Misconceptions - Can we clear this up?

Well, being a breeder, as well as a pet store that buys and sells ball pythons, I personally would never buy from someone who told me they started them on ASF's.
That being said, as long as you are up front to the potential buyer about what it has been fed, then, feel free...
But, with as many picky eater balls as I've had, why even chance the fact that it could get stuck on ASF's?

My personal opinion, if you have a "normal" ball python(don't mean morph), that will eat anything, then there is no problem with switching up the diet, it's actually probably a good idea... However, if you are breeding for future sale, baby ball pythons, why would you chance that it may get stuck?
Just my .02...

I have also had 100% success rate switching hatchlings that were fed or started on ASFs to rats. They have also grown to become great eaters (not ONE of our six holdbacks is a picky eater or refuses rats) and my final goal with all hatchlings whether started on mice or ASFs is to get them on rats before I sell them. I also had a juvenile switch from ASFs to rats. However, I agree, the older BPs haven't switch from ASFs although, I admit, not trying very hard to get them to switch because I have no intention of selling any of them and I breed my own ASFs.

ALSO a side note, it is my experience that a picky eater is a PICKY eater whether its with mice, rats or ASFs. And ASFs are IMO invaluable in this hobby.

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Originally Posted by jasbus

My personal opinion, if you have a "normal" ball python(don't mean morph), that will eat anything, then there is no problem with switching up the diet, it's actually probably a good idea... However, if you are breeding for future sale, baby ball pythons, why would you chance that it may get stuck?
Just my .02...

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Have you ever had a baby ball python that got "stuck"? I have mostly morphs (only a few normals) and none of them got "stuck", even the older snakes. I think the getting stuck idea is not as common as everyone thinks. That is why I started this thread. It seems to be a common thought that feeding a morph ball python will get them "imprinted" on ASF's only, but I have not seen proof yet. Nor, have I seen personal experiences that show anecdotal evidence - just opinion.

And, why would it be good for a normal but not a morph? I would think a morph eating on various rodents would be a good thing too.

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Originally Posted by jasbus

But, with as many picky eater balls as I've had, why even chance the fact that it could get stuck on ASF's?

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All out holdbacks are morphs or hets. I was never worried feeding them ASFs because they are morphs. And if you are in it to breed OR just have a pet BP why would you feed a picky eater rats or mice sporadicly and risk it being underfed rather than giving them ASFs and having big healthy breeders/pets?

The only argument against them in my book is availability. Which is pretty big if your supply isn't reliable. But breeding them is a breeze.


On another note WHY do pet store sell these things for and arm and a leg?!?! I used to get them from a breeder at a show for $2 a piece. The local store sells them for $6-$8!!

Well there has been many cases of "mousers" so it doesn't seem too beyond reason to think that there may be "asf-ers". I'll agree with you that I don't think it would be a problem switching a young ball between rodents, those things are just hardwired to stuff their faces. Not to slight anyone that does feed asfs, but I'll personally just pass an ad by if it mentions "feeding on asfs" or "mouser", as that is not what I feed my snakes. It would also be irresponsible of the seller if they didn't mention that the snake they're selling is feeding on asfs.

It's just one more issue when dealing with ball pythons. With so many breeders, and so many snakes available, it's wise for the consumer to be picky.

i switch everyone over to rat pup as soon as they can eat them. Id start them on them but as we all know theres not much movement with the pinks.

My local petstore ordered 1.2 asfs for us. That group cost us a bit over 45.00 with tax. A rat goes for 8.00. Its pretty rediculous. That is the only reason that I usually pass on ads for asf eaters. To have the small colony just for that 1 specific girl works well. We grow them out and freeze. Luckily she'll take ft so we will always have food for her.

With my collection I keep everyone on Rats and babies are switched over to rats and not sold until then. I would hate it if anyone had an issue going through the same thing we did with the lav girl. So i try and make things easy for others that my babies go to.

No matter what food source it is, I think any ball can get stuck on what they like and know. Older animals are more stuck in their ways than younger ones. I dont think it has anything to do with morph, wild type, its just each individual and what theyve known their entire lives.

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Originally Posted by Don

Have you ever had a baby ball python that got "stuck"? I have mostly morphs (only a few normals) and none of them got "stuck", even the older snakes. I think the getting stuck idea is not as common as everyone thinks. That is why I started this thread. It seems to be a common thought that feeding a morph ball python will get them "imprinted" on ASF's only, but I have not seen proof yet. Nor, have I seen personal experiences that show anecdotal evidence - just opinion.

And, why would it be good for a normal but not a morph? I would think a morph eating on various rodents would be a good thing too.

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By "normal", I meant, a ball python that will eat anything... Not, normal or morph...

Yes, I do have balls that are "stuck". LIke I said, it's not common, but why risk it on baby balls? I mean, if you are breeding, than obviously, you have access to a food source, so why not start them on a diet that anyone can get? Especially, if you plan on selling them... Like I said, this is just my opinion.

I have an 06 albino female, picky eater, had her since she was born, only eat gerbils, won't touch anything else. She has been so small her entire life, that I just bred her this past year(didn't take either)... She's only 12xxgrams, and she's stuck at that weight, won't move...
I have a mojave that will only eat mice. Tears them up, and he's a good eater, but only on mice.
And, a lesser platinum that eats only ASF. So, yes it is common, maybe not as bad as alot of people say, but, it happens.
I mean, you can do what ever you want, but this is just my way of thinking.

I sell baby balls in my store, and as sad as it is, the majority of them are sold to a first time reptile buyer. Personally, I'm not going to risk selling them a picky eater if I can do everything in my power to help it... I want them to enjoy the pet, and not have to worry about where they will get their next meal, should they move or whatever.
And, I will reiterate.... This is not a super common problem.... Just why poke a bear with a stick?

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Originally Posted by Don

Why? Have you had problems switching them over?

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My first clutch hatches in 2-3 weeks, so no, not personally, but why risk it when it's pretty easy to find live/frozen rats? If they won't eat rats I'll go out and buy mice hoppers to feed to them before I feed off my own ASFs. This misconception, true or not, is not going to go away. I don't want "ASF" anywhere near my feeding cards.

Jasbus just reinforced my feelings on this issue in his first post here. It would suck if it takes like 6 months to sell my babies just because their first 2-3 meals were ASF hoppers.

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Originally Posted by Jessica Loesch

I 100% support this post!

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+1

Ok I'm going to weigh in here on this.

• 2008 I hatched out 20 snakes, started them all on mice, 15 out of the 20 took rats after two meals and never looked back. 3 of the remaining 5 took longer to switch over, the last two haven't touched anything but mice from day one
• 2009 I hatched 30 snakes, some started with no problem on rats some took mice all of the switched over to rats after 2 meal's
• 2010 I hatched 30 snakes started every single one of the on ASF hoppers. Every single one of them ate the first time offered and switched to rats after their second meal and did just fine.
• 2011 I've hatched roughly 72 babies some have started on rats first meal some need mice to get going, all of my mousers so far have switched over just fine.

The biggest problem I have is with adults one more than one animal I have seen them go for long fasts and long time rat eaters go literally 6+ months off food ad only come back on after being offered ASF or mice. The problem is then that they seem ,most of the time, to get stuck on them. Now not all mind you but some do seem to get a taste for them and not want anything else. Only after breeding and laying eggs did two of mine switch from eating only ASF for 2+ years to eating rats again.

Babies due to their nature seem to be more eager to switch back and forth the ones that haven't I've notice have been trouble starters, at least for me.

My motto.. Feed them what they'll eat. But don't be shocked if you can't sell a mouser only snake or an ASF only snake.