Ball Python or Corn Snake?

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Originally Posted by Kiara1125

Thanks! My house stays at least 78F all year long, so hopefully it will work out well. I'll have a hygrometer in the tank, so that will be taken care of. Thanks for the snug hiding spot tips! I think I'll go cheap as the ball grows and then have some realistic decor whenever it's an adult. I am used to carefully monitoring the humidity, since I have a crestie and I had a beardie for 9 years - so I'm definitely ready for a snake. Do you think I should keep a 1' long baby into a 10g to start with or immediately jump it to a 20gL? Also, do you have a problem with females being egg bound? I wouldn't mind having a female, I'm just afraid of this. Both my crestie and beardie are/were males. One more question - you said that you waited 2 days after they ate before handling them. I'm wondering how the week thing works. My friend will feed his snake and then not touch him for a week, but I've heard of other people leaving snakes alone for a few days, feeding them, then leaving them alone for the rest of the week. So, how does that work?

Other than that,those are the rest of my questions. Thank you very much for covering so much to begin with!

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You can use a 20 gallon long for a baby as long as it's VERY cluttered. I would cover the back and 2 sides with paper, and do two hides (snug fitting), water bowl, fake plants, other decorations, wads of paper, etc. If you can try blocking off a part of the tank somehow, that would probably be best (but make sure you never put tape in the enclosure!). Here's a pretty helpful thread about setting up a glass tank: http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...-With-Pictures!

I would definitely recommend setting up the tank before you get the snake, so you can get the husbandry absolutely perfect. We are using a homemade rack, and we set it up about a week before we got our ball pythons so that we could make sure that the temps, humidity, thermostat settings, etc. were right. You will probably only need a heat mat/under-tank-heater if your house is 78F+, and you definitely will need a thermostat to regulate it. You generally have to play around with the thermostat settings a bit to get the temps exactly right.

I personally do not have females, so I can't say from experience, but I have never heard of a female ball python becoming egg bound (or even cycling infertile eggs) if she's never been with a male. Female ball pythons do get a bit bigger than males, but not horribly so. You may want to keep that in mind, though - a female would require slightly larger housing than a male would once she's an adult.

We did a 5 day feeding schedule until our boys were about 500 grams. Now that they are all in the 500-700 gram range, we are doing feedings every 7 days. You can start a baby out on 5-day or 7-day feeding schedule. What we do is no handling on feeding day or for 48 hours after feeding. So when they were on a 5 day schedule, there were only 2 days that we handled them out of every 5 (does that make sense?). Now that they're bigger, we feed on Sunday nights, so we don't handle them on Sunday, Monday, or Tuesday (but we do handle them Tuesday night). I like the 7 day schedule much more as it allows for more handling, but I also liked that they gained weight nicely when on the 5 day schedule. It's up to you, either way works. I should also add that if they don't eat, we avoid handling them until after they've eaten again. So for our one who's currently fasting, we're trying not to handle him a lot.

Someone else recommended a scale - if you don't already have a digital gram scale, I feel that it's well worth the investment! They're only about $25, and they are great for tracking weight. I measure after they poop, so I can track their "empty weight." It's definitely kept me from worrying about the boys and my beardies when it's hard to tell if they're gaining nicely.

None of ours have ever struck at us, but I have been hissed at occasionally when they're in shed and I'm misting them. They've all been really sweet, and when we have them out, they usually want to explore a bit, but for the most part they just sit there.

Sorry for such a long post, but I hope it helps!

I have read most of this thread, but if I am redundant, I apologize.

Here is my two cents. Keep in mind I have had both corn snakes and ball pythons throughout my life and currently have a female ball and a male corn snake.

Corn Snake:

Pros:

1. Will eat easily and often on appropriate sized food items - F/T is no problem, especially when started young, but even adults are easy to switch. Aggressive feeders, but not aggressive towards owners. I have had kings who strike willingly expecting a meal if it is there or not. Not making a generalization on kings, but corns I have never had mistake me for food or come after me looking for food.

2. Less complex requirements - need less heat, less humidity, etc. They still need decent humidity (50% +) when shedding, but otherwise usually do fine with house humidity. 86-88 degrees hot spot and a 75-80 degrees cool spot and they are happy.

3. Usually VERY tame, even as young ones.

4. Very active - like being out and even often check out their owners when they walk by or look in.

5. Small size/weight relative to other snakes. Therefore smaller enclosures. I think a 30G would be fine for an adult corn. SECURE is key though - they are thin bodied snakes and can escape easily.

