those who keep reptiles.

Sounds like this dmaricle guy has a plan and is working to help all of us.

SO, until someone actually sees and has proof that he is behaving in a manner detrimental to the rest of us, pipe down and sit back, I can't see the screen.

i know people are scared of them thats why i keep my distance from them. ok if they think this snake will get thirty feet great but it wont do it in 5 min. i was not blocking the door i was way off from the people. i was sitting with the managers and workers to even get close to the snakes they had to walk to me i was far from the doors and main part of the store.

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Originally Posted by wilomn

Actually, SOME people are asking him to do something, what I'm not exactly sure.

You see, no one who has not seen how he behaves when he has his snakes in public actually knows any facts.

I say take them out and edumacate the public if you can. He seems to have a place where he is expected, enjoyed and appreciated.

It's a bloody pet shop that carries reptiles. That is one of the best places I can think of to do the showing and telling that he has spoken of. He's not going to the grocery store and losing it in the ice cream aisle, he's responsibly taking it to a place he knows he will be appreciated in.

Lighten up guys.

Having someone who is the ed clark type of person, all bullsnot and lies, doing most of what he does solely for the attention and not to actually be helpful to the public, THOSE are the types who should not be out in public representing those who keep reptiles.

Sounds like this dmaricle guy has a plan and is working to help all of us.

SO, until someone actually sees and has proof that he is behaving in a manner detrimental to the rest of us, pipe down and sit back, I can't see the screen.

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thanks at least someone seeing my point, its a freaking pet store where its fine to bring in pets. they actually recommend it. 90% of the people there love when we come and when i go without them they are like ahh man where are your snakes. i also go in and sex their snakes for them. so they welcome me and our snakes.

That is Exactly the point! It all depends on WHERE you do your educating, and how.

Taking a snake out wrapped around your neck like some Rambo butch guy (which, incidentally, is just what the idiot upstairs used to do with the normal female I rescued from him) to the grocery store or liquor store (that's where he took her), is VERY irresponsible and gives our great hobby a worse image. Not to mention it is potentially dangerous for the snake (diseases, irrational people...)

Going to a pet store, where you are known and accepted, or some other location that focuses on animals and sitting off where people can come or not to their choosing is the RIGHT way to take these animals into the public. The more people we have doing it the right way, the more receptive people we can cure of ignorance.
Yes, there will always be rude crude morons out there, which is a main reason for keeping your animals near you and in your sight at ALL times while out. But the goal is to reduce the numbers of those types and increase the knowledgeable and understanding types.

well i wish most of the people here thought that way

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Originally Posted by dmaricle

well i wish most of the people here thought that way

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If wishin were fishin we'd all have poles growing out our.....excretory orifici.

That would make sitting in polite company quite uncomfortable.

Remember that.

Or don't frequent places where polite company is the norm.

