my first post w/pics.. DUW

The "cuddling" you're seeing Ashley isn't cuddling as perceived by our human standards, it's a way snake's dominate each other for available space, heat sources, access to food, water and cover to hide in. Ball pythons are by their very nature solitary creatures coming together usually only to mate when mature once per year.

Some of the issues of communal housing are...

- you cannot properly track which snake is defeciating, passing urates, etc. so if you get a runny stool you won't know who passed it or even if someone isn't passing stool when it's likely they should be

- disease transmission including the spreading of parasites - since both snakes are in close contact with each other feces and so forth, anything one snake has the other will get, this results in two sick snakes, twice the worry and twice the vet bills

- there have been documented incidences of cannabalism in ball pythons

- accidental breeding or breeding of your female at far too young an age - the male will mature quickly, she will not - bearing eggs too young can stress her up to and including causing her early death due to stress or the inability to pass her eggs

- feeding accidents/bites to the cage mate - feeding snakes can be highly reactive even after they are fed (they stay in hunt mode for quite awhile), this can result in an attack on the other snake in the enclosure, due to this hyper hunting state or the smell of prey being on one snake

- no experienced breeder I know recommends the long term communal housing of ball pythons, they might be kept like that for a short time after they hatch while they are awaiting their first feed and shed but most breeders seperate them thereafter

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Originally Posted by AshleyB

thanks for your pov :) what i dont understand is the breeder made a nice amount on us (new set-up, snakes xs2, exc) he knew money wasnt an issue (he couldve made even more if he suggested us keep them apart) why wouldnt he have suggested us keeping them apart when i specifically asked if they could be housed together (his exact words "they will be fine together, the set up they are in now will last them about two years") they even house their older balls together there (i saw those for myself).

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Someone keeping their BP together and having offsprings is not comparable to what I call a breeder.

A reputable breeder would never recommend such a bad husbandry practice.

He likely saw the opportunity to sell 2 animals instead of one since if in many cases if you tell people to house them individually they will think twice and only buy one.

this wasnt a backyard breeder hes been at the location i went to since 95' hes had snakes ALOT longer than that, we had lightly discussed breeding later on (not that its going to be for a profit or anything else like that since they arent anything special).. the snakes we got were not from the same clutch either. im going to call there tomorrow and have a few words about what ive read.. :mad:

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Snake are like potato chips, you can't stop with just one... At least I couldn't. Once you do get another snake you need to quarantine× it from your other snake(s) for a couple of months. The new snake may be diseased or parasitized and you wouldn't want it to infect your healthy animals. Once you quarantine, it's OK to put snakes in the same cage assuming: they are of the same species (Ball Python, Python regius), they are similar sized, and the cage provides ample room and hide boxes. I strongly caution against putting other types of snake together in the same cage. Other species snakes may have care requirements and different types of disease/infection that your Ball Python's immune system cannot handle. You will want to separate them at feeding time. And you may notice that they will not eat unless housed individually.

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i had read that in mor ethan one place too!

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Originally Posted by AshleyB

Snake are like potato chips, you can't stop with just one... At least I couldn't. Once you do get another snake you need to quarantine× it from your other snake(s) for a couple of months. The new snake may be diseased or parasitized and you wouldn't want it to infect your healthy animals. Once you quarantine, it's OK to put snakes in the same cage assuming: they are of the same species (Ball Python, Python regius), they are similar sized, and the cage provides ample room and hide boxes. I strongly caution against putting other types of snake together in the same cage. Other species snakes may have care requirements and different types of disease/infection that your Ball Python's immune system cannot handle. You will want to separate them at feeding time. And you may notice that they will not eat unless housed individually.

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Everything that person wrote advocating housing together was negated by their very last sentence.

If that thread doesn't convince you, I'm not sure that you can be convinced.

Posted by Kara of NERD - one of the largest, most respected ball python breeders in the country:


http://www.ball-pythons.net/forums/s...5&postcount=16

Kevin is the other half of NERD and wrote:
The Complete Ball Python

Posted by Adam of 8BallPythons - over 25 years of keeping ball pythons, also a very well respected breeder:

http://www.ball-pythons.net/forums/s...57&postcount=8

http://www.ball-pythons.net/forums/s...4&postcount=11

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Originally Posted by AshleyB

hes under the uvb light and shes in a hide box under heat lamp

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Also, I'm not sure if anyone caught this, but snakes don't need a UVB lamp either. They have no use for it... they're primarily nocturnal animals, so what little sunlight they get through a cage has all the UVB they need.

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Originally Posted by AshleyB

as a side note, they are NOT fed together.. they are NOT ever even fed in their enclosure.

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Just wanted to note this one little thing too... I think maybe the breeder told you they'll mistake your hand for food if you feed in the tank, but it's not true. They don't have to be fed in a separate enclosure.

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Originally Posted by darkangel

Just wanted to note this one little thing too... I think maybe the breeder told you they'll mistake your hand for food if you feed in the tank, but it's not true. They don't have to be fed in a separate enclosure.

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If housed individually. I wouldn't recommend feeding them in their own enclosure if they are together.

the breeder let us know that the uvb light may help with shedding. i too questioned the need but got it anyway. i feed them in seperate containers because ive been told it makes for a nicer snake and we can verify who eats and what size. Again i plan to read more on the links that were listed, thanks again!