Feeding Mice VS Rats

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Originally Posted by AK907

I feed rats only. Rats are more nutritious. You may not notice a big difference at first, but after a few feedings the difference really shows. They are fatter and healthier. It sucks having to feeding multiple mice to get the same amount of nutrition anyways. Why anyone would feed mice to ball pythons is beyond me.

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Keep in mind majority of breeders start non holdbacks on Mice as their cheaper and easier for the customer to get their hands on. Rats are expensive and not always easily assessable in every city.

If a customer wants me to move them off mice to f/t rats I will do so.

Im a strong believer that there is nutritional differences among prey items

What I mean is.. if you feed a BP (in this case) mice from the day its born and keep it on mice its entire life, then get another BP and feed it rats for its whole life. I would bet money that the rat fed BP will be bigger

I learnt this with boas a long time ago. I realized that mouse fed RTB's are TINY compared to my RTB Powder at just about the same age. Why is that? Well because I have always fed her a nice big juicy healthy rat. I only had to feed mice on two occasions and I dont plan to ever do it again.

What else did I learn about prey size in relation to RTB's size? If a RTB is kept on rats its entire life it will (Remember.. there are exceptions!) stay smaller infact MUCH smaller than a boa that has been fed on rabbits.

My reasoning for saying that is because I have seen all the threads on various forums about the INSANE growth spurt a boa can go through when it is fed on rabbits. I once saw a thread where a female boa got switched over to rabbits and then a year or two later I saw an update and she had grown from 7 foot to 9 - 10 foot.

I have seen plenty of evidence to convince me that certain prey items are better nutritionally than others

Thanks everyone! I wish I had never bought a mouse to feed my BP! I thought he wouldnt know the difference and he would eat anything I was so wrong!! So I have gotten another rat pup and he should be good and hungry by now I am hoping he takes it!! If not I will sent with that mouse I still have stashed in the freezer :) wish me luck :please:

I suspect gram per gram, a rodent is a rodent...

While I surely believe that different foods will have different nutritional values, I just don't think that mice vs rats, or even rats vs rabbits, is enough of a difference to change their nutritional value (other than mass of the prey item).

Breeder mice are easier to deal with but the mouse has to be older to be of a usable mass. Rat breeders are more work to keep but their offspring can be used as food at a much younger age (compared to mice).

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Originally Posted by AK907

I feed rats only. Rats are more nutritious. You may not notice a big difference at first, but after a few feedings the difference really shows. They are fatter and healthier. It sucks having to feeding multiple mice to get the same amount of nutrition anyways. Why anyone would feed mice to ball pythons is beyond me.

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Ive fed both my BPS for 20 years on just two mice every two weeks and theyre perfectly healthy, they have great sheds, perfect poops and have been alive for 20 years and weigh over 4 lbs each . Rats do have more calcium in theyre bones . But adult mice have less hair and a lot less fat compaired to rats .I say either or can be a great thing . I use adult mice with calcium spray and ive never had any isses . As to your comment towards rats vs rabbits . Its pretty obvious that if you feed a snake bigger food it'll get bigger to be able to eat its food better . Ad well as a snake never stops growing so technically its always going to have growth spirts .

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Originally Posted by kitedemon

There is a bit of nutritional difference but not a massive one the problem will come when he is bigger, for example I have a 1600 gm male that would need 160 gm a meal assuming I can get 50 gm (large mice) That is 5 or 6 a feeding, it just gets complicated at that point. A feeding snake is always a good thing there are mouse feeders out there but they are not as common. I'd try to switch but take it really slow scent first and than start pinkies and go from there.

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Just to address the elephant in the room. A BP that is 1500g should be taking prey items much larger than 150g. That is following the 10% rule, which is only applicable to hatchlings. I have balls that are only 200g taking small rats. Most people seem to underfeed their BP's.

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Zombie Thread folks...

The differences are nearly identical except on fat content. You have to compare animals of the same size.
An adult mouse is not going to be the same as an adult rat. But a 10 gram mouse is going to be nearly the same as a 10 gram rat.
The only real benefits of feeding rats is that you just have to feed one rat to compared to multiple mice.
It's more of a convenience factor than higher nutritional value.