I have a dog vet and I have a reptile vet, both treat "all animals" but my dog vet really isn't good with herps. Anyway, here are two snake in public (if vet's are public) stories, the difference in "presentation" and reaction is stark.
Situation 1:
I took my puppy to the dog vet for a checkup and boosters. I walked in the waiting room and there was a woman pacing back and forth (in a 'look at me' way) with a small BP around her neck. It was fall and too cold for the snake to be 'out' but there was no carrier or box, she just had him around her neck. I asked if it had a box or carrier as it was cold out (because I already knew what she was going to say) and she said no, it goes everywhere with her and just stays around her neck. I then asked what the problem was with the snake. Turns out it hadn't eaten in a few months and wasn't acting 'right' (whatever that is to her). I realized pretty quickly that she was not someone I really wanted to have a lengthy conversation with so merely wished her well. After she was shown to an exam room the girls at the desk started talking, turns out two people/patients left in fear and/or repulsion. OK, it's a vet's office and one should expect to see anything there but she was flaunting the snake that, to me anyway, seemed more an accessory than pet. She was clearly forcing her snake on anyone that got within eyesight just for the "wow" factor. Poor snake.
Situation 2:
I took a fecal sample to my herp vet, usually a quick drop off but they were very busy. As I was waiting a woman came in, I'd guess her to be in her late 60's or so. She went to the desk area and was waiting to check in when a young man came in with a box. The woman asked what was in the box and then said she probably didn't want to know. He told her it was a Corn snake. She made the 'oh my God a snake' face and took a step back, gave a nervous laugh and asked if it could get out of the box. She was clearly fascinated with the 'box' though and eventually started asking him what it ate, what the point of a snake was, why did he get it, was it his only one, do you really take them to the vet like a dog or cat...her questions were endless and he answered each with ease. Each answer she got she took about half a step closer to him and the 'box'. Before long she was sitting next to him on the bench, forgetting there was a snake right there! He asked politely if she would like to see it and she said "no, but do you really have rats in your freezer?" That one threw her for a loop. By this time I had given my baggie o-poo to the receptionist but sat back down to watch this play out. After a few more questions she decided she did indeed want to see the snake. He grinned from ear to ear and opened the box and she grinned and said it wasn't so scary anymore now that she knew more about them. She even offered that, although she may never get one, it was pretty...would it be OK to touch it? I watched him take it out and watched her slowly reach for it as I left.
I don't take my snakes out in public, that is a choice I have made. Most of my neighbors (I live in an apartment complex) don't know I have them, I just think that's probably best. I'm not saying the OP is right or wrong or that the people's reaction was right or wrong. I just recalled those two very different encounters and the reactions of the people in each. The kid at the herp vet educated a waiting room full of folks and 'converted' and older, semi-frightened woman. The woman at the dog vet annoyed, scared and/or repulsed a waiting room full of folks. Who knows what would have happened if the kid walked in with the snake around his neck or if the woman had her BP in a box but I do think the kid had it right.
Had the OP been there with a tarantula and I walked in I would not have been thrilled and may have left, pet shop or not. I wouldn't have been rude or caused a scene but I don't like big spiders and certainly don't want to see them out. Even though I know they won't chase me and kill me I like them to be behind glass. Irrational as it is it is not something I could just ignore and continue on with my shopping.
Sorry for prattling on... :)

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Originally Posted by Inknsteel

I am 30 years old and have very pronounced scars on the back of my head from being attacked by a German Shepherd when I was 3 years old. It took 170 stitches and 8 hours of surgery to put me back together. It just further proves that one specimen doesn't define the breed.

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I'm sorry to hear that...

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Originally Posted by Clementine_3