6. Cool morphs

7. Inexpensive, even for really beautiful morphs.

8. Hardy

Cons:

1. Very small as young snakes - and tend to be squirmy. They grow out of it most of the time, but even as adults are more active when handled than larger snakes like ball pythons. The small size and squirmy nature can be difficult for new owners at times. Overall, if you handle often, they grow out of it quickly.


Ball Pythons:

Pros:

1. Usually very tame especially when handled. Most outgrow any aggression, but there are a few aggressive ones. Not saying corns can't be, but haven't experienced it.

2. Good body size - not fragile, even when young, and are not too big, but big enough to handle easily at any age.

3. Awesome color morphs.

4. Usually totally chill when being handled. My female will sit around my shoulders or in my arms and relax for hours on end if I want to hold her that long.

5. Hardy - when requirements are met - right temp, right humidity.

Cons:

1. Can be picky eaters and not all take F/T. I have had good experience with F/T and balls when I have been patient and work with the animal. Shayna, our female albino ball takes F/T readily and I have fed her that since I got her at 5 months of age. I have even switched an 11 year old wild caught to F/T - with a lot of patience and trial and error. Shayna will sometimes go weeks without eating for no reason at all (it seems) and then start eating again no problem. If you have one snake and start them young, F/T should work fine with most animals. The key is to know your animal and work with them. I also don't sweat fasting unless she loses substantial weight. The longest fast has been a month or two and she lost 3% or so of her body weight - not a big deal.

Bottom line: Make sure you know the snake you get took F/T and work with the animal through fasts, etc. You should be fine. If you absolutely refuse to feed live, balls can be more difficult.

2. You really have to keep up on heat and humidity. If you do, you will have a hardy snake. If you neglect, you can get a sick animal more easily than a corn (more so because the requirements are less - if you neglect a corn, or any animal, you are asking for trouble).

3. Can be very expensive for nice morphs.


OVERALL:

I love both snakes. I think it is a matter of what you are looking for and how you approach it. Ball's need a little extra work and patience (especially with feeding, specifically regarding feeding schedule - they dictate it more than you do). However, they are very rewarding snakes. I love Shayna and wouldn't trade her for anything, even with some of the feeding issues. Again, I keep up on maintenance (water, food, heat, humidity) for all my animals, so she is healthy and happy. That is key regardless of which animal you choose.

Figment, our corn, is also fantastic. He is personable and a voracious feeder, which is fun. He also eats like clockwork, so no worries there. Again, I have learned not to sweat Shayna's hunger strikes.

I hope this is helpful, even if it is just my two cents.

David

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Originally Posted by dakski

I have read most of this thread, but if I am redundant, I apologize.

Here is my two cents. Keep in mind I have had both corn snakes and ball pythons throughout my life and currently have a female ball and a male corn snake.

Corn Snake:

Pros:

1. Will eat easily and often on appropriate sized food items - F/T is no problem, especially when started young, but even adults are easy to switch. Aggressive feeders, but not aggressive towards owners. I have had kings who strike willingly expecting a meal if it is there or not. Not making a generalization on kings, but corns I have never had mistake me for food or come after me looking for food.

2. Less complex requirements - need less heat, less humidity, etc. They still need decent humidity (50% +) when shedding, but otherwise usually do fine with house humidity. 86-88 degrees hot spot and a 75-80 degrees cool spot and they are happy.

3. Usually VERY tame, even as young ones.

4. Very active - like being out and even often check out their owners when they walk by or look in.

5. Small size/weight relative to other snakes. Therefore smaller enclosures. I think a 30G would be fine for an adult corn. SECURE is key though - they are thin bodied snakes and can escape easily.

6. Cool morphs

7. Inexpensive, even for really beautiful morphs.

8. Hardy

Cons:

1. Very small as young snakes - and tend to be squirmy. They grow out of it most of the time, but even as adults are more active when handled than larger snakes like ball pythons. The small size and squirmy nature can be difficult for new owners at times. Overall, if you handle often, they grow out of it quickly.


Ball Pythons:

Pros:

1. Usually very tame especially when handled. Most outgrow any aggression, but there are a few aggressive ones. Not saying corns can't be, but haven't experienced it.

2. Good body size - not fragile, even when young, and are not too big, but big enough to handle easily at any age.

3. Awesome color morphs.

4. Usually totally chill when being handled. My female will sit around my shoulders or in my arms and relax for hours on end if I want to hold her that long.

