Dilemma, 2 BP deaths after 1 week after local sale

My gut is that he's trying to get a refund and keep the snakes for free, especially without providing pictures?

1. It seems so sketchy that both snakes coincidentally died at the very same time, within a week of your sale. I mean if even just one snake died, it is believable. But both within days of each other/on the same day is sketchy. Does he have other snakes?

2. if it was due to a heat spike, he would be telling you about burnt bellies/cooked snakes. But he's being wishy washy about what they look like/the snakes bodies.

Also, if he does provide pictures of upside down, dead snakes, be sure to reverse google search to check if he grabbed them off the internet.

Yes, def. ask for pictures of upper AND lower body. All stretched. You will know them by pattern..

And he has replied -

Me: What do you want to do?

Him: Not sure. What do you think is fair for both of us? I don't want you to be upset

Me: I've reached out to and have spoken to established breeders and have researched terms of sale of various reptile breeders on animal guarantees. First, I need pictures and videos of these animals and their enclosures. Where are these animals now? Have they been refrigerated? Not frozen. Not left out. Most breeders have terms on deceased animals. A necropsy at SEAV in NOVA costs $99-$248 per animal, and locally for me would be $150+ as long as the animals have been refrigerated. Again, I would like pictures and videos of the animals and their enclosure to compare to pictures of them that I have. Then we can discuss the next step.

Him: I can get you pictures/videos. They are in a trash bag. They have been left out since I told you. I didn't refrigerate them because iv never heard of anyone doing that. At that cost I can just get new snakes. There's no point in continuing then.

Not trying to be mean or anything. I didn't know you had to refrigerated them after a death. I've never had a snake die. It's just $100 so let's just pass.

Me: Yes, certain steps are needed to be done before taking an animal to have a necropsy. I have been keeping reptiles since 2009 without issue. If you are uninterested in pursuing a necropsy, I'm in agreement in letting this pass as well.

Whelp, no pics... So, that's all folks, or at least I think that that's all. This really hurt. I have raised 2 of the 3 up from hatchlings and I don't know if Newbie and Thelma are even dead or if this guy just tried to scam me. & if they are dead, he tossed them in the trash. I went to the doc today and have Bronchitis, Sinus Infection, and an Ear Infection, and I was ready to drive my sick butt down to his house, get the snakes, and take them to SEAV (they are open tomorrow) for a necropsy. This would've been a 5-6 hour round trip for me. I've been on the fence on being a hobbyist keeper to hobbyist breeder and this makes me not want to deal with the selling part of breeding or breeding at all. If I sell anymore of my collection, I will definitely include terms and a contract. I'm going to go watch kitten and puppy videos on Youtube to cheer me up now because I can't drink because antibiotics.

Thanks everyone for your input. I'll update if for any reason this continues.

He said he 'CAN get you pictures/videos'... so why not get them? At least you could seek solace finding out whether the guy was being honest in some sense.

I would have wanted pictures and/or videos as well. For closure.
If the guy said he can get them..why didn't he?

But if you are at peace with the outcome, then that is what matters. Hope you feel better soon, bronchitis is NO fun :(

For future sellings I would definitely include terms of service where you put the description of where your selling the snakes, on your website, or even on a card along with the snakes(business card or such). so even if you go sell a high end snake and they are just trying to pull a fast one...there is a setup in place to cover your bum


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I'm so sorry you had this experience. I breed and sell fish (yes I know, not the same as snakes), and I have very strict terms. If a fish dies and you want a refund/new fish, I need videos, photos, anything to prove it. If they are DOA, they need to be in the same packaging I sent them in. Some people might think fish are cheap, you know a few bucks at the pet store, but I sell breeder and show guppies which go for as much as a few hundred dollars. Usually mine are about twenty to fifty bucks each or for a pair/batch of fry. I've dealt with a lot of liars, but I have to say, your customers story checks out, at least with my criteria. The guy's willing to send pictures of the dead animals. He did not seem to be pushing for money, or a refund even before you asked for pictures. I would ask for the photos he has before it's too late. This way you can at least have some closure as other posters mentioned. Good luck with future sales.

Here's a thought, does he have any young kids toddler sized? Maybe he showed them to his young kids and they squeezed them too hard in the wrong place.....

Honestly it may be more economical to just refund him his money and call it done, but he could still go out there and say you sold him sick snakes, even if you did refund his money. The best way to preserve your reputation is to just bite the bullet and get the necropsies done. This whole situation sucks, I'm sorry you're having to deal with this crap AND the (possible) deaths of two animals you raised since babies :( I hope it all works out for you in the end.

Just saw that he responded. Honestly if it were me I would still ask for the pictures, but if you're okay with the outcome it's not necessary. This whole interaction just seems very odd to me. I know he wasnt pressing for money but the fact that these two young adult females died at the same time within a week of sale is very strange, and it makes it even more strange for me that as soon as you mention needing pictures and possibly a necropsy, he's ready to settle and call it quits. He may just be concerned about the money and ready to cut his losses, but still why not prove to you that they're dead with pictures?

If I were in his shoes and these snakes really did die with no forewarning and all the correct keeping practices on my side, I would DEFINITELY be sending photos of the snakes and my setups and trying actively with the breeder who sold to me to figure out what happened.