I have a dog vet and I have a reptile vet, both treat "all animals" but my dog vet really isn't good with herps. Anyway, here are two snake in public (if vet's are public) stories, the difference in "presentation" and reaction is stark.
Situation 1:
I took my puppy to the dog vet for a checkup and boosters. I walked in the waiting room and there was a woman pacing back and forth (in a 'look at me' way) with a small BP around her neck. It was fall and too cold for the snake to be 'out' but there was no carrier or box, she just had him around her neck. I asked if it had a box or carrier as it was cold out (because I already knew what she was going to say) and she said no, it goes everywhere with her and just stays around her neck. I then asked what the problem was with the snake. Turns out it hadn't eaten in a few months and wasn't acting 'right' (whatever that is to her). I realized pretty quickly that she was not someone I really wanted to have a lengthy conversation with so merely wished her well. After she was shown to an exam room the girls at the desk started talking, turns out two people/patients left in fear and/or repulsion. OK, it's a vet's office and one should expect to see anything there but she was flaunting the snake that, to me anyway, seemed more an accessory than pet. She was clearly forcing her snake on anyone that got within eyesight just for the "wow" factor. Poor snake.
Situation 2:
I took a fecal sample to my herp vet, usually a quick drop off but they were very busy. As I was waiting a woman came in, I'd guess her to be in her late 60's or so. She went to the desk area and was waiting to check in when a young man came in with a box. The woman asked what was in the box and then said she probably didn't want to know. He told her it was a Corn snake. She made the 'oh my God a snake' face and took a step back, gave a nervous laugh and asked if it could get out of the box. She was clearly fascinated with the 'box' though and eventually started asking him what it ate, what the point of a snake was, why did he get it, was it his only one, do you really take them to the vet like a dog or cat...her questions were endless and he answered each with ease. Each answer she got she took about half a step closer to him and the 'box'. Before long she was sitting next to him on the bench, forgetting there was a snake right there! He asked politely if she would like to see it and she said "no, but do you really have rats in your freezer?" That one threw her for a loop. By this time I had given my baggie o-poo to the receptionist but sat back down to watch this play out. After a few more questions she decided she did indeed want to see the snake. He grinned from ear to ear and opened the box and she grinned and said it wasn't so scary anymore now that she knew more about them. She even offered that, although she may never get one, it was pretty...would it be OK to touch it? I watched him take it out and watched her slowly reach for it as I left.
I don't take my snakes out in public, that is a choice I have made. Most of my neighbors (I live in an apartment complex) don't know I have them, I just think that's probably best. I'm not saying the OP is right or wrong or that the people's reaction was right or wrong. I just recalled those two very different encounters and the reactions of the people in each. The kid at the herp vet educated a waiting room full of folks and 'converted' and older, semi-frightened woman. The woman at the dog vet annoyed, scared and/or repulsed a waiting room full of folks. Who knows what would have happened if the kid walked in with the snake around his neck or if the woman had her BP in a box but I do think the kid had it right.
Had the OP been there with a tarantula and I walked in I would not have been thrilled and may have left, pet shop or not. I wouldn't have been rude or caused a scene but I don't like big spiders and certainly don't want to see them out. Even though I know they won't chase me and kill me I like them to be behind glass. Irrational as it is it is not something I could just ignore and continue on with my shopping.
Sorry for prattling on... :)

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Excellent example! I do believe people can be educated, and I also agree that if you are going to take your snake anywhere, then a pet store would be best place since they should be welcome there.

However, I insist that it is potentially dangerous for the snake to be exposed to possible diseases. Dogs, cats, ferrets receive vaccines, reptiles do not. & the possibility of one of my snakes catching IBD is enough for me to not expose them to the outside world (they don't need it). But this is my personal opinion & preference.

I do not inform my neighbors of my snakes because I live in an apartment, of which the lease does not specify whether or not I can own snakes. I am allowed pets (my dogs are all on the lease), and was told that if pets were in tanks, etc. that they didn't care if I had them (but I have a hunch they were referring to fish & hamsters). So this is more of an 'I don't want to get thrown out' issue. However, I work in a very conservative law firm, yet all of my co-workers are aware that I own snakes.

& the bottom line is: when you own any exotic animal, you will receive dirty looks, comments, etc. Is it right? I don't think so. But, again, ignorance is the culprit. & , it sounds like the OP is not trying to force the snakes upon anyone, and can maybe educate a few people here & there about these awesome creatures. So, as long as he's careful about not exposing his snake to detrimental temps, stressful situations, and/or contagious diseases, then I don't see anything wrong with it.


PS If we were talking about a full grown alligator, cobra, Komodo dragon, etc., I would feel differently.

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Originally Posted by Jenn

We will never change the opinions and fears that people have about snakes. We won't "educate" them, or "change their minds"

I think the safest thing we can do as snake keepers is to "keep" them to ourselves. My neighbors don't even know I keep snakes. Someone once asked me where all the used bedding in my mulch pile was coming from and I told them I was babysitting a friends hampster. The less your community know about your addiction the better off we will all be. Whenever I see someone out in public with a snake I am reminded that snakes have no ego.

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I'd say telling that person that you were taking care of a hamster is a bit extreme, what exactly could the person do if s/he found out you were keeping a snake? Sneak into your house and kill it? It's your desition but by making people think less people have snakes makes them think that snakes are more dangerous...

man is it bad that when i read your incident that when the old guy came up and said that i had a vision of me uppercutting him in the face to many video games i guess. =D Its not right what they did and you handled it very well.