Just got a baby BP who wont eat, I think its normal, but need conformation

just read this whole thread, and i think this sums it up very well...

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Originally Posted by GA_Ball_Pythons

:eek: All I can come up with right now is :disbelief :tricho: http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p...icons/Wall.gif.

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Originally Posted by whyteboi

Look, the guy on 8 ball doesnt even change his strategy until week 2 or 3 AFTER the shed. He doesnt force feed until week 7. Im pretty sure he knows what hes doing, seeing as he goes through more babies a year then most BP owners will go through in their life.

I always see snakes going off feed for 5 months, and people saying "your more stressed then the snake"

The snake deficated, meaning theres some nutrition inside of him, so theres really no reason for me to be worried. Every site I have read says not to be worried until after 2 or so months. I realize I have a baby, BUT I HAVE A PLAN TO FIX THIS.

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well, for starters, your snake is a newborn, it doesn't have enough weight on it to last 2 months. 2nd, Adam, the "guy" at 8ball, also has snakes in the proper "tubs" when they are hatched.

Point blank: the snake needs to acclimate fully to its cage before being offered food, handled, or otherwise interacted with. A tub would do you well, because it is opaque (most are, anyway) and the snake will feel more secure.. two identical, cozy hide spots.. belly heat on a good thermostat (rheostat dimmers can definately be used; i actually use them with success.) Water dish smack dab in the middle, a secure clamped lid.. simple, free newspaper substrate.. it is not hard. Once everything is set and the snake is acclimated, just ignore it for a week or so and let the poor guy settle in! I only change water and clean if the cage is soiled during this period, and if it is badly emssy with poo, I add a few mors days to the acclimation.
It is not hard.. personally, I have never dealt with any hatchling that had never eaten.. seems like a gamble.

Look, its honestly no use talking to some of you, saying I would fix this problem this friday. Half of you are suggesting the same thing, that I said I would get 5 posts earlier. I guess its an unheard of thing to have a payday, or something called "a busy week", or a "empty gas tank". I dont have money laying around ATM. Im fixing this, the damn snake is fine, i havent been starving it for 6 months as 1/2 of you make it out to be.

Again, the problem is being fixed, Ill prolly have questions that I actualy want to be answered as friday approaches, but Ill make a new thread for obvious reasons.

Thanks to freakie_frog for being understanding and dr. del, and Ginevive and other people I cant remember atm for being nice about it though.

I definately never attacked you or put ya down.. I only offered true advice. I understand fully about the payday thing, and what's done is done.. I only wish you luck in what will probably be a trying time..

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Originally Posted by Ginevive

I definately never attacked you or put ya down.. I only offered true advice. I understand fully about the payday thing, and what's done is done.. I only wish you luck in what will probably be a trying time..

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yup one of a few

thanks though for being understanding

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Originally Posted by whyteboi

Look, the guy on 8 ball doesnt even change his strategy until week 2 or 3 AFTER the shed. He doesnt force feed until week 7. Im pretty sure he knows what hes doing, seeing as he goes through more babies a year then most BP owners will go through in their life.

I always see snakes going off feed for 5 months, and people saying "your more stressed then the snake"

The snake deficated, meaning theres some nutrition inside of him, so theres really no reason for me to be worried. Every site I have read says not to be worried until after 2 or so months. I realize I have a baby, BUT I HAVE A PLAN TO FIX THIS.

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Hi whyteboi,

You are correct in that Adam does indeed see more snakes in a week than most of us ever will - but that also makes him an expert judge of a snakes condition and when to vary from the script.

If it was white then the snake didn't defecate it urinated (possibly - nothing is for certain).

You are also perfectly correct in pointing to the threads in which we tell people not to worry - but that is nearly always a larger snake with sufficient body mass to be able to fast with little trouble, something hatchlings cannot do anywhere nearly as easily.

What might help get this into a more productive track would be a picture of your lil guy showing his general build and size?

While I am here I would like to share my experiences of starting (Captive Born and Bred) ball python hatchlings on f/t.

It took me 5 months to get the last one to eat happily and consistently on its own. Without intervention by people who knew what they were doing it would never have survived that long without eating - this is why people seem to be ganging up on you slightly.

They can be extremely difficult to start on occassion and its is no easy task to judge their bodily condition to decide when they are becoming so weak that they literaly might die.

Without a garaunteed true hatch date (the only gauranteed meal your snake has had is the yolk - sorry to say shops lie about this kind of thing) and no recognisable poop as opposed to possibly just urates there is no gaurantee your snake has ever eaten anything voluntarily at all.

And for hatchlings it's all about condition - Adam knows the health of every snake he owns and , since you can see it, you might too.

We haven't seen it so don't know if it's a skinny hatchling that's sat there for months or a nice fat hatchling a week out the egg. Thus we err on the side of caution.

