i thought i understood genetics...

Father (bumblebee): Normal Gene, Spider Gene
Normal Gene, Pastel Gene


Mothe (normal)r: Normal Gene, Normal Gene
Normal Gene, Normal Gene

Each parent will contribute one gene from each set, not both. So, the father can pass on the mutant copy of the pastel gene, or the normal copy of the gene. It can pass on either the spider gene, or the normal gene, but not both.

The Pastel mutation is not the same gene as the spider mutation. Because pastel and spider are both heterozygous, it means the animal has one normal gene, and one mutant gene, in each set. It will only pass one or the other to its offspring.

Outcome:
Some offspring will be normal (F: Normal Gene, Normal Gene, M: Normal Gene, Normal Gene)

Some offspring will be Pastel: (F: Normal Gene, Normal Gene, M: Pastel Gene, Normal Gene)

Some will be Spider: (F: Normal Gene, Normal Gene, M: Normal Gene, Spider Gene)

Some will be Bumblebee: (F: Normal Gene, Normal Gene, M: Pastel Gene, Spider Gene)

So, what is a super-pastel?

A Super Pastel is: Pastel Gene, Pastel Gene. There is no normal copy of that gene in a super pastel.

If the Mother is normal (Normal Gene, Normal Gene), then the pairing can only produce Pastel Gene, Normal Gene--which is a pastel.

A Killerbee is: Pastel Gene, Pastel Gene
Spider Gene, Normal Gene

So, a killerbee would produce all pastel offspring, but only half of them would be spiders. So, 50% pastels, and 50% bumblebees.

take a look at this http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...Basic-Genetics

This would be an example for a bumblebee, the pastel and spider gene sit on different loci (singular is locus). A locus is a pair of alleles. When babies are coming to be a parent will give one allele from each locus to the baby, and the other parent will do the same, so the baby will have it's own two alleles for each locus.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v5...oser/thing.jpg

So the bumblebee parents can give a spider gene or a normal gene from the spider locus and it can also give a pastel gene or a normal gene from the pastel locus. So there is a chance the baby can get both morph genes, one or the other, or none at all.

Additional helpful hint--think of each morph mutation as affecting a different thing.

For example, a person may have blonde hair AND green eyes. A snake may be pastel AND spider.
The gene that controls blonde hair isn't the same as the one that controls green eyes, so it's possible to have both, one, or neither. :)

People do love to give fancy names to combination morphs, and that can lead to confusion as well. A bumblebee isn't one morph, it's a combination of 2 different morphs.

Co-dominant mutations like pastel can be thought of in the same way as recessive morphs. In a recessive mutation, such as blue eyes in human beings, if one copy of the gene is present, the eyes will not be blue. They carry the gene, but it's masked by the normal copy of the gene they also carry. If 2 copies of the gene are there, then the person has blue eyes--there is no normal copy to mask the blue-eye gene.

In co-dominant mutations (actually incomplete dominant, but we won't go into that), the heterozygous animal looks like a morph if it carries only one copy of the gene--the mutant gene is partially obscured by the normal copy, instead of fully obscured. You can think of it as a 'visual het', or a het with astoundingly strong 'markers'. :) When two copies are present, you get a different look--the mutant gene is fully expressed because there is no normal gene to partially mask it.

how about a blue eye lucy, say a mojave x lesser. are you saying that they are the same and sit at the same location. as they will make mojaves or lessers but no normals or bels? you all explain genetics good so far, figure throw this out so you can take it one step further :)

That's correct, the mojave and lesser genes sit on the same locus. So if your BEL is bred to a normal, it will either give the baby a lesser or a mojave gene (and the other parent is sending only a normal gene), which gives you 50% lessers and 50% mojaves.

ooh you guys are getting tricky. that chart was awesome!