Animal Planet..

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Originally Posted by Tarawr88

I'm not really a fan of animal planet... mostly because of the lack of herp-friendly shows. They make it seem like ALL herps are "evil dangerous creatures". I've yet to see them say anything nice about these creatures.

I understand the "Hots =/= pets", but what about those who don't really keep them as pets, but rather milk them for anti-venom? They attack these people as well-- will they not stop until we're up a creek without a paddle because we no longer have people milking the venom from snakes to make anti-venom? I kinda feel like thats EXACTLY whats going to happen. I guess it IS a thankless job. "Hey, I know you keep hots so you can milk venom from them, but we're going to attack you for keeping exotics... and saving lives of people who get bitten by snakes."

Good going, Animal Planet. Thats the smart thing to do!

As far as should we all be punished for the situation in Florida... No, I sincerely believe that only affects Florida. Its sad, I hate it, but lets face it... these TROPICAL snakes would not survive in most of the US-- hell, I was born and raised in Arkansas... it DOES get cold as hell there in the winter. Like, to the point that if you have dogs that are usually outside, you have to make sure they have fresh hay to sleep in OR bring them into the house-- they won't survive otherwise. And they certainly wouldn't last long up north... I'm barely managing that right now. It gets too cold INSIDE my home at night... I have to put a heater in the room with my snakes to make sure they stay warm enough.

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ANY EXPERIENCED hot keeper will be the FIRST person to tell you that they do not consider hots to be pets. They are specimen, and are not taken lightly. (There are of course very ignorant, often stupid people who are the ubiquitous exception to this rule).

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Originally Posted by Rhasputin

I do want to put it out there that I think it's dumb dumb dumb to own a poisonous animal. I'd never own one, and I think it's dumb for other people to own them, i just don't see a point. But Do I want to stop you from owning one? NO! :D

I don't think it should be anyone's problem what type of animals I KEEP IF I KEEP THEM UNDER CONTROL and they're not harming anyone, and they are healthy an well cared for.

That is all. :)

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I agree. I REALLY want a banded rock rattlesnake, but I now.my limits, and with children going to be in.my house, I'd just never want to chance it. The thing though, is.. I WILL NEVER say people.who keep hots and have all there bite protocols And escape protocols AND there set rules, I see no problem having them as "pets"

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Originally Posted by Crazy4Herps

I think this is a good point. (Although snakes aren't poisonous, they're venomous.) You aren't going to find me with a venomous snake in my house, but as long as keeping any animal doesn't put anyone besides the owner at risk (that includes the animal itself; for example, I do happen to strongly disagree with big cats being kept as pets) I have no argument.

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Again...I agree, I see big cats as one of the most deadly animals you can own. I mean, I get attacked EVERY day by my cats, I've only been bit once by my Burmese And I gad rat blood ob me. I just see those kind of exotics as... "to dangerous for me" but I would never go up to a big cat keeper who houses there animals.with as much love as we do our snakes And tell them "get rid of your cats" I believe we all have to the right to own animals as long as we take care of them correctly.

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Originally Posted by FalconPunch

What the hell could be worse than an alligator in the everglades? Who F-ing cares if snakes move in. People need to chill out about that- catch the damn things and sell them back to us snake-lovers.
Snake lives, They make money, It's not in their precious everglades, and we get a new pet

WIN.WIN.WIN.WIN.

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I think the Burmese pythons are DRASTICALLY over dramatized to what they really are. I will reply more to this in my next reply.. but personally I see no reason as to why we should suffer from laws from a few owners releasing there pets, and other escaping during hurricanes.
Side note... I think our "friends" at PETA are somewhat responsible for releases as well..