If you can post a pic we will be able to judge for ourselves if it's time to panic or if it's ok to be more relaxed about it.

I hope this comes across as helpful - that is certainly the way I intend it to.


dr del

I honestly due understand being tight on money, i do. but i still make sure i have the means to take care of the pets i have. And as others here do I too wish you and your damn(your word not mine) snake the best of luck..

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Originally Posted by whyteboi

I dont have money laying around ATM. Im fixing this, the damn snake is fine,

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Yea I will try to get pics by tomorrow, ill have to borrow my sisters camera.

More to add to why i think there should be an age limit on hopeful animal parents.



Just my two cents.

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Originally Posted by Lucifer

More to add to why i think there should be an age limit on hopeful animal parents.



Just my two cents.

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Can we please not turn this into a debate about age/maturity and the right to own a pet and stay focused on helping a fellow snake owner out with an issue many of us have encountered.

Plus that simple comment will bring all the teenagers out arguing their point they take better care of their pets then most adults and it will just become a mess. So lets stick to the topic and keep personal opinions out of it please.

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Originally Posted by sw204me

Can we please not turn this into a debate about age/maturity and the right to own a pet and stay focused on helping a fellow snake owner out with an issue many of us have encountered.

Plus that simple comment will bring all the teenagers out arguing their point they take better care of their pets then most adults and it will just become a mess. So lets stick to the topic and keep personal opinions out of it please.

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Freedom of speech. If my post was out of line, any of the mods can feel free to delete it. But a big part of a message board is being able to post what you want while staying in the rules.

I'll be right back, i'm going to look for the part that says "Dont post your personal opinions."

I think my opinion, if taken into action in this case, would have caused this thread to have never been created. Maturity and age has alot to do with animal care.

Take it how you want, but i wasnt out of order and i made a valid point. Good day. ;)

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Originally Posted by Lucifer

Freedom of speech. If my post was out of line, any of the mods can feel free to delete it. But a big part of a message board is being able to post what you want while staying in the rules.

I'll be right back, i'm going to look for the part that says "Dont post your personal opinions."

I think my opinion, if taken into action in this case, would have caused this thread to have never been created. Maturity and age has alot to do with animal care.

Take it how you want, but i wasnt out of order and i made a valid point. Good day. ;)

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I think everyone says what they want for the most part, but it seems like you were kind of trying to intice a response from someone who is younger. I think the maturity someone needs to properly care for an animal is a mental process, not purely a physical age.

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Originally Posted by darkangel

I think everyone says what they want for the most part, but it seems like you were kind of trying to intice a response from someone who is younger. I think the maturity someone needs to properly care for an animal is a mental process, not purely a physical age.

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No, i wasnt "inticing" a response...what gives you the idea i come and maliciously post to get a respone? I stated an opinion, and made a very valid point. No further explanation required.

Whatever man... Just saying I've known plenty of younger people, myself included at that age, that are perfectly capable of taking care of an animal.

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Originally Posted by darkangel

Whatever man... Just saying I've known plenty of younger people, myself included at that age, that are perfectly capable of taking care of an animal.

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Well i'm very happy for you, but now, im afraid this thread is doing exactly what i was hoping it wouldnt do. Getting off topic. Now if everybody else can just skim over my comment without trying to find a hidden meaning in it, please do so. Otherwise, i'm through talking about this. I stated my opinion like i said numerous times and now i'm through talking about it.

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Originally Posted by whyteboi

Anyway live isnt an option for me anyway, and Id rather not have to justify it. You guys will try to poke holes through it

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Why isn't live an option? This is a hatchling ball python that hasn't had its first meal, and it most likely will not eat f/t or pre-killed. In fact, it's almost unheard of for a hatchling to eat anything but live for their first meal.

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Originally Posted by whyteboi

Look, the guy on 8 ball doesnt even change his strategy until week 2 or 3 AFTER the shed. He doesnt force feed until week 7. Im pretty sure he knows what hes doing, seeing as he goes through more babies a year then most BP owners will go through in their life.

I always see snakes going off feed for 5 months, and people saying "your more stressed then the snake"

The snake deficated, meaning theres some nutrition inside of him, so theres really no reason for me to be worried. Every site I have read says not to be worried until after 2 or so months. I realize I have a baby, BUT I HAVE A PLAN TO FIX THIS.

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The guy is Adam, and he keeps all his hatchlings in small tubs and offers LIVE. None of which you seem willing to do.

And five month fasts are for snakes who have had some meals and weight on them. Your hatchling has never had a meal.

I will make one suggestion to you - you seem to hold Adam in high regard, as do many of us. If you were to give him a call, he'd be more than happy to talk you about the most successful way to get your snake eating. His number is on his website.

Sorry about bagging on your name Whyteboi but I have been picking up some serious attitude from you throughout this entire thread.

