Viv size?

At that size i would say a 20 gal tank would be ok, only if you give at least 3 hides, i have a girl in a 20 gal and when i first got her she was given 3 hides, and a water bowl, silk plants on the sides of her tank, and a humidity rock. clutter the tank and it will feel smaller. a UTH is best to provide belly heat, but always plug them into a thermostat. The UTH should only cover 1/3 of the tank. The heat lamp can be used for ambient temp control. I use glass exo-terra tanks for my BPs, and the only struggle in have is keeping the humidity up in winter, like november to april. Thats why i use humidity rocks and in dead winter a zoomed repti-fogger. Good luck with your new baby.

Ridicule? Hmm ok?

There is no divide I am a pet owner happening to breed some of my animals, not doing this for a living either.

There is a COMMON sense approach of preventing an issue rather than solving one, and setting a 85 grams hatchling in a 20 gallons tank is setting the animal up for failure and sadly feeding issue are not the only thing that can arise from a stressful enviroment.

It's a PROVEN fact that NO ball python feeding issue has EVER been solved with the bigger is better approach, that's based on experience not only as a keeper but also helping other troubleshoot their issues.

The bigger is better aproach does not apply to BP a little research in natural enviroment would quickly reveal that they like small, cramped dark enviroment.

I don't come here for people to do what I do or do what works for me, if they did first time owners would fail too, I am here to share what I know works regardless of you level.


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I'm not sure if this would help at all but it seems like the op is not necessarily opposed to using a smaller tub but is concerned about heating said small tub with a ceramic heat emitter.

So to offer a compromise of sorts you could construct a largish maybe 2*3*2 at a minimum wooden box and install the ceramic heat emitter at the top of the box. You could then place the snake in a 6 qt tub on the other side of the box not under the heat emitter. You would still need at least an on/off thermostat to controller the temperature, but you could just heat the box to 86 or 87 degrees or so. You would obviously need to monitor temps. It would look like this but without the light because heat emitters produce no light.
http://i1172.photobucket.com/albums/...ps2vkmhg4b.jpg

That's more or less what I'm talking about.

That being said it seems like it would be sooo much easier and cheaper and safer to buy a tub a little heat tape and a thermostat.

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I am not advocating bigger is better - quite the contrary , I actually said most people doing breeding are probably the ones doing the best job of it- I was offering a solution that doesn't involve going bigger/using a 10 gallon tank or someone who is interested in a kind of neat looking enclosure not having to upgrade 23 times or use a plastic tub if they, for whatever reason, hate that/can't make that work for them (ie: the CHE issue - I don't know, I don't use them, may be a non-issue).

Get a 10 gallon (or heck 5), grow out in there, upgrade straight to the ultimate size enclosure at 40 instead of putting the baby in a too big 20 gallon tank and upgrading to a 40 later. It's still 2 tanks, the 10 is cheaper than the 20, it's easier to clutter up and cover the sides of, and you skip the stressed snake stage with a hatchling in a huge freaking space so you get a snake who has had the opportunity to get some weight on it and establish itself feeding.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CptJack

T They're nice, attractively decorated, glass enclosures that make me happy. WITHOUT stressing out the snakes; they eat, shed, eliminate well, and are docile and friendly snakes. I'm cool with that.
However, all of that said? If you have a BP doing serious cruising more often than not? I'd be suspecting something of being off, somewhere. That's not content BP behavior.

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I totally agree. My boy is perfect in all things ball python. He comes out to cruise only at night (not every night either) and never for more that an hour or two before settling back in to a hide. As feeding day gets closer he gets more active. After eating he goes in a hide and does not come out for a two to three days at all.

I do know that people that have dozens to hundreds of snakes have perfected the husbandry to be as efficient at possible while still meeting the snakes needs, but I also enjoy a well decorated vivarium and being able to see my snake when he decides to come out, and it works for him. The breeders / large collectors are also doing what is best for their snakes and that is perfectly fine too. Because the tank is harder to maintain, I will be switching to the T8, just so he can stretch out more as an adult.

For the average bp bigger is not better but for my super pastel is a different story. He was in a v211 24x24x14 and would eat once every 3 weeks if I was lucky. I order v400 48x24x14 and when it arrived I set it up and put him in and he refused his first meal and ate every meal after that. I put a 213g killer bee in the v211 and has ate every meal since the day after I got her. I would consider her cage semi cluttered with 2 rbi medium hides, water bowel, fake plant, and a log. I even have 2 leopard geckos that wouldn't eat in there 20g and they started eating the day I put them in there 40g breeder, I tried to move them back and instantly off feed until I put them back.

Do not by any means expect these same results though.

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