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Originally Posted by Mike41793

I agree with you, much of what they put on the channel is complete garbage. They always have the aspca animal rescue show on during the day but they rescue dogs/cats/farm animals 99% of the time. That means either A: Herp owners are really responsible so our animals dont need rescuing or B: Theyre biased towards non-herps or C: a combo of both.
Im pretty sure its a combo of both but I like to think its A.
On a side note I was thinking if the cold snap killed most of the burms in FL then does that mean that the ones that survived are going to continue breeding and produce a generation of burms more tolerant to the cold with the ability to survive at lower temps? Or were the burms that survived sorta just lucky?

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The Burmese that survived were lucky. Most of then were in small caverns ungrounded that you could stand up in. For animals that are tropical And have to thermo regulate to survive be able to suddenly undergo a evolution that would take YEARS to happen.. no, I just can't see it. But I'm not a scientists. :p

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Originally Posted by Emily Hubbard

While I obviously adore snakes, the burm problem in the everglades is not to be made light of. The issue is that that particular ecosystem is not designed to handle another apex predator. The alligators belong there, and the snakes are killing them or competing with them for food. No, it is not the snake's fault that they are there, but it is not a "no big deal" situation.

I think it is important to remember than just because we love and adore a certain animal does not mean it belongs everywhere. The burms DO NOT belong in the everglades, and sadly, they must be removed, usually by deadly force. The bad guy in this situation is not the snakes, but the people who put them there, the snake collectors who are not part of this club of caring hobbyist dedicated to the well being of our animals, but impulse buyers of exotics, people who see a little snake in the pet store window. failing to realize or accept that it will someday be 10, 12, 15 feet long, and who release it when they no longer want to deal with it. It is now a 20 foot invasive species, a nuisance animal because of the carelessness and selfishness of man. All we can do is not be those people, and stand by the responsible burm owners who love their snakes and care for them safely.

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I'm not saying this meanly. K? :p can't really tell through internet text.

Think about this. Do you see feral cats as pets? Think about mow.may thousands roam around in most cities unchecked. We have easily 1,000 here in my town. What gets done about these animals? The same can be said for.dingos in Australia. Are they invasive? Yeah, do we care? Not really they kill multiple different animals they attack people as well. My point to this? We pick and choose what to complain about..

Now to the burms.. in the Everglades I HIGHLY doubt there are 100,000.. even the python hunters said it was no where near that high. From this as well, it is seen most Burmese pythons that produce babies help strengthen the ecosystem with food. To this, adult Burmese eat no where near what "the experts" say they do. Another note for this, adult burms are eaten by alligators.

Trust me, I'm not trying to defend the burms to my death, I just don't believe it's right that people say "kill them all" isn't this animal cruelty? I can't kill a feral cat can I?

It's like being stuck between a rock and a hard place.... either way it's a loose loose situation...

I'm sorry if I sounded like a walking contradiction, I just can't stand all the press the burms have gotten...

I really hope.you see my point and opinion to this, I REALLY don't want a good thread to go south.

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Originally Posted by zeion97

Again...I agree, I see big cats as one of the most deadly animals you can own. I mean, I get attacked EVERY day by my cats, I've only been bit once by my Burmese And I gad rat blood ob me. I just see those kind of exotics as... "to dangerous for me" but I would never go up to a big cat keeper who houses there animals.with as much love as we do our snakes And tell them "get rid of your cats" I believe we all have to the right to own animals as long as we take care of them correctly.

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I disagree. There is a huge difference between correctly caring for a big cat and correctly caring for a snake. The difference is that big cats cannot thrive in a house setting. Many rescue organizations and zoos have done wonderfully at allowing big cats to thrive in captivity. The difference here is that rescue organizations and zoos (at least the good ones) do not view big cats as pets, and they (again, the good ones) minimize human contact with the cats.

The truth is, while the love and care we put into housing and maintaining our snakes may be sufficient for snakes, big cats require much, MUCH more. For one thing, snakes are inactive animals in the wild and can do quite well in appropriately-sized cages. Big cats (in my very firm opinion) should never be kept in a cage. If you examine the size of the territories they establish in the wild, that is simply not something an individual can provide. Not to mention the cruelty of capturing and importing tigers and the like.