You said you are getting the stuff Friday, thats great. Hopefully everything will work out for you. You're brave starting out on a hatchling which should prove to be quite the learning experience for your future BP keeping. If you listen to what everyone here has to say you will be fine. Out of every type pf pet I have owned BP's are by far the easiest, cheapest and most rewarding. Even more so when you start to see your snake thrive in the environment that you provided it with.

Again, good luck.

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Originally Posted by darkangel

Whatever man... Just saying I've known plenty of younger people, myself included at that age, that are perfectly capable of taking care of an animal.

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PSSST your older than they are by a couple of years.. :D

Just my two cents

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Originally Posted by Freakie_frog

PSSST your older than they are by a couple of years.. :D

Just my two cents

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;) :gj:

I must first say I have no idea what this thread is about, and that I did not read through the whole thread.

With that said....

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Originally Posted by Lucifer

I'll be right back, i'm going to look for the part that says "Dont post your personal opinions."

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BAM!

just sayin'.... :cool:

FWIW, I have an '07 ch baby in a 6qt tub, with one hide and a water bowl and constant heat(94/84). She's eaten 3 times and just had her first shed last week.

But ya know, I guess she's being abused and is stressed beyond all reality in that tiny tub... But what would I know.

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Originally Posted by daaangconcepts

BAM!

just sayin'.... :cool:

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excellent post!

just sayin' :cool:

Against my better judgement Im getting all the stuff now.

Im leaving in 30 minutes to walmart, against my better judgement for later, so i need that 12$ thermometer/hydrometer or whatever they sell.

Im confused on how thermostats work with A uth. Does the cord of the uth go into the thermostat somewhere, so the thermostat shuts on or off the UTH when its too hot or cold? but I heard I can buy one for 5$. Now I dont know if the thermometer tells the thermostat what temp it is, or is the thermostat is also a thermometer that goes in the cage. I need to get this right before I buy it with what very little $ I have atm

Im then gonna buy 2 bowls that look like they will fit him good. I got newspaper, and a UTH, so thats all I need ATM, right? Hopefully they sell individual 6qt tuberware.

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Originally Posted by whyteboi

Against my better judgement Im getting all the stuff now.

Im leaving in 30 minutes to walmart, against my better judgement for later, so i need that 12$ thermometer/hydrometer or whatever they sell.

Im confused on how thermostats work with A uth. Does the cord of the uth go into the thermostat somewhere, so the thermostat shuts on or off the UTH when its too hot or cold? but I heard I can buy one for 5$. Now I dont know if the thermometer tells the thermostat what temp it is, or is the thermostat is also a thermometer that goes in the cage. I need to get this right before I buy it with what very little $ I have atm

Im then gonna buy 2 bowls that look like they will fit him good. I got newspaper, and a UTH, so thats all I need ATM, right? Hopefully they sell individual 6qt tuberware.

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The thermostat plugs into the wall and the UTH plugs in to the stat. There will be a temp probe on the stat that will adjust the amount of power that is supplied to the UTH in order to maintain the set temp.Their not quite 5.00 but you could get a reostat for not much more than that and they work also.

So whats the difference between a reostat and thermostat? How much would a thermostat cost that I am looking for?

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Originally Posted by whyteboi

Against my better judgement Im getting all the stuff now.

Im leaving in 30 minutes to walmart, against my better judgement for later, so i need that 12$ thermometer/hydrometer or whatever they sell.

Im confused on how thermostats work with A uth. Does the cord of the uth go into the thermostat somewhere, so the thermostat shuts on or off the UTH when its too hot or cold? but I heard I can buy one for 5$. Now I dont know if the thermometer tells the thermostat what temp it is, or is the thermostat is also a thermometer that goes in the cage. I need to get this right before I buy it with what very little $ I have atm

Im then gonna buy 2 bowls that look like they will fit him good. I got newspaper, and a UTH, so thats all I need ATM, right? Hopefully they sell individual 6qt tuberware.

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For your budget atm you will probably be getting a rheostat, which does not have an on/off feature to control the temperature, but rather a low to high dimmer knob. It's up to you to check the temperatures on your thermometer and adjust the dial accordingly. Thermostats do that automatically but they cost more than you're willing to spend.

If I can get one for 20-30$ ill get it, but does walmart sell it for that price or even at all?

I think we're talking closer to 100 bucks... Not sure.

http://www.ball-pythons.net/forums/s...ad.php?t=32800

I saw here he said 30$... but I dunno if walmart sells these

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Originally Posted by whyteboi

So whats the difference between a reostat and thermostat? How much would a thermostat cost that I am looking for?

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A rheostat is essentially a dimmer switch, you can pick them up at lowes, wal-mart, etc. They are manual devices that require regular adjustment depending on ambient temperature, etc. We use these on free-standing tubs as needed, usually only as a stopgap before moving our new acquisitions into their permanant rack-based homes.

