How do I make a piebald?

If you have two actual piebalds not hets not possible hets 2 visable piebald morphs you will get all pieds. The best cheapest way to get a piebald is by doing what im doing and getting a pair of 100% hets and breeding them and if you go through someone trust worthy most will have a garuntee that you will get at least one pied, if you don't they will breed your female or male to one of their pieds and there youll still have one, eventually. But there is no cheap moprhs they are all over a few hundred. The cheapest currently are pastels but if you wait a few years i belive they will be under a hundred dollars each becuase everyone and their mom is breeding them. If you want something cool and less expensive get a few normal females raise them up for two years. In that time put away $15 every month for two years you will have $360 which will be way more than enough money for a spider. Raise the male and all the females for one to two more year/s. Then by the time the spider is breeding age since they can be much younger than your females, your females will most likely be ready to breed as well and you did it effectivly and reasonbly "cheap".

Good luck i hope this helped!

there is no guarentee with hets. its all odds. only guarentee when its to homozygous

Hi,

Also thought I should point out that yellowbellies are the het form of ivory ( if it's a proven line ) so unless yours look like yellowbellies they are probably normals.

Doesn't make them a bad investment as normal females are usefull in a lot of breeding scenarios as well.


dr del

There is no cheap fast-track to getting a visiable recessive morph. If there was, everyone would own one themselves(except those that don't want them).
A het male to normal females will get you SOME het babies, but you won't be able to tell which ones have the gene, so you have to raise them and breed those to see who gives you any visiable morphs.
Remember: A female will not grow enough in a year to breed her, maybe not even in TWO years, so keep the time spent on a project in mind.
The CHEAPEST way to get a morph is to buy a het male, and normal female. You grow the female up to 1200grams(2-3 years old) and then breed her to the male. Whatever babies hatch out(possibly het pieds), you grow the females up(2-3 years) then breed those to dad(or to a different het pied male). Some of the females MIGHT throw pieds, but they might all give you more possibly het pieds. You also might have to breed those possibly het pied females multiple times to be sure that you have normals, rather than het pieds. This way takes years before you have a pied.
The FASTEST way is to buy a pied. Instant gratification, no breeding.
In between ways are buying 100% het pieds, or breeding with a visiable pied. Those cost more, but cut time off the breeding project so you get a visiable pied faster.
Hope this helps explain it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by wolfy-hound

There is no cheap fast-track to getting a visiable recessive morph. If there was, everyone would own one themselves(except those that don't want them).
A het male to normal females will get you SOME het babies, but you won't be able to tell which ones have the gene, so you have to raise them and breed those to see who gives you any visiable morphs.
Remember: A female will not grow enough in a year to breed her, maybe not even in TWO years, so keep the time spent on a project in mind.
The CHEAPEST way to get a morph is to buy a het male, and normal female. You grow the female up to 1200grams(2-3 years old) and then breed her to the male. Whatever babies hatch out(possibly het pieds), you grow the females up(2-3 years) then breed those to dad(or to a different het pied male). Some of the females MIGHT throw pieds, but they might all give you more possibly het pieds. You also might have to breed those possibly het pied females multiple times to be sure that you have normals, rather than het pieds. This way takes years before you have a pied.
The FASTEST way is to buy a pied. Instant gratification, no breeding.
In between ways are buying 100% het pieds, or breeding with a visiable pied. Those cost more, but cut time off the breeding project so you get a visiable pied faster.
Hope this helps explain it.

---

perfect

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by wolfy-hound

There is no cheap fast-track to getting a visiable recessive morph. If there was, everyone would own one themselves(except those that don't want them).
A het male to normal females will get you SOME het babies, but you won't be able to tell which ones have the gene, so you have to raise them and breed those to see who gives you any visiable morphs.
Remember: A female will not grow enough in a year to breed her, maybe not even in TWO years, so keep the time spent on a project in mind.
The CHEAPEST way to get a morph is to buy a het male, and normal female. You grow the female up to 1200grams(2-3 years old) and then breed her to the male. Whatever babies hatch out(possibly het pieds), you grow the females up(2-3 years) then breed those to dad(or to a different het pied male). Some of the females MIGHT throw pieds, but they might all give you more possibly het pieds. You also might have to breed those possibly het pied females multiple times to be sure that you have normals, rather than het pieds. This way takes years before you have a pied.
The FASTEST way is to buy a pied. Instant gratification, no breeding.
In between ways are buying 100% het pieds, or breeding with a visiable pied. Those cost more, but cut time off the breeding project so you get a visiable pied faster.
Hope this helps explain it.

---

word:gj:

piebald is a reccessive trait. so if you were to breed two reccessives you would get all reccessive, rite. i know this works wit albinos. rr+rr=rr.

http://www.newenglandreptile.com/gen...recessive.html

Heh, found this link just looking for an image of the Punnet Square. Anything I had to say is pretty much there.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by wolfy-hound

There is no cheap fast-track to getting a visiable recessive morph. If there was, everyone would own one themselves(except those that don't want them).
A het male to normal females will get you SOME het babies, but you won't be able to tell which ones have the gene, so you have to raise them and breed those to see who gives you any visiable morphs.
Remember: A female will not grow enough in a year to breed her, maybe not even in TWO years, so keep the time spent on a project in mind.
The CHEAPEST way to get a morph is to buy a het male, and normal female. You grow the female up to 1200grams(2-3 years old) and then breed her to the male. Whatever babies hatch out(possibly het pieds), you grow the females up(2-3 years) then breed those to dad(or to a different het pied male). Some of the females MIGHT throw pieds, but they might all give you more possibly het pieds. You also might have to breed those possibly het pied females multiple times to be sure that you have normals, rather than het pieds. This way takes years before you have a pied.
The FASTEST way is to buy a pied. Instant gratification, no breeding.
In between ways are buying 100% het pieds, or breeding with a visiable pied. Those cost more, but cut time off the breeding project so you get a visiable pied faster.
Hope this helps explain it.

---

So. . .you dont get like "Deformed" snakes if you inbreed? Can you breed brother/sister that way too?

I think inbreeding is the same for all animals. My understanding its simply a matter of the fact that it tends to concentrate undesirable recessive traits.

So, let's say there is a mutation that is dominant. It will always show in a carrier and, unless it is fairly benign, will very likely prevent its successful breeding. On the other hand, recessive mutations are only seen by homozygous carriers. Since that is going to be far less likely in the wild, recessive mutations do not tend to be culled. For the most part they are silently passed around the gene pool. However, once you start in-breeding, the chances of two recessive genes matching up and becoming active are much better.

Consider that these desirable morphs are in fact what you might call "deformities" and many are quite undesirable to the wild BP. Likewise, most people carry recessive mutations that just don't tend to show up - until they start in-breeding. Its the same thing with dogs. "Pure-bred" is a term that refers to a process of breeding that isolates a particular set of genes. During that process, undesirable genes are isolated along with those that the breeder is interested it. That is why certain breeds of dogs tend to have genetic health problems like blindness, etc.

So, with snakes, I would guess that the risks from in-breeding are similar and that it would always be preferable to isolate recessive traits by breeding between lines rather than within one. But, what I don't know, is how many genetics defects snakes really tend to have beyond the color morphs. Perhaps their makeup is pretty simple and they are fairly resilient to in-breeding.