5. Hardy - when requirements are met - right temp, right humidity.

Cons:

1. Can be picky eaters and not all take F/T. I have had good experience with F/T and balls when I have been patient and work with the animal. Shayna, our female albino ball takes F/T readily and I have fed her that since I got her at 5 months of age. I have even switched an 11 year old wild caught to F/T - with a lot of patience and trial and error. Shayna will sometimes go weeks without eating for no reason at all (it seems) and then start eating again no problem. If you have one snake and start them young, F/T should work fine with most animals. The key is to know your animal and work with them. I also don't sweat fasting unless she loses substantial weight. The longest fast has been a month or two and she lost 3% or so of her body weight - not a big deal.

Bottom line: Make sure you know the snake you get took F/T and work with the animal through fasts, etc. You should be fine. If you absolutely refuse to feed live, balls can be more difficult.

2. You really have to keep up on heat and humidity. If you do, you will have a hardy snake. If you neglect, you can get a sick animal more easily than a corn (more so because the requirements are less - if you neglect a corn, or any animal, you are asking for trouble).

3. Can be very expensive for nice morphs.


OVERALL:

I love both snakes. I think it is a matter of what you are looking for and how you approach it. Ball's need a little extra work and patience (especially with feeding, specifically regarding feeding schedule - they dictate it more than you do). However, they are very rewarding snakes. I love Shayna and wouldn't trade her for anything, even with some of the feeding issues. Again, I keep up on maintenance (water, food, heat, humidity) for all my animals, so she is healthy and happy. That is key regardless of which animal you choose.

Figment, our corn, is also fantastic. He is personable and a voracious feeder, which is fun. He also eats like clockwork, so no worries there. Again, I have learned not to sweat Shayna's hunger strikes.

I hope this is helpful, even if it is just my two cents.

David

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I agree completely with this. One more con for corn snakes though. They poop much more often than balls. So more spot cleaning is required.

I keep both species and while I absolutely love ball pythons, I have to say corn snakes make the better beginner snake by far.

Thought I'd put in a totally out of the box comment... Have you thought about Kenyan sand boas? I had one as one of my first two snakes (the other is a hognose) and she has been awesome.

They stay smaller than balls / corns, but if you get a female, she could get up to 3 feet and they are more chunky than corns. Females can live their whole life in a 20gl long and males in a 10gl. I have two females and I must say that they are great starter snakes. Not very picky on temps / humidity (they do like it hotter though, my hotspots stay at 95), and they need a humid hide when shedding.

They don't need hides... and bury themselves under the substrate. They are somewhere between corns and BPs in price... I paid $150 for my anery (overpriced) and $200 for my nuclear female. Oh, and they eat... boy do they eat... My largest female was on a 5 day schedule until she got over 150 grams, then we moved her to a 7 day schedule. They will also take multiple food items (when we've been between prey sizes).

As far as activity goes... I find that it varies, our anery will chill and crawl slowly around looking for a digging spot, our nuclear, well, she's like a corn.. always moving and fast. My only BP moves about as much as my Kenyans, but she is still small so she may grow out of this.

I would say that a Kenyan is just as good of a starter as a corn and may fit your specs. more like a BP would if you're cool with a smaller snake (keep in mind that females are much larger than males, so I'd suggest a female if you want a snake closer to a corn in size).

If you want something that will permanantly be happy in a 20gl long, is easy to care for, and a great eater, then I'd say consider a female Kenyan (also, check out all of the cool morphs they come in).

Here's a pic of zelda, my anery Kenyan. Keep in mind that she's not quite half-way grown in terms of length and should get up to 4x bigger weight wise.
http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t...e/DSCN2650.jpg

If you're interested, pm me and I can send you links to sand boa groups and tell you who I got mine from.

Now... More on topic, I only have experience with a BP (corns are illegal in GA) and I can say that I got one that is a good feeder and as long as you keep your humidity up and temps right, they are not hard to keep... I would seriously consider doing a tub setup though to help with humidity (there's a sticky somewhere on this site on how to setup a tub, can't remember where). I would really advise getting one from a breeder that is already feeding f/t and has had several meals consistently.

Thanks so much everyone for the info! I'm wondering if I should start with a corn snake and get a BP whenever I feel confident in my ability to keep snakes. What do you guys think I should do? I'm fine with the humidity and temperature requirements, it's just the food rejection that would scare me. I want to do everything in my power to make sure that my new addition is happy and healthy and I would feel like I'm doing something wrong if my snake rejected food. So, do you guys think I should go with a corn snake first? I LOVE both snakes, so it's a win:win for me. I'm just wondering what would be the best bet since I'm going to be a new snake owner. I've wanted a snake for 9 years now, but I'm not sure if I could handle the early stress of a BP not eating. If a corn snake is pretty much guaranteed to be a vigorous eater,then I'm fine with getting one.