"I believe we all have to the right to own animals as long as we take care of them correctly"
I agree with this. I just don't think it is possible to do with big cats.

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Originally Posted by Crazy4Herps

I disagree. There is a huge difference between correctly caring for a big cat and correctly caring for a snake. The difference is that big cats cannot thrive in a house setting. Many rescue organizations and zoos have done wonderfully at allowing big cats to thrive in captivity. The difference here is that rescue organizations and zoos (at least the good ones) do not view big cats as pets, and they (again, the good ones) minimize human contact with the cats.

The truth is, while the love and care we put into housing and maintaining our snakes may be sufficient for snakes, big cats require much, MUCH more. For one thing, snakes are inactive animals in the wild and can do quite well in appropriately-sized cages. Big cats (in my very firm opinion) should never be kept in a cage. If you examine the size of the territories they establish in the wild, that is simply not something an individual can provide. Not to mention the cruelty of capturing and importing tigers and the like.

"I believe we all have to the right to own animals as long as we take care of them correctly"
I agree with this. I just don't think it is possible to do with big cats.

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You're completely correct, I truthfully don't think we should be allowed to have big cats. I just can't bring myself to say to someone who cares for them "sorry you can't own it" it's like saying we can own RTB's but not Burms. We all have our experience with animals and they're are probably a few people on here that own a big cat, but I just don't see why we Pick and choose. Trust me, I agree with you. I.just don't believe it's right for us to say were different from big cat owners. We all are in the same groups weather we own herps or cats, we love our animals. And every day we fight for them. Even though I disagree with the owning of them I can't bring myself to say it's wrong, this is to the point were personal opinion comes in. And even if I disagree with them being "pets" I know there are people who disagree that my snakes are "pets"

Sorry if my wording seems confusing.

I used to watch Animal Planet religiously when I was younger. Over the past few years, the channel has taken a dive and gone into an area of "entertainment" I do not care to watch. For the sake of my blood pressure and the well being of my marriage, I do not watch Animal Planet any more. I get very heated and angry when I watch their shows and my husband is wall I bounce all that off on and that's not fair to him. :P

What we need is more exotics-friendly shows, whether they be on cable or Youtube. The average person that doesn't keep reptiles doesn't understand that the majority of people who keep exotics are not like the people they see on t.v because the only people they are exposed to, are the ones they see on t.v. We need more media out there showing responsible owners.

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Originally Posted by zeion97

You're completely correct, I truthfully don't think we should be allowed to have big cats. I just can't bring myself to say to someone who cares for them "sorry you can't own it" it's like saying we can own RTB's but not Burms. We all have our experience with animals and they're are probably a few people on here that own a big cat, but I just don't see why we Pick and choose. Trust me, I agree with you. I.just don't believe it's right for us to say were different from big cat owners. We all are in the same groups weather we own herps or cats, we love our animals. And every day we fight for them. Even though I disagree with the owning of them I can't bring myself to say it's wrong, this is to the point were personal opinion comes in. And even if I disagree with them being "pets" I know there are people who disagree that my snakes are "pets"

Sorry if my wording seems confusing.

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:gj: I'm totally with you on that.

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Originally Posted by Jay_Bunny

I used to watch Animal Planet religiously when I was younger. Over the past few years, the channel has taken a dive and gone into an area of "entertainment" I do not care to watch. For the sake of my blood pressure and the well being of my marriage, I do not watch Animal Planet any more. I get very heated and angry when I watch their shows and my husband is wall I bounce all that off on and that's not fair to him. :P

What we need is more exotics-friendly shows, whether they be on cable or Youtube. The average person that doesn't keep reptiles doesn't understand that the majority of people who keep exotics are not like the people they see on t.v because the only people they are exposed to, are the ones they see on t.v. We need more media out there showing responsible owners.

