Questionable 100% Het. ?

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Originally Posted by JoshJP7

But you can only make up so much ya know... what do you think they would do to make up for it>? If you missed out on 2yrs of breeding thats alot of potential money gone... with pieds being the price they are i highly doubt any breeders going to toss you 5grand for their mistake.... Sure they can give you a pied baby or something along those lines but to me its not nearly enough to make up for it... Especially if the female wasnt the het pied... If they gave you a female baby youd have to wait 2 more yrs until theyre ready and theres 4yrs wasted... I see where your coming with shopping around for breeders as well as the snake but to me its just too risky to get involved... I'll leave that to all the other breeders :) If I want a pied, albino, or whatever I'd just cough up the money buy one straight up and get a het to breed it with... That way you know for sure if the het is actually a het rather than playing the guessing game for a couple years trying to figure out "is it this one? or is it that one"

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While I understand your point...consider the chance of this "mistake" actually happening. How long would it take for a reputable breeder to go out of business if even the hint that his Hets were not proving out? Since this is a hobby where reputation is pry more important that what you have to offer who could afford to risk it? There was a well known case where the Hets weren't Hets but as soon as it popped up the guys business was gone and he has/had more lawsuits set on him then he could possibly imagine (so everyone is paranoid about it). If you buy your snakes out the back of a caddy on 8mile expect to get taken...but if you buy from an established breeder (even smaller breeders) you can rest easy that everything is going to be OK. Will mistakes happen? Sure. But not that often cause if they did we would all hear about them. :)

Just my 2 cents

I'm by no means saying this happens a lot... or even happens at all... I'm just speaking my personal view of why I'm skittish in getting involved with hets... I wouldnt expect anyone to sell a non het as a het on purpose but mistakes can happen... I agree 100% with you guys if your buying from a Big Dog your like 99.8% in the clear... I guess what it comes down to is sometimes people try to replace the quality of animal/breeder with price and they obv lose and wonder why they got ripped off

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Originally Posted by JoshJP7

If you missed out on 2yrs of breeding thats alot of potential money gone... with pieds being the price they are i highly doubt any breeders going to toss you 5grand for their mistake.... Sure they can give you a pied baby or something along those lines but to me its not nearly enough to make up for it... Especially if the female wasnt the het pied... If they gave you a female baby youd have to wait 2 more yrs until theyre ready and theres 4yrs wasted...

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I have no doubt that if one of my hets from Adam didn't prove out, and he went back and realized that he had a "mix-up" that he would send me an equivalent animal of the same age, or refund my purchase price. Either way, I know without a doubt that he would make it right. Because I trust my breeder.

Rab I see where your coming from but to me thats not good enough... Youve wasted time trying to prove out the het only to find out its not a het and youve lost money in potential baby sales... If you would be satisfied with a replacement snake or your money back then thats good for you but to me theres much more lost than just the wrong snake... I dont want to argue with you on this topic as that was not my intentions by any means I was just expressing that much more is lost in the long run that just the wrong snake

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Originally Posted by JoshJP7

Rab I see where your coming from but to me thats not good enough... Youve wasted time trying to prove out the het only to find out its not a het and youve lost money in potential baby sales... If you would be satisfied with a replacement snake or your money back then thats good for you but to me theres much more lost than just the wrong snake... I dont want to argue with you on this topic as that was not my intentions by any means I was just expressing that much more is lost in the long run that just the wrong snake

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You still want to breed in the future right? So what if people feel the same way about you as a breeder and do not give you a chance because of the "WHAT IF" ?
If every body was thinking like that no one would ever buy hets from anyone again.

Again it's all about finding reputable breeders whether they are big dogs like you call them or small hobbyists, it does not matter. There are many people on this forum from whom I would buy hets without any problem.

There are many good people in this hobby and good people can be trusted, good people will also make it right if there is an honest mistake.

Thanks for all the replies everyone. She should be ready to breed next year so hopefully I will be able to prove her out then.

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Originally Posted by JoshJP7

Rab I see where your coming from but to me thats not good enough... Youve wasted time trying to prove out the het only to find out its not a het and youve lost money in potential baby sales... If you would be satisfied with a replacement snake or your money back then thats good for you but to me theres much more lost than just the wrong snake... I dont want to argue with you on this topic as that was not my intentions by any means I was just expressing that much more is lost in the long run that just the wrong snake

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Anything worth doing in life is going to have risks. Including the chance that a het animal purchased turns out to not be het at all. But if you take the right steps, you can greatly minimize the amount of risk involved, as well as have an assurance of being "made whole" again if something turns out wrong.

If you're too afraid to take even that minimized and warranteed risk....well, I guess you can always save your pennies to buy visual recessive morphs right off the bat. (And then hope that none of them die either by illness or accident...or are stolen...or simply fail to breed for any number of reasons.) ;)

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Originally Posted by Kagez28

it's all about the risk vs reward, breeder with great rep vs no name found on internet.

and also you make it sound like good breeders mix things up and sell non hets all the time. i would like to hear one person that has ever bought any het from any of the big boys (and girls) and it turned out to be just a normal. if there even is some one out there that this happened to.

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Actually, I know a breeder who bought a het that didn't prove out from one of the "big dogs". I have no intentions of sharing either party's names, as I wasn't involved, and I do know that the seller settled the situation with my friend in a manner satisfactory to the buyer. I don't know the details of the settlement, but he told me that it had been settled to his satisfaction.

That said, I agree 100% that it would be very, very difficult to receive adequate compensation for the time, lost visible morphs and 100% hets, and obviously monetary proceeds! You buy a $750 het. By the time she is old enough to breed, they're selling for $500. A couple more years of missed "odds", and they're selling for even less. Say 3 clutches of eggs, all of which really can't even be sold as 50% probable, because the female hasn't proved out. Its a tough deal. That's why I mentioned the breeding loan situation. And depending on the circumstances, that might not even be adequate compensation.

Steve

In my most humble opinion, if a trustworthy breeder keeps such poor records that he or she can accidentally send you something other than what you ordered, than that breeder is not a 'trustworthy' breeder.

Rick

I would like to chime in to this thread just to possibly open the eyes of some people who may not have thought of it this way before.

I do know of someone who bought a Het from one of the "biggest boys" and it did not prove out. I like Steve, will not mention any names, because I was not involved in the deal, but suffice it to say that the deal was smotthed over.

Now for the point I would like to make. I have seen a few people that believe that buying from a "big boy" is the only way to be safe, and some have stated this on this thread. I am not knocking the "big boys" here, as I have bought numerous animals from them, but some people need to rememeber that these guys are producing thousands of animals. Do you thin it is possible to misplace a couple on accident once in awhile. NO. It is probably not likely, but way more probable than me or some other smaller breeder that is producing in the low hundreds of hatchlings.

Here is what I do to try and make my cutomers feel all warm and fuzzy inside. I seperate my hatchlings after they have shed the first time and put them into their own tub. The same day they go into their own tub, they also get an ID number that is written on their tub, and a photo is taken of that snake. The snakes photo and ID number is then entered into our computer and stored with the rest of our collections records.

Hope that helps anybody when thinking about Hets.