Snake Activity and Frequency of Handling

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Originally Posted by WhiteSoxPyro83

how do you guys know pythons do not have emotions? Have you ever been a ball python? Do you know him? Does he call you at home? Do you have a dorsal fin??? lol. To train the dolphin you must think like the dolphin! lol...but seriously...how do you know they don't have emotions? I have seen my snake exhibit what seems like excitement...and I have also seen videos of pissed off, angry snakes. I would call anger an emotion.? no?

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While science does not like to admit how little it knows about the physiology of the brain, it does know some very fundamental things about cognition how to measure the parts of the brain responsible for it. Snakes have an extremely limited capacity for emotion, so much so that you could safely say it is nearly non-existent.

'love' = feels unthreatened, relaxed

'excited' = alert to stimuli, unthreatened

'anger' = threatened, defensive

The words love, excited, anger have deeper chemical processes attached to them as they are defined in human language and you can relate to those words. Dolphins are capable of emotional cognition at a MUCH higher capacity than snakes, so much so that you could safely say they do feel emotions the way we define and can relate to them.

People like to make yes or no statements out of things. For the purpose of discussion here, they can do so pretty safely, but it isn't technically accurate. It's much more appropriate to say they can't than can.

http://www.google.com/imgres?q=why+s...,r:0,s:0,i:162I was just quoting Ace Ventura. I do appreciate the input however...just kinda having fun.

If it makes you feel better to feel as though your snake loves you, so be it! :)

I personally don't think my snakes "love" me, but I do think that they know who I am. They are comfortable with me picking them up and holding them and they generally don't perceive me as a threat (mot of the time haha).

Plenty of people have great relationships with their singular pet snake. I was there at one point too! Eventually I became captivated by the ball python's crazy pattern and color mutations that I couldn't have just one :)

The first snake I ever got will always hold a special place in my heart. I would never ever give her up! I love her just as much as my dog or cat, but in a different way :P

lol...thanks a bunch for that last comment. However, I don't believe I said he loves me or I think he loves me. I was more or less commenting based on observations of him and his activity in his tank and in my room and lawn. I have spent the past year fine tuning his preferences on temp, and actually greatly improved his living conditions, and I noticed a very noticeable change in his body language. I can definitely tell he is more comfortable in his tank than he used to be. I also notice a difference in behavior when I am holding him compared to a stranger. I never intended on getting this snake. He was the pet of my best friend of 27 years (I'm 29). He passed away last year, and his parents decided to give him to me. So...the snake is much more than just a snake to me. I just want to provide the best living conditions possible; therefore, I am very pro active and having fun setting up his new enclosure. My friend did an awesome job rasing him, but I took it to the next level as far as husbandry. All I can hope for is another 20 awesome years!

The whole body language change (for the better), and eagerness rather than discomfort are where I bed to differ.

I'm sorry to hear about your friend :( But I'm glad his memory lives on through your pet snake!

I totally understand the body language thing. Once you've been keeping snakes for a while, you can really see how they are feeling based on their body language.

I guess when I read that your snake "loved" doing certain things, I assumed you meant your snake also loves doing those things with you ;).

As long as your husbandry is good and your snake is eating, I don't think any amount of handling or interaction could be considered "bad". I take my snakes outside from time to time, I'm sure they somewhat enjoy the change of scenery and new smells. Some snakes are much less stressed in these situations than others. My young snakes are often very scared (balling up), while my adults are busy wandering around and checking stuff out.

Your snake might be very active and inquisitive when handling and being in different places, but for other snakes, this could be extremely stressful. If you know how to read their body language (which it appears you do) you can judge when your snake is feeling uncomfortable vs. when they are feeling relaxed.

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Originally Posted by Rickys_Reptiles

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I felt that she "loved" to be out, exploring. But, what I've learned since then is that she "Tolerated" being touched, and she was more than likely climbing and exploring in order to find a safer place to hide. Snakes are reptiles, and their brains are not capable of emotions the way you are mentioning above.

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100% this.

It's like when people claim their bp loves swimming in the bathtub, when it's much more likely that their bp just enjoys not drowning in the bathtub.

The reptilian brain flat out does not have the structures that we attribute many of our emotions to. If you're seeing anything other than fear, anger, hunger or desire to mate then you're anthropomorphizing. He is active at night because he's nocturnal, he likes hanging on to your neck becaue that's better than falling on the ground. As much as we would love to think that Mr. Snakey loves to see us when we take him out it's just not the case. They would much rather that the giant predator thing stops taking them out of their house.

Bp's are shy by nature, look at how they got their name. Them hanging out and not moving much doesn't mean they like being around us, it's more likely because please don't eat me Mr. Giant man sir.

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Originally Posted by mackynz

100% this.

It's like when people claim their bp loves swimming in the bathtub, when it's much more likely that their bp just enjoys not drowning in the bathtub.

The reptilian brain flat out does not have the structures that we attribute many of our emotions to. If you're seeing anything other than fear, anger, hunger or desire to mate then you're anthropomorphizing. He is active at night because he's nocturnal, he likes hanging on to your neck becaue that's better than falling on the ground. As much as we would love to think that Mr. Snakey loves to see us when we take him out it's just not the case. They would much rather that the giant predator thing stops taking them out of their house.

Bp's are shy by nature, look at how they got their name. Them hanging out and not moving much doesn't mean they like being around us, it's more likely because please don't eat me Mr. Giant man sir.

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This is exactly the kind of condescending talk I have encountered quiet a bit on this site. And frankly, it frustrates me. If it's not EXACTLY the way you see it...then you are wrong and stupid. I know there are a lot of morons out there, but I am not one of them. That bathtub comment is ridiculous. He hangs on my neck because I put him there. He enjoys the new smells and things...just like Kaorte said. And I am aware they are nocturnal...did you even read this thread? That wasn't what I was asking about.

There is no anthropomorphism police lol. As long as your snake is healthy and well cared for you can do whatever you want in terms of handling. Everyone on this site is guilty of anthropomorphising their animals. But dont worry..its not an actual crime.

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It's true that the reptilian brain doesn't have the same structure that processes emotion. They're instinctual creatures. More primal, I suppose.
I didn't find Mackynz to be condescending at all. I think you're taking it too personal.

But anyway, Anthropomorphizing is a no no in my book. This isn't directed at the OP, but in general.
People are always giving human characteristics to an animal. Apples and oranges.....

In my opinion, snakes do not 'love'. Love is a human emotion. We as humans tend to anthropomorphasize animals. We treat them as if they are human even though they are not.
However, Animals may exhibit affection or a similar raw behavior. Animals may have their own version of what we call 'love', but it should not be categorized on the same level as a human as they are not humans....