My personal thoughts on feeding in the cage making them more "aggressive"

Sorry; that's what I get for reading this at 5AM:rolleye2:

The only time I've ever had issues was when I was an OTR truck driver and my collection was down to one snake and a tortoise. The wife would feed and care for the tortoise, but the snake had to wait till i got home. So after a few years of almost no interaction and just getting tossed a rat every couple weeks, he became very "feed mode" any time the cage door got opened. Made cage cleaning rough to say the least, anything moving was a target. I have managed to calm him down some again, but I still get him out with the hook, once out he is fine.
This is just what some would mistake as aggression when in reality it's just feeding response. All my snakes are still fed in the enclosure.

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Originally Posted by Trackstrong83

*JUST my opinion, not stating anything out-right, no definite facts. Just observations from my own experience*

Thought of this today when I was feeding the snakes at the pet store I work at, specifically when I was feeding our male pastel we have.(who is in an enclosure by himself).
I was feeding our pastel a f/t rat pup today, in his enclosure, when my boss came around the corner and instantly started yelling at me for feeding the snake in its cage. Stating "you know if you feed a ball python in its cage it will make it ALOT meaner". WHAT I THINK, is that people mistake a good feeding response for aggression. All of my snakes eat in their tubs, which I do believe makes them feel more comfortable, and all are eating machines. Now I just opened the tub to my little butter girl, and when I went to move her water bowl I saw her head poking out of her hide and following my hand everywhere it went. It did look like she was getting ready to strike at me, so i placed my hand near her to see if that's what she was going to do, and nope, no bite. My dumerils will do the same thing. They may get back in the "S" shape looking like they're going to bite (which can be very intimidating to a novice keeper, and can be easily mistaken for aggression) but I think they just LOVE TO EAT. :rofl: And I think when they rear back I think they're just waiting for a rat to pass in front of them.
Just my thoughts on what I noticed tonight while feeding.

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Agree 100% - I never have fed out of the enclosure and I never will.

I haven't ever fed outside of my enclosure. I don't think I ever would either. My girl has a KILLER feeding response, so it wouldn't make sense for me to change anything.

Honestly, she probably would freak out and NOT eat if I moved her to a separate feeding tank.

When I first got her, I read a lot on the subject, and I couldn't find any LOGICAL reasons for feeding outside her normal environment.

It really doesn't matter whether feeding them in a specific spot makes them agressive in that spot or not. As NERD has pointed out with their retics. It is better to have a very hungry snake inside a cage then outside it. It is far safer to receive a feeding response inside the cage then when you are taking them out and putting them in a tub to feed.

If they look like they are going to strike at you inside the cage, simply close the lid. However if you turn on their feeding response through repetition by placing them in a tub outside the cage, your taking a hungry snake, moving it, feeding it, exposing the room to all the smells of rats, and then handling it again to put it back in its cage.

When I had my first ball python, back in the 90's, I fed in its enclosure. No one told me any different, and it never occurred to me that I should do anything different. I never had a problem with any kind of aggression. He had a great feeding response, when it was time to eat. When he wasn't hungry, he was as docile as ever.

With my snakes now I have a routine that tells them when it's feeding time and when it's not. I generally don't handle them too much in the evening, which is when I do feed them. I handle them in the day time, including cleaning out their tubs and changing their waters. I also take the lid off their tub entirely when it is time for handling. Unless they are VERY hungry, they seem to realize the difference between these routines. Only one snake has ever acted like he was going to bite during the handling routine, and that was a feeding response type behavior because he skipped his last meal due to being in shed. (Only other threatened bites were from the axanthics when they were tiny and afraid of everything.)

I feed in the enclosure... so far no issues. I take the mouse into the room in a critter keeper about 10 mins before I feed her. She gets the smell and sticks her head out of the hide by the time I go back in.
I figure she'll know it's feeding time, considering when its handling/cleaning time obviously the mouse smell is not there :)

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Trackstrong83

*JUST my opinion, not stating anything out-right, no definite facts. Just observations from my own experience*

Thought of this today when I was feeding the snakes at the pet store I work at, specifically when I was feeding our male pastel we have.(who is in an enclosure by himself).
I was feeding our pastel a f/t rat pup today, in his enclosure, when my boss came around the corner and instantly started yelling at me for feeding the snake in its cage. Stating "you know if you feed a ball python in its cage it will make it ALOT meaner". WHAT I THINK, is that people mistake a good feeding response for aggression. All of my snakes eat in their tubs, which I do believe makes them feel more comfortable, and all are eating machines. Now I just opened the tub to my little butter girl, and when I went to move her water bowl I saw her head poking out of her hide and following my hand everywhere it went. It did look like she was getting ready to strike at me, so i placed my hand near her to see if that's what she was going to do, and nope, no bite. My dumerils will do the same thing. They may get back in the "S" shape looking like they're going to bite (which can be very intimidating to a novice keeper, and can be easily mistaken for aggression) but I think they just LOVE TO EAT. :rofl: And I think when they rear back I think they're just waiting for a rat to pass in front of them.
Just my thoughts on what I noticed tonight while feeding.

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Originally Posted by decensored

Agree 100% - I never have fed out of the enclosure and I never will.

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Couldn't agree any better, I totally agree with the snakes going into the strike position because they're waiting on food. I actually have done the same thing with my Pin, putting my hand near him when he follows my hand... nothing not bit once by him. Hes just a very aggressive feeder same thing goes with my Ivory and BEL.

I use to feed outside the tub when I had just one BP and I quickly learned from my wife who told me that's a no no. Especially if I was ever going to move up to larger snakes or eventually a giant. She had a huge female Burm growing up. :rolleye2:

The only time I ever got tagged was while I was feeding out of his enclosure. He wasn't out of feeding mode when I went to transfer him back into his tank. It's more stress than it's worth to have to move them back into a tank while adjusting to their meal. In the enclosure, they can just crawl back into their hide and relax.

Yeah, as Brian said. Feeding outside the cage with large pythons is asking for trouble. Moving a 10-20ft hungry giant out of a cage hopeing it doesnt nail you in the process, then feeding it, then picking it back up after its all hyped, and moving it back is just insanity :colbert:.

I am learning a lot from working with my little dwarf retic and I definitely can tell you that I have no plans of moving him around when its feeding day and hes 10ft+.