Possible loss of colony

I'm really sorry to hear that Wolfy! I am keeping all my fingers and toes crossed that the disease does not strike the rest of ur collection. :please:

This a terrifying thread I hope it's not IBD wolfy Like Raj said toe's and fingers crossed for you bro.

Personally, I would not euthanize the animal. Quarantine it from your other animals. IBD usually wipes out pythons pretty quick, so that does not seem like it would be the case unless you keep boas also and exposed your bps to IBD that a boa was carrying unknown to you. In that case, euthanizing the ball python will really do nothing IMHO.....either IBD is in your collection or not....and if the ball python has it it will die in a few weeks anyway.

If your animals are already exposed to IBD and you quarantine your spider and treat it according for the other problems....and it gets better, then you should have nothing to worry about. But if the spider dies on its own, then have the necroscopy to rule out IBD. I know if I euthanized a snake only to find out that it did not have IBD..I would not be happy with myself. In the time to determine what is wrong with the spider, make sure you have very good cage cleaning practices to ensure that if IBD is in your collection....you don't spread it....after all, if you spider has IBD, how do you know who else has it?

That is just how I would handle the situation. Hope that helps.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by hoo-t

ALL spider balls do this! ALL of them! Some more, some less. Its not well understood, but it is definitely genetic, and apparently neurological.[/B]

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WOW....that is a pretty bold statement.

Have you ever actually seen a 'spinning spider'? Do you know that 'spinning' can occur any just about any ball python but is only commonly talked about with spiders because it is sometimes more common with that trait and people like to talk? Have you personally checked ALL spiders for this condition to be able to make such a comment?

Wolfy, I would definitely not put your spider down unless there is no doubt of IBD. Is it possible that the test was influenced by the mouth rot? If they thought they spinning was IBD I don't know that I would trust them with the life of my animal so quickly. If you wish to talk to me about this I will pm my phone number.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't IBD diagnosed (usually after death) by a biopsy of the liver (or some other organ)? It can't be diagnosed with a blood test.

Guys, there is a ball python that is scheduled to DIE on Monday. Please, lets focus on that rather than whether I'm right or not about genetic traits in spiders! I officially RETRACT my statement that ALL spiders exhibit this trait from this thread and state instead that MANY do and should not be euthanized because of it.

I'll start a new thread for the discussion of spins and shakes in spiders. Please feel free to flame me all you want in that thread.

Thanks!
Steve

Quote:

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Originally Posted by hoo-t

I'll start a new thread for the discussion of spins and shakes in spiders. Please feel free to flame me all you want in that thread.

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No one is flaming....just stating the truth about the situation to get the facts staight ;)

New thread in place - "Spins and Shakes in Spiders".

Steve

Hoo-t,
Thank you for the concern for Hepburn. Sheis not being put down due to the neuroligal concerns. She is being put down because the the mouth rot is severe, she is in pain, and they FOUND IN INCLUSIONS in the blood. NOT due to the spinning.
For the record, I have another perfectly normal spider(sam) who does not spin. The spinning is NOT stargazing which is different. Subtlely, but it is different. Please please rest assured that I am NOT putting her down due to the spinning!! She has spun since I got her in JANUARY, and I adore her.
The mouth rot was so bad, that debriding her mouth to clean it removed a LOT of her teeth, if that will tell you how bad. She has deep pits where infection ate into her mouth, and one that goes upwards through the roof. THIS IS NOT Unnecessary euthanasia. I'm sorry that you feel I should wait and see, but that is not happening.
The IBD pronosis is based on finding INCLUSIONS in the blood. Not neuroligical symptoms.
The vet told me she had personally seen it take longer in pythons to show, although I have been told by EVERYONE else I talked to that it swiftly kills ball pythons. It is entirely possible that this somehow came into the collection on someone else, and she simply is showing first having a slightly compromised immune system due to her genetic fault. She has never "thrived".
I appriciate all the good thoughts, I really really need them, as these pythons have basically become my life.

Rabernet, according to the university of Florida vets,
You can diagnose IBD by blood test, but you cannot conclusively RULE IT OUT with a blood test, as it may be concentrated in the liver. YOu can then also disgnose IBD with a liver biopsy but not RULE IT OUT as it may not be in that section of liver. The only CONCLUSIVE way to rule out IBD is through a necropsy.
I wish it wasn't so, but as she is in bad shape and in pain anyway, I would have probaly decided on euthanasia anyway. This was not a typical case of mouth rot, and I swear I didn't not see signs of the mouth rot on monday which is when I handled her extensively last. I fed on monday and then leave everyone alone except for quick spot checks for water and clean bedding until thursday, which is when I discovered the RI, which turned out to be mouthrot. I found the mouthrot thursday evening and she was at the university vets at 10am friday morning.
Again, thank you to everyone for the sentiments, I really really appriciate them. I will be responding on the spinning htread as well, as I have looked into this a LOT.
Wolfy

Wolfy, I'm so very sorry to hear about little Hepburn. :rainon: It sounds to me like you know what you're doing and are not taking any of these heart-wrending decisions lightly. :hug:


I really hope the rest of your collection is safe and sound!