A thermostat is exactly like the one on your A/C system at home. It measures temperature, in most cases with a probe that you put somewhere in or under the enclosure, and turns the power to the heating elements on and off as needed. As such, you only adjust the pre-determined setting, and it does the rest.

As expected, thermostats cost more, but are worth their weight in gold if you have multiple enclosures using the same type of heating element (ie, a rack with 10 1' sections of heat-tape). If you are mixing brands of heating pads, or using different sizes of tape, you will want to use multiple thermostats/rheostats due to differences in heat output between different elements.

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Originally Posted by whyteboi

http://www.ball-pythons.net/forums/s...ad.php?t=32800

I saw here he said 30$... but I dunno if walmart sells these

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Mine didn't, I checked all over, not all wal-mart's have it, if yours does your lucky, get thermometer and cheap, I had to get one from my pet store, was $35'ish i think but the gauge doesnt go in the tank, a major plus in my book. You might have to search around, but if yours has it then I'd grab it, unless your looking for one to go outside the tank like I was, in that case, heres a really nice one for ya:

http://www.zilla-rules.com/products/...hermometer.htm

I have two of these and love em.

Ok I bought two different hides. Both of them are too easily moved around. Im getting frustrated cause I cant tape them without one side coming off. help? They are both light, cause I couldnt find something easy to get into and small and heavy.

Anyway I got everything but thermostat. Ill buy it online or something.

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Originally Posted by whyteboi

Ok I bought two different hides. Both of them are too easily moved around. Im getting frustrated cause I cant tape them without one side coming off. help? They are both light, cause I couldnt find something easy to get into and small and heavy.

Anyway I got everything but thermostat. Ill buy it online or something.

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I had that very same problem, had to get a tree type thing to help hold the hides down cause she kept picking them up and moving them. Only real suggestion is to find hides that are heavy and small or find something small you can put ontop of it. it can be tough, but im sure you can find something to set on the hides. her moving them around her tank def got on my nerves though, so I can completely relate to ya.

your def heading in the right direction, keep up the good work.

EEEP:eek:


No tape in the tank please!!

The fact he can move them isn't really that much of a big deal - they can move everything eventually.

As long as they are nice and snug and (hopefully) both the same just keep moving them back to either end when your in. :)

If you find he is moving them too much for you then you can use other things to hold them in place - like branches or rocks (remember to clean them thoroughly first).

Yup you can make great savings buying these things online - it just means having to wait for delivery times etc.

Main thing is getting an accurate reading of all the temps etc so you know where you stand at the moment to avoid wasting money buying stuff you don't actully need ( we won't do that to ya but a lot of pet shops will ).



dr del

Yes they did indeed... anyway, the temps are lower then I had hoped for, but Im getting them up ATM, and I think hell do alot better, my readings are like 76/83 atm and rising with 58% humidity.

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Originally Posted by whyteboi

If I can get one for 20-30$ ill get it, but does walmart sell it for that price or even at all?

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I, personally, use this rheostat. I found it at Petsmart for 20 bucks. You kinda get what you pay for, but as long as you check your thermometer to make sure it stays in the right temp range, it's fine. I haven't had any problems with mine.

EDIT: Oh, and as Dr Del said, tape is a no-no. There's been some really horrible events with snakes and tape before(think eye removal :( )

Well I found urine and urate in my cage again, so Im guessing thats a good sign?

He seems happier

Hi again,:)


Yup it means he is drinking at least. Do you have the opportunity to ask the people you got him from what they had tried on the eating front or do you not feel they would be all that reliable a source of the information?


dr del

Not reliable at all. The workers like as I was purchasing said he never ate. I called 5 days later to ask if they knew the birth date and the manager said that his ball pythons have eaten twice.

Not even worth it, although they did try a fuzzy i know

Yeah that's about what I expected **sigh**. :(


The good ones tend not to sell the animals at all until they are satisfied they are eating and growing fine.

Hang in there - once you get the tank and temps etc sorted you should hopefully have a lot easier time of it getting the little guy started.


dr del

Whyteboi, no worries, I just bought my first ball on sunday from a very reputable breeder (B.A.R.C. Reptiles) and it has eaten two crawlers(decent sized fussy mouse that is moving around) but not yet eaten for me. I have a 20 gal waiting for her and have a tub for her witting on the bottom of my rack where it is dark with a towel draped over to block as much light as possible. Just be patient. I know it is frustrating. if you think a BP is too much for you, and i hope you dont, then look into collubrids such as corn snakes as they are a much easier snake to keep.

Best Of luck!

Thought BP's was as easy as it gets?

i think corns are alittle easier... just depends on what you want

hey feel free to PM me Whyteboi. I have some ideas that are really simple... I have been in your boat. trust me i know your frustation. :D
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