"White" patterned ball pythons?

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Originally Posted by Marrissa

And now would ghost give a similiar look? I just want the nice white/cream and the black. Not too picky about the pattern. Is Axanthic the only gene that will give me the white and black I'm seeking? Odd to me how spiders hold the white better than pins. I'm so used to horse genetics that BP genetics are all way over my head currently. Thank you for the help!

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Axanthic reduces yellow pigment, which ball pythons have a lot of and its not supposed to touch the black pigment, so the gene does a lot of what your looking for. Besides cleaning up the axanthic, there are super black pastels, they are solid black on top and white on the bottom, no pattern tho. Mix in pied and it makes white patches on the black, thats called the panda pied as mentioned above.

Thanks so much guys! Even though it's a few years off I'm going to start planning. I really appreciate the help! :)

Hmm... Imagine an adult Axanthic Desert Ghost... :O

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Originally Posted by coldbloodaddict

I would suggest not adding Pastel to Axanthic stuff...It's hard for the Axanthic to overcome such a Yellow Morph.

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I think it depends on the individual example, like any morph some are better examples than others, and the super pastel axanthic... yes please.

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Originally Posted by loonunit

The best/easiest way to keep an axanthic light (outside of making a true ghost, which is hard because it's a double recessive) is to add pastel. Axanthic spiders will darken up, but a true zebra bee (axanthic pastel spider) will hold the black-and-white contrast better. Presumably a killer zebra (super pastel axanthic spider) would do even better. You could probably also add fire or vanilla, etc.

You don't want the spider because of the wobble, I assume? Nothing looks like a spider other than a spider, except maybe the woma. And womas sometimes also have a wobble.

Best bet is a pinstripe. Axanthic pinstripes also do lose their silver color as they age. Adding enchi and pastel to the mix would probably do a lot to keep the brown away. I'm not sure, I haven't see any pastel axanthic pinstripes, let alone pastel/enchi/fire/pinstripes? Are they out there?

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The zebra bee looks good, but still a little muddy, adding that second pastel cleans it up exceptionally, really crisp. As for the others, I'd love to see/make them.

I've seen pictures of a few adult axanthic pieds, and yes they stay that elusive silvery grey. There is almost no browning at all. Several breeders here and in the UK have made them now.

Gale

Ok so to get an Axanthic Firefly I would then buy an axanthic and a firefly and cross them together. I'd get a 1/4 chance of fireflies, 1/4 fire, 1/4 pastel, 1/4 normal all het axanthic right? So then I would take that firefly and cross it back to the axanthic (gender permitting of course :oops:) and then once I get them bred them together what's the likelihood of axanthic fireflies? What would I outcross to after a few generations of linebreeding?

I'd also like to go for axanthic pins and axanthic genetic stripe pastel.

So another question I have is I'd prefer more of the marble look (like this http://www.worldofballpythons.com/mo...anthic-pastel/) instead of this http://www.worldofballpythons.com/mo...anthic-pastel/ with the alien/ghost heads. How do you get that?

Male:	Firefly, Het Axanthic (VPI)
Female:	Axanthic (VPI)
Percent	Fraction	Traits
12.5%	1/8	Axanthic (VPI), Firefly
12.5%	1/8	Firefly, Het Axanthic (VPI)
12.5%	1/8	Axanthic (VPI), Pastel
12.5%	1/8	Pastel, Het Axanthic (VPI)
12.5%	1/8	Fire, Axanthic (VPI)
12.5%	1/8	Fire, Het Axanthic (VPI)
12.5%	1/8	Axanthic (VPI)
12.5%	1/8	Het Axanthic (VPI)
View Results Page

Lets say you have the axanthic female or 2. You could start your firefly project and if the axanthic female isn't busy a season, I would just buy a pin het axanthic (which won't cost ya too much) and you can make axanthic pins that season.

As for the axanthic gstripe pastel, now your getting into the fun stuff :) double recessives.

The most direct way is to breed a axanthic to a gstripe with one or the other having pastel. If you are working on a firefly project, you already have a chance of making pastel axanthics, so lets use that for an example.

Male:	Pastel, Axanthic (VPI)
Female:	Genetic Stripe
Percent	Fraction	Traits
50%	1/2	Pastel, Het Axanthic (VPI), Het Genetic Stripe
50%	1/2	Het Axanthic (VPI), Het Genetic Stripe
View Results Page

you would then take the offspring and breed them to each other, at minimum you need a pastel double het to a double het

Male:	Pastel, Het Axanthic (VPI), Het Genetic Stripe
Female:	Het Axanthic (VPI), Het Genetic Stripe
Percent	Fraction	Traits
3.125%	1/32	Axanthic (VPI), Pastel, Genetic Stripe
9.375%	3/32	Pastel, Genetic Stripe, 66% Possible Het Axanthic (VPI)
9.375%	3/32	Axanthic (VPI), Pastel, 66% Possible Het Genetic Stripe
28.125%	9/32	Pastel, 66% Possible Het Axanthic (VPI), 66% Possible Het Genetic Stripe
3.125%	1/32	Axanthic (VPI), Genetic Stripe
9.375%	3/32	Genetic Stripe, 66% Possible Het Axanthic (VPI)
9.375%	3/32	Axanthic (VPI), 66% Possible Het Genetic Stripe
28.125%	9/32	66% Possible Het Axanthic (VPI), 66% Possible Het Genetic Stripe
View Results Page

so yes it is a long term project and you are dealing with many possible hets and statistically going to take a while. But on the way to your goal, you produce a lot of cool things that can help increase your odds once they are muture enough to breed. Example if you produce a axanthic gstripe but miss on the pastel, a pastel double het to an axanthic gstripe would give a 1/8 chance of hitting the pastel axanthic gstripe.

As far as the pattern, you would try to get founding animals that show the trait your looking for and then the babies have a good chance of also displaying it. You could also add a pattern gene like woma but it might screw with the coloring also, I personally don't believe we have any "pattern only" genes, they all seem to change the color a little, even if it is small.

IMO to meet all of your goals, focus on the firefly project first because it produces things that help you with your double recessive project, or even make the double recessive project that much cooler, why not try for firefly axanthic gstripes if you got the animals to do it? :)

So it's definitely the high-contrast black and white look that you like? You don't like crystals or phantom potions or anything like that?

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Originally Posted by loonunit

So it's definitely the high-contrast black and white look that you like? You don't like crystals or phantom potions or anything like that?

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Yep. I think the contrast is stunning. :)