Curiosity and genetics...overbite?

Yes, if it proves to be genetic I would 'cull' aka kill the babies and keep the adults as pets. Probably gas the same way I kill rodents.

Oh man; that is a stunning female spider :( Is the jury out as to whether/not overbite is genetic?

If you indeed did get offspring from those, and it proved to be genetic, I think the best thing to do would be to take them to the vet to have them properly euthanized...

For me, it wouldn't even be a question of would I breed them or not. It would be a flat-out No. Sub-par animals produce sub-par offspring, and I wouldn't even attempt to breed those two. Yes, the spider may be pretty, but the patterning could also be attributed to her deformity, and why take the risk?

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Originally Posted by SatanicIntention

For me, it wouldn't even be a question of would I breed them or not. It would be a flat-out No. Sub-par animals produce sub-par offspring, and I wouldn't even attempt to breed those two. Yes, the spider may be pretty, but the patterning could also be attributed to her deformity, and why take the risk?

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I'd have to agree with Becky on this. I would not even consider breeding these two.

"the patterning could also be attributed to her deformity"
Carl had that theory too, but more of a reasoning that it was environmental rather than genetic. Something was wrong with the temps so it affected them all and their pattern. Even some of the normals had a reduced pattern. Both parents were completely normal and have no history of 'wobble head'

"I think the best thing to do would be to take them [the offspring] to the vet to have them properly euthanized..."
I actually didn't even think of that, yes, that seems like the best option when and if i breed them.

"why take the risk?"
What risk? it's not like I have so many animals that their offspring in 3-4 years will get lost and accidentally sold as something they are not. I didn't buy this pair for re-sale. They aren't carrying a airborne disease. Simply writing off oddities and assuming anything isn't going to teach us anything. Yes, they are physically sub-par, and it's yet to be seen whether they are simply survivors or thrivers, but are they genetically? Wouldn't you be curious if you found a rabbit with 3 ears, or a dragon born without a tail?
And no, i didn't get a male and female to breed them together. all the spiders were female and all the normals were male [odd in of itself] and I wanted both a normal and morph. If i breed both, and over a couple years play with temps, incubators, substrates [but still in the normal range] different mates, etc and even breed each other's siblings back to them, and nothing pops up. How long should I go to prove it non-genetic?
I love these little puzzles, I pick up oddities anytime I can. I breed beardies, I know a money-toilet when I see one, but I love em. This pair was no investment, I don't see dollar signs when I see my animals, so why not?
To me it's not as simple as the one-eyed or no-eyed albino boas that's genetic from recessive in-breeding. With a dominant morph, there is no reason for this, so where did it come from?
Although I think I'm getting ahead of myself. They still have to shed for the first time and be able to eat. Although I can't get a pic of it [stupid camera] when i was handling them they started using their tongues and their heat pits look normal.
Since I am far from an expert, I take advice and criticism well, that's how we learn, but you can't tell me you aren't the least bit curious about something far from well-documented? :snake:

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Originally Posted by Mezclado_Reps

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"why take the risk?"
What risk? it's not like I have so many animals that their offspring in 3-4 years will get lost and accidentally sold as something they are not. I didn't buy this pair for re-sale. They aren't carrying a airborne disease. Simply writing off oddities and assuming anything isn't going to teach us anything.

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I agree, I really don't see what the risks are......

You may want to read this thread on the Derma ball throughly....its not so easy and black and white of an issue to label something as a "genetic flaw". If the morphological condition is genetic but the animals eat and survive in captivity then can it really be considered a "flaw" anymore than any other rare morph? Many of the designer morphs breed in captivity would likely not fare well in nature. Labeling something genetic as being "flawed", less fit, or a selective disadvantage depends on the environment in which the animal is subjected.

I remember seeing a picture of the derma ball a while ago. Also similiar to the "smootie" debate going on with beardies.

That is an interesting point. Many people think spiders with the wobbles are deformed in a way yet they live very healthy normal lives, eat well and behave normal other than that. Some say it's part of the morph and others think it's a defect yet they behave normal other than the head bobble. I would be concerned how those babies eat and if they can actually close their mouths correctly so they don't get prone to infection. That one definately looks spider but neither parents are spiders? weird but cool. Best of luck!
Whenever I breed an animal that is showing any signs of irregularites I give them away to anyone who wants a pet with special needs. I have only had this happen with beardies though not BP"s.

Sorry, i didn't say that correctly " hat one definately looks spider but neither parents are spiders?" The father was a spider. I meant both parents were 'normal' as in normal patterns and physically normal.

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Originally Posted by Mezclado_Reps

Both parents were completely normal and have no history of 'wobble head'

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I'm guessing that wobble head means a spinner. ALL spiders are spinners to some sort of degree. Some not so bad and it's actually hardly noticiable but it is in fact there. If you watched that snake for some time you'd be able to pick up on it. Then are others who are called train wreck spinners who spin horribly out of control.