Basically it comes down to this: I have the time and money for a snake, but I can be emotionally unstable with pet stress situations. I was freaking out because I received an estimate for a $700-$800 vet bill for my dog to have 11 or more teeth removed. Now, after my boyfriend and his mother talked me through everything, I know what to do and I am confident in what I'm doing with my dog. He seems in less pain, is happier, is eating more/again, and I don't have to pay a huge vet bill. Sorry for the rambling, though. Basically, I'm starting to wonder/think if I should go with a corn snake to reduce stress on myself.

Go with the corn, if you're going to stress the food. It will take a lot of the fun out and turn it from an enjoyable experience into something that makes you unhappy and that's the opposite of the point.

I would also see if you can find a slightly older cornsnake as they can be even more docile, but if not you'll be gold with even a hatchling.

That works! Plus, I'm glad that the morphs are cheaper. An anery corn snake is $25 while an axanthic BP is over $100. :O Another plus, there's an anery corn snake in my local pet store. *grabby hands* Still, thanks for all the help! I would definitely appreciate it if anyone is willing to post here or PM me with tips or advice on corn snake care. I will gladly take all the help I can get! :D

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Originally Posted by Kiara1125

That works! Plus, I'm glad that the morphs are cheaper. An anery corn snake is $25 while an axanthic BP is over $100. :O Another plus, there's an anery corn snake in my local pet store. *grabby hands* Still, thanks for all the help! I would definitely appreciate it if anyone is willing to post here or PM me with tips or advice on corn snake care. I will gladly take all the help I can get! :D

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There is actually a cornsnake forum here!

http://ball-pythons.net/forums/forum...y.php?86-Corns

If it's your first snake... PLEASE go with a Corn. If I hadn't had my Corns, I never would have been able to handle my Ball. We got Jax (my BP) well after we had Ginger and Ghost (Corns), and he STILL stresses me out. He refused to eat for so long that his body began to LOSE mass. Corns don't care. Plus, they are fun and lovable. Yes, they are active, but my babes are happy crawling up my shoulders and hair... never had a problem with them running. Ever. They move a lot, but once they're used to you, they want you like a toddler.

I love my ball python. If you get a captive bred snake it will usually be a good eater, my current ball "Delphi" has never missed a meal. I think troublesome Balls are much less common then they used to be. Captive breeding has really produced good eaters. Seasonal fasts in adult snakes are still to be expected but are not really a problem. The fasts seem triggered more by light frequency than temperature, since most tanks are temp controlled, and many people report seasonal fasts. Also the husbandry is really well known so, husbandry related fasts are really a thing of the past.

Ball pythons are usually very chill, but they can get stressed by frequent handling and even though they just hang out, they might not be the best snake for frequent handling. I find that sometimes, handling balls can put them off of food for a day or two. This really depends mostly on the individual snake, since some will eat after being handled and some won't.

Though I have experience with other peoples corn snakes, I just picked up a my first corn snake. She is a rescue from someone who lost interest in her after about a year. She is in good shape, very active, will eat seconds after being held. She is just hypnotic as she moves though my fingers. I use both hands, with my fingers spread, guide her from one hand to the next, then turn my wrist so she makes a complete circuit. She will move continuously like this for hours, her maze like markings moving past one another in a whir, We renamed her maze.

I have to agree with the corn snakes poop a lot comment. I have had Maze for two weeks and cleaned the tank six times already. When I worked in a college vivarium, the colubrids all had messy cages every few days, the boas and pythons tended to defecate less often, except for the Tics that seemed to enjoy messing a cage five minutes after it was cleaned. I will say that colubrid poop is generally not as rank as Boa or Python Poop.

Both types of snakes are great beginner snakes, but I would probably go with the corn first. It is an easier snake to care for, and a more certain eater. It is less expensive, so you can spend more money on a proper set up. It takes smaller prey through its lifetime. Corn snakes are far more curious than Ball Pythons in general. Individual snakes may vary. My corn is constantly watching what is going on outside of her tank. This seems true of most corns. My ball stays in her hide 95% of the time and could care less about anything. This seems typical of most ball pythons. Corn snakes are not generally as strictly nocturnal as ball pythons, so you will see your corn snake more. Corn snakes also seem to be less stressed by handling than ball pythons.

Either way, you will be getting a great first snake. I hope you have many happy years as a snake keeper. Please remember though, that both species can live for decades, and that the Ball Python could potentially make it half a century, so these snakes require long term stability and commitment on your part.

Best of luck.

David