Orangebelly morphs

So then you are saying that black pastel and cinnamon are the same thing, butter and lesser are the same thing, sulfur and fire are the same thing, etc ?
And I would imagine that someone would have had to branch out with OB's I just can't find anything anywhere on it.

Black Pastels and Cinnys are different IMO. I could easily identify a BP from a Cinny. But I believe that Lessers and Butters are the same. Most couldn't pick out one from the other if they were given a box of them.

Maybe you should ask the OB expert himself? Ben would definitely know them best.

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I also believe that black pastels and cinnamons are very different. They each have different pattern and color traits. I've seen what I'd call low quality cinnamons that look like a black pastel but if you have the eye for the pattern differences, they can be told apart.

Butter and Lesser.. That's harder to say what I think. Most butters I've seen look more "buttery" and are less likely to have spots or "eyes" inside the alien heads.. Also more silvery pixelation along the lower sides. Lessers are either more yellow, or more beige, and are more prone to having spots..

When I was breeding Lessers and butters, they, and their offspring were so entirely different looking that I could not have said they were the same gene.

It could be selective breeding, it could be different lines like pastels and how they look so different. For instance, lemons have thinner black markings, brighter yellow coloration, less blushing.. Blondes have tons of blushing in wider markings, flames, and a creamy blonde color.. I think lesser and butter is like that but the black pastel and cinnamon are just too different in too many ways for me to ever believe its that way with them.

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Originally Posted by satomi325

Maybe you should ask the OB expert himself? Ben would definitely know them best.

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^^ BEST ADVICE SO FAR! ^^

Why didn't I think of that?? ;)

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Originally Posted by angeluscorpion

So then you are saying that black pastel and cinnamon are the same thing, butter and lesser are the same thing, sulfur and fire are the same thing, etc ?
And I would imagine that someone would have had to branch out with OB's I just can't find anything anywhere on it.

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I was being facetious but I think you guys get my point.

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Originally Posted by satomi325

Maybe you should ask the OB expert himself? Ben would definitely know them best.

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I plan to tomorrow my curiosity is getting the better of me, thanks for the suggestion

I have seen Albino OB, Black Pastel OB, and Pastel OB. I myself could potentially make Liesen Black Pastel OB, Blonde Pastel OB, Spider OB, and Enchi OB's this upcoming season. Along with possibly making Ivories, Ultra Ivories, and Graphite Ivories.

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Originally Posted by AGoldReptiles

I have seen Albino OB, Black Pastel OB, and Pastel OB. I myself could potentially make Liesen Black Pastel OB, Blonde Pastel OB, Spider OB, and Enchi OB's this upcoming season. Along with possibly making Ivories, Ultra Ivories, and Graphite Ivories.

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Thanks for that info

This year I made ivories and pumas from my orangebelly female by breeding her to a puma male. I got the female from Ben, and she is a graphite sired sibling of a paradox ivory. Orangebellies are just a variant of the yellowbelly, maybe a slightly darker and more orange version, judging by looking at my female. They may have something "extra" going on in that more than one graphite has been produced from this line, but I don't think we understand yet how to make the graphite. I noticed that my ivories had more color than the ivories I made from the regular yellowbellies. They had faint purple and orange tones on their backs and I emailed Ben to ask about that. He noticed that phenomenon too, but said that those ivories turn white just like other ivories in time. (I think he used to call them ultraivories at one time, but abandoned that name since they didn't turn out to be different.)

The pumas I made from the orangebelly seem a little more orange than the other pumas. I think that is just an example of selective breeding since mom is darker and more orange than my other yellowbellies.

Yes OB act the same as YB, again OB is just a different line of YB just like the Goblin is (Ralph's Line of YB).

I produced a Black Pastel Orange Belly last year, and shooting for Mystic Orange Belly this season. (I work with OB)

The only thing that differentiate the OB is that they can potentially produce the Ultra Ivory and Graphite. After talking to Ben a few times he believes that there is another gene attached to the OB and that it could be recessive (explaining why not all OB produce Ultras or Graphites), not sure if his theory has been proved out yet, you would need to contact him to find out more about it.

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Originally Posted by Deborah

Yes OB act the same as YB, again OB is just a different line of YB just like the Goblin is (Ralph's Line of YB).

I produced a Black Pastel Orange Belly last year, and shooting for Mystic Orange Belly this season. (I work with OB)

The only thing that differentiate the OB is that they can potentially produce the Ultra Ivory and Graphite. After talking to Ben a few times he believes that there is another gene attached to the OB and that it could be recessive (explaining why not all OB produce Ultras or Graphites), not sure if his theory has been proved out yet, you would need to contact him to find out more about it.

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Goblins( RDR) and Bling YB ( NERD) are just lines of YB. They don't do anything different than any other YB. Orangebellies have the potential to make something different. Ultras and Graphites, that to me makes them different. Let's use the Ultra as an example. They have a lot if purples and color that fades to the typical Ivory color as they age as stated above. What is going to happen when other genes are in that animal? Will a Pastel Ultra keep it's color better? I think the OB has a lot to be seen yet.

I don't see how it is possible for the Ultras and Graphites to be a recessive trait. OB x YB can make Graphites, so unless that YB happened to be a (Het.) I just don't see it being plausible. Hopefully someday it will all be sorted out.

I have been working with OB's for a few years now. I don't have any YB animals to make any comparisons as for dark, light, orange, or yellow, but I can say that the OB morph is variable just like any other morph. I have produced dark ones, bright ones, ones with more orange and ones with more yellow.

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