Nutrient Composition of Whole Vertebrate Prey by RodentPro:
Adult mice (>10g)
- Kcal/g =5.25
- Crude protein % = 55.8
- Crude fat % =23.6

Rats (10-50g)
- kcal/g = 5.55
- Crude protein % = 56.1
- Crude fat % = 27.5

http://www.rodentpro.com/qpage_articles_03.asp

Whole prey according to the USDA(page 14 of their PDF provided below):
Adult mice (>10g)
- Kcalorie/g =5.77
- Crude protein % = 56.9
- Crude fat % = 23.5

Rats (10-50g)
- kcalorie/g = 5.67
- Crude protein % = 60.3
- Crude fat % = 26

http://www.nal.usda.gov/awic/zoo/Who...nal02May29.pdf

Additional data found on a non scientific source:
Adult mice (>10g)
- kcal/g = 5.25
- Crude protein % = 55.8
- Crude fat % = 23.6

Rats (10-50g)
-kcal/g =5.55
- crude protein % =56.1
- crude fat % = 27.5

http://www.leedspetshops.co.uk/nutri...snakes-page-69

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Originally Posted by Expensive hobby

Just to address the elephant in the room. A BP that is 1500g should be taking prey items much larger than 150g. That is following the 10% rule, which is only applicable to hatchlings. I have balls that are only 200g taking small rats. Most people seem to underfeed their BP's.

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I disagree. Most people here actually overfeed their snakes.
A small rat(80-150g) is perfectly fine for an adult. They have a slower metabolism than growing hatchlings.
I feed all my adult males small rats. Females under 2000g also get small rats. The bigger gals get mediums.
And none of my snakes are thin. They are actually on the chunky side.

This thread is almost 3 years old... haha

I know it's an old thread but I really have to address this.

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Originally Posted by Expensive hobby

A BP that is 1500g should be taking prey items much larger than 150g.

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Really?

How many adult BP do you have? How many 200, 250 or even 400 grams rats have you been feeding?

I have females well over 2000, 2500, 3000 and even one at 4000 grams and they never eat anything bigger then a 120 gram rat , 150 at the very most.

Can they take larger rats, sure they can, it's more risky when feeding live but additionally I can tell you that based on my experience, if you feed a large rat not even 10% of their body weight (less say a 200 grams rats to a 4000 grams female) , the animal will be sluggish for days, and likely to refuse food for a week or two after feeding. Feeding smaller prey weekly allow animals to eat with more consistency.

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Most people seem to underfeed their BP's.

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Quite the opposite BP in captivities get more food then they would ever get in the wild, they are far from being underfed.

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Originally Posted by Deborah

I know it's an old thread but I really have to address this.
Really?

How many adult BP do you have? How many 200, 250 or even 400 grams rats have you been feeding?

I have females well over 2000, 2500, 3000 and even one at 4000 grams and they never eat anything bigger then a 120 gram rat , 150 at the very most.

Can they take larger rats, sure they can, it's more risky when feeding live but additionally I can tell you that based on my experience, if you feed a large rat not even 10% of their body weight (less say a 200 grams rats to a 4000 grams female) , the animal will be sluggish for days, and likely to refuse food for a week or two after feeding. Feeding smaller prey weekly allow animals to eat with more consistency.

Quite the opposite BP in captivities get more food then they would ever get in the wild, they are far from being underfed.

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Actually I don't have very many adult BP's. Just adult Retics, adult Burns, adult Anacondas, and adult Boas.

Obviously different animals but let's say for example my biggest retic is 35lbs and over 12' long. Going by the 10% rule she would only be taking 3.5lb rabbits. Way under sized for her. If I let her she would eat two-three 6-7lb rabbits.

Retics take a little bigger prey than BP'S but it's the same concept. And all of my snakes are lean and athletic. Very fast and agile.

Seems like a lot of BP owners feed so small you can't even tell the snake eats. Too many people get hung up on the Golden 10% rule. Obviously that rule doesn't always work.

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