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I really wish there were more exotic friendly shows. Whenever I say "I own a 6 foot Burmese python" I get odd stares And on multiple occasions have had people say I need to kill it. One time I told someone "ill do that when you go home And kill your cat" people have no idea about exotics and just go off all the dramatized stories they hear on the news or read online. I really wish there were shows that showed the good aides of exotics and not the bad. I try my best to educate people ob the truth, but the truth is, we can't teach people who are unwilling to learn.

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Originally Posted by Rhasputin

I do want to put it out there that I think it's dumb dumb dumb to own a poisonous animal. I'd never own one, and I think it's dumb for other people to own them, i just don't see a point. But Do I want to stop you from owning one? NO! :D

I don't think it should be anyone's problem what type of animals I KEEP IF I KEEP THEM UNDER CONTROL and they're not harming anyone, and they are healthy an well cared for.

That is all. :)

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Firstly, please get your terminology correct. Secondly, What is the point in owning any reptile, *venomous* or not?

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Originally Posted by zeion97

On a side note... is it right to ban our snakes because of the "problem" in the glades? (Try to keep this to conversation and not a name throwing rant)?

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You have to ask this question? No. The rule will do nothing pragmatic to address Burmese pythons on the ground, with breeding populations thus far confined to only 3 counties in the southern tip of Florida. Besides the USGS report, which as been thoroughly discredited as "unscientific" and "unsuitable for the basis of legislative or regulatory policy" by an independent panel of 11 herpetologists and other well respected scientists, and considering that this federal rulemaking violates the Information Quality Procedures Act and 3 Obama executive orders, what other credible science exists to support it. Burmese pythons in the Everglades are a state of Florida issue thus far confined only to 3 counties in the southernmost tip of Florida. Federal regulations are not needed for what is a localized problem. Period. The state of Florida has already addressed this issue by effectively outlawing Reptiles of Concern (ROC’s). By comparison, both feral cats, and swine are both far more widespread and ecologically destructive “invasive” species worldwide. Even invasive species of plants in Florida such as Brazilian pepper have been proven to have a far more profound impact on the entire ecosystem in which it invades.The apparent fact that H$US (The Humane Society of the United states) favors failed feral cat controls, ignores the issue of rattlesnake roundups and other wildlife abuses for TV and entertainment (i.e. Kentucky Turtleman on Animal planet), and discriminates against the captive bred reptile trade is the very epitome of the misleading and hypocritical nature of the sham of an organization.

There have now been several published papers and research that thoroughly debunk claims made that pythons are capable of inhabiting the southern third of the continental U.S. Do you need me to bring up the links to these studies? Burmese pythons are tropical S.E Asian species, not temperate zone animals. 9 out of 10 pythons died in a S. FL study by Dorcas et all, while all pythons in an Aiken SC study died despite being provided heated artificial refugia (which was a study essentially cheating in the python's favor and they STILL all died). If the USGS report, which the rulemaking is based entirely upon held true, why haven't boa constrictors (which have occurred naturally in Mexico for millions of years) migrated north into the S. United States? Even 95% of the African rock pythons are suspected to have already been extirpated by the weather according to Scott Hardin and FWC exotic species coordinators. Sorry, we won't be seeing any "Man eating super snakes" invading the U.S.A. anytime in the forseeable future.Where is the evidence to support HSUS' claim it makes that pythons are "putting people in danger"? Where is the national epidemic of escaped pythons and other reptiles chasing and terrorizing innocent members of the public? There simply is none, and the fatality rates of these snakes held in captivity over the last 20 years are significantly less than the number killed or maimed by pet dogs and many other domestic animals in the United States one year based on all historical and statistical accounts. Especially when all accounts of Florida FWC and other on the ground officials are stating the contrary?"Scott Hardin, exotic species coordinator for the Florida Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission, said most Everglades pythons are too small to kill people and exist in areas where the primary hazard to people remains the alligator.""Federal environmental assessments have found little evidence of human deaths from Burmese pythons in their native southern Asia. There are fewer pythons than there were three years ago" Hardin says...