ALS - Acts Like Super

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Originally Posted by RoseyReps

Personally I stick with allelic.

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x2. theres enough pointless slang in the reptile breeding hobby.

Honestly imo, if you want to breed balls you NEED to take the time to understand at least the basic genetic stuff, under which this would fall. It's truly not that complicated.

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I prefer sticking with allelic.

Kevin has already said that he doesn't want ball python genetics to get too scientific(y)? Which is why he likes to use these other terms.

Personally I prefer sticking to the definitions that are already in place. These terms like (super) instead of homozygous just confuse discussions from my observations. It took me freaking forever to figure out basic mendelian genetics and I struggled up until I learned the difference between genotype, phenotype, heterozygous, and homozygous. Then everything fell into place.

Then explain this to me. When I read the definition of allelic...that pretty much covers ALL genes/mutations. It's generic. It's not specific to this type of behavior. Dominants, Co-Dom, Recessives...they are ALL allelic. At least according to all the genetics web sites I have visited. And so we have these more descriptive terms to use for specific allelic behaviors.

I prefer allelic and find "acts like super" to be needless jargon. I agree that the least we can do as breeders is try and educate ourselves on how the genetics of our animals actually works.

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Originally Posted by MasonC2K

Then explain this to me. When I read the definition of allelic...that pretty much covers ALL genes/mutations. It's generic. It's not specific to this type of behavior. Dominants, Co-Dom, Recessives...they are ALL allelic. At least according to all the genetics web sites I have visited. And so we have these more descriptive terms to use for specific allelic behaviors.

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I've seen some pretty bad definitions of allele.

All alleles are genes, but not all genes are alleles.

Alleles are slightly different genes that can make a gene pair. They can make a gene pair because they reside in the same location in the chromosomes.

Albino and the corresponding normal gene can make a gene pair. They are alleles. Pied and the corresponding normal gene can make a gene pair, so they are alleles. One albino gene and one pied gene cannot make a gene pair, so they are not alleles. The normal alternative to the albino gene and the normal alternative to the pied gene reside at different locations in the chromosomes. They cannot make a gene pair, so they are not alleles, either.

The mojave and lesser mutant genes can make a gene pair; they are alleles. The spider and pinstripe mutant genes cannot make a gene pair; they are not alleles.

Clear as mud?

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Originally Posted by paulh

I've seen some pretty bad definitions of allele.

All alleles are genes, but not all genes are alleles.

Alleles are slightly different genes that can make a gene pair. They can make a gene pair because they reside in the same location in the chromosomes.

Albino and the corresponding normal gene can make a gene pair. They are alleles. Pied and the corresponding normal gene can make a gene pair, so they are alleles. One albino gene and one pied gene cannot make a gene pair, so they are not alleles. The normal alternative to the albino gene and the normal alternative to the pied gene reside at different locations in the chromosomes. They cannot make a gene pair, so they are not alleles, either.

The mojave and lesser mutant genes can make a gene pair; they are alleles. The spider and pinstripe mutant genes cannot make a gene pair; they are not alleles.

Clear as mud?

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It is when you explain it... :P

Hopefully my genetics 101 page on the upcoming website is a good enough and clear enough reference that I can link it into threads like this and have the less educated herpers understand it while still having it be scientifically accurate.

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Originally Posted by paulh

I've seen some pretty bad definitions of allele.

All alleles are genes, but not all genes are alleles.

Alleles are slightly different genes that can make a gene pair. They can make a gene pair because they reside in the same location in the chromosomes.

Albino and the corresponding normal gene can make a gene pair. They are alleles. Pied and the corresponding normal gene can make a gene pair, so they are alleles. One albino gene and one pied gene cannot make a gene pair, so they are not alleles. The normal alternative to the albino gene and the normal alternative to the pied gene reside at different locations in the chromosomes. They cannot make a gene pair, so they are not alleles, either.

The mojave and lesser mutant genes can make a gene pair; they are alleles. The spider and pinstripe mutant genes cannot make a gene pair; they are not alleles.

Clear as mud?

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So I understand all that. But the term "allelic" by itself is a generic term that mean "having to do with alleles" and you've defined allele quite fine I think. But just using the word "allelic" to me does not adequately describe the "Acts Like Super" behavior. Dominant is an allelic behavior. So is Recessive which was your example.

When someone says "this morph is recessive" we know what that means. When someone says "this is the Super/Homozygous for of this morph" we know what that means. Allelic covers all of the these. So if a new morph comes along how would know how the gene works if someone just said "it's allelic"?

Sure, "Act Like Super" is silly but no one else has come up with anything else that I know of. So there needs to be a more specific word or phrase to describe to behavior of "this 2 gene parent will produce offspring that all have either gene A or gene B but not both."

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Originally Posted by MasonC2K;

So there needs to be a more specific word or phrase to describe to behavior of "this 2 gene parent will produce offspring that all have either gene A or gene B but not both."

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Why? That description makes perfect sense to me, without needing a new piece of jargon that then has to be explained with the same sentence above.

I also hate the term 'Acts like a super'.
Allelic, homozygous, incomplete dominant, co dominant, etc etc is what I prefer....
And the definition given also made sense to me as well.



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