Why would a pet store be selling an ADULT BP?(MN if you want to rescue it)

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Originally Posted by Superpop

I know I said I would wait off in my last post but...THANK YOU!

I won't hold off! I will call today.

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well i know i would i threatened a PETco manager i was gonna call them and about 30 minutes or so later they fixed the problem so sometimes its just ignorant workers more than anything but yes calling the ASPCA is for the best i would rather have the store in trouble than have that snake suffer for their incompetence

Are you kidding me? Is this a joke? Someone who admits that they have very little experience with this species is threatening the reputation and livelihood of a business owner because he took in an unwanted animal?

And so you want to report them to privately run organizations who are actively trying to end the herp keeping hobby?

I think you need to step back and take another look at what you are doing. There are far too many people in this world today who think they have the right to tell others what to do despite having little knowledge themselves.

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Originally Posted by Superpop

This week my boyfriend and I went and purchased some hoppers for our BP at a petland store. We discovered an adult BP there(which was not there 2 weeks earlier) going through a bad shed and honestly it was living in deplorable conditions!

It had no temp or humidity gauges and had a tiny shelter that there is no way it could fit itself in. I know BPs like tight secure hides but there is no way an adult BP could even curl up in the hide they had for it. The water dish was also tiny as hell.

We are new-ish owners to our BP and have had issues with maintaining a proper home for our snake but due to the help from some of the members on here I feel we have a good habitat for our snake. If we have more issues obviously we will bring them up here or take our snake to a vet.(but this issue isn't out OUR SNAKE)

My BF and I actually talked about buying the adult BP from petland because we felt sorry for it.(and I also feel damn bad about all the stray cats running around our neighborhood) We decided we don't want 2 snakes though.
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Anyway I have 2 purposes for starting this thread:

1. Why would a pet store be selling an ADULT Ball Python?(seems stange to me)

2. If you want to rescue it:

2123 Old Hudson Road
Saint Paul, MN 55119
(651) 731-0556

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Why would so many people want to take such extreme measures without knowing any facts. The OP said the snake wasn't there 2 weeks ago. So maybe the snake was just returned to the store? What if it came into the store in the exact state that she saw it? Maybe the store is actually doing something good for the snake? Do you know if the snake is being abused? No, you do not. She also admits that she's new to snake ownership, so what makes you think the conditions are that bad? I don't believe the OP said anything about the snake being underfed, rat bitened, or any other condition that would indicate abuse. It sounds to me that she just didn't like the setup where the snake was being housed and it was going through a bad shed. A bad shed can be experienced by any snake owner. Do you call the ASPCA on all of us? As far as the enclosure and hide being too small, maybe the pet store doesn't have any enclosures set up to house an adult Ball. But they are doing the best they can with what they have.

The only thing I have a problem with is the QT procedure. The snake should be in a back room until it has been proven to not have any issues. Not sold until it's out of QT.

Just one man's opinion!
Jim Smith

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Originally Posted by MarkS

Are you kidding me? Is this a joke? Someone who admits that they have very little experience with this species is threatening the reputation and livelihood of a business owner because he took in an unwanted animal?

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you are taking this out of context first of all a pet store who sells every supply you would need to care for a Ball Python cant care for them that is the joke a down right shame and if they can start a business and deal in these "exotic" animals then they should know how to care for them

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And so you want to report them to privately run organizations who are actively trying to end the herp keeping hobby?

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so you would rather have the snake suffer and possibly die because the owner mistreated it? trust me you call the police or animal control they will tell you to call the ASPCA so there is no avoiding calling them

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I think you need to step back and take another look at what you are doing. There are far too many people in this world today who think they have the right to tell others what to do despite having little knowledge themselves.

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i might not know much but after reading even one care sheet its VERY obvious when they aren't being cared for properly ESPECIALLY a pet store owner who deals with them every day should know how to care for them so yes defiantly call the ASPCA
so think before you come in here and bash people for doing what IS right for the animal unless maybe you want to go to that store and rescue the animal and then go to EVERY store across the USA or the ENTIRE world and rescue every single one who is being mistreated...

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Originally Posted by j_h_smith

Why would so many people want to take such extreme measures without knowing any facts. The OP said the snake wasn't there 2 weeks ago. So maybe the snake was just returned to the store? What if it came into the store in the exact state that she saw it? Maybe the store is actually doing something good for the snake? Do you know if the snake is being abused? No, you do not. She also admits that she's new to snake ownership, so what makes you think the conditions are that bad? I don't believe the OP said anything about the snake being underfed, rat bitened, or any other condition that would indicate abuse. It sounds to me that she just didn't like the setup where the snake was being housed and it was going through a bad shed. A bad shed can be experienced by any snake owner. Do you call the ASPCA on all of us? As far as the enclosure and hide being too small, maybe the pet store doesn't have any enclosures set up to house an adult Ball. But they are doing the best they can with what they have.

The only thing I have a problem with is the QT procedure. The snake should be in a back room until it has been proven to not have any issues. Not sold until it's out of QT.

Just one man's opinion!
Jim Smith

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Very much agreed upon as i stated in a previous post she should check the store Monday before contacting the ASPCA but as i also stated its a pet store that deals with these animals there is absolutely no reason that snake shouldn't be properly cared for and as for not having a hide big enough for an adult BP 5 minutes of someones time and a 12 pack soda box could fix that not permanent of course but it would suffice until either sold or a bigger hide was found but i still want to call shenanigans on that because it is a pet store even most Mom and Pop shops sell big enough hides

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Originally Posted by Byrdie

you are taking this out of context first of all a pet store who sells every supply you would need to care for a Ball Python cant care for them that is the joke a down right shame and if they can start a business and deal in these "exotic" animals then they should know how to care for them

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And you know this how? Stop talking about your "RESCUE", we're talking about the OP and that snake. Do you know anything about the situation other than what someone with little experience has said? Stop trying to help. You could very sell cause more harm than good with that type of recommendations.

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so you would rather have the snake suffer and possibly die because the owner mistreated it? trust me you call the police or animal control they will tell you to call the ASPCA so there is no avoiding calling them

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How do you know the snake is suffering. It's in a small enclosure, so what. At least it's there and not released into the wild during these cold weather times. Yeah, that would be better, wouldn't it? Nowyour advocating calling the police? What's up with that? Are you insane. Stop with this, you are doing more harm than good.

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i might not know much but after reading even one care sheet its VERY obvious when they aren't being cared for properly ESPECIALLY a pet store owner who deals with them every day should know how to care for them so yes defiantly call the ASPCA
so think before you come in here and bash people for doing what IS right for the animal unless maybe you want to go to that store and rescue the animal and then go to EVERY store across the USA or the ENTIRE world and rescue every single one who is being mistreated...

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Okay, you do admit it, you don't know much, so stop trying to sound like you do. Your advice is dangerous in so many ways. The ASPCA is an organization that would have all pet ownership made illegal. Many in their organization don't know anything about snakes. Please do a search on this group. They are not your friend.

Do you know anything about real world situations? Go ahead call the ASPCA, have them intervene. That will teach the owner, he'll never take any another adoptin of another reptile. That's good. Now what do you want to do with the reptiles that are no longer being cared for by pet stores after they've been abandoned by their owners?

With people like you we don't need enemies. Think before you make comments on things you don't have a complete understanding about.

Jim Smith

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Originally Posted by Byrdie

Very much agreed upon as i stated in a previous post she should check the store Monday before contacting the ASPCA but as i also stated its a pet store that deals with these animals there is absolutely no reason that snake shouldn't be properly cared for and as for not having a hide big enough for an adult BP 5 minutes of someones time and a 12 pack soda box could fix that not permanent of course but it would suffice until either sold or a bigger hide was found but i still want to call shenanigans on that because it is a pet store even most Mom and Pop shops sell big enough hides

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Are you kidding me? This is all about the snake not having the proper sized hide? You want to call the ASPCA because this snake doesn't have a properly sized hide?

Pathetic,
Jim Smith

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Originally Posted by Byrdie

you are taking this out of context first of all a pet store who sells every supply you would need to care for a Ball Python cant care for them that is the joke a down right shame and if they can start a business and deal in these "exotic" animals then they should know how to care for them

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My point is, HOW do YOU know it's not being cared for properly? You're taking the word of someone who admits that they have limited knowledge. Have you seen the animal? Would you even know what to look for if you had?

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so you would rather have the snake suffer and possibly die because the owner mistreated it? trust me you call the police or animal control they will tell you to call the ASPCA so there is no avoiding calling them

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Who says it's going to die? You have NO clue how this snake is actually being kept, and yet you're saying that the pet store should be reported to an animal rights group.

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i might not know much but after reading even one care sheet its VERY obvious when they aren't being cared for properly ESPECIALLY a pet store owner who deals with them every day should know how to care for them so yes defiantly call the ASPCA
so think before you come in here and bash people for doing what IS right for the animal unless maybe you want to go to that store and rescue the animal and then go to EVERY store across the USA or the ENTIRE world and rescue every single one who is being mistreated...

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There are many care sheets out there that have bad information and there are many different ways to keep an animal so that it's healthy and well cared for. I've been keeping reptiles of various species for over 20 years, I've been keeping ball pythons in general for over 10, I've been involved in reptile rescue for over 10 years as well and I wouldn't ever recommend reporting someone to the ASPCA on the word of someone who admits that they don't know very much about them. That's just plain irresponsible.

I would strongly recommend that you spend several YEARS getting to know these animals and learning from them before attempting to give out advice.

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Ball pythons typically fairly shy and reclusive nocturnal animals and appreciate a good dark place to curl up and feel safe. It is best to provide two adequate hides in your BPs enclosure – one on the warm end and one on the cooler end so that it does not have to make a choice between regulating its body temperature and feeling secure (to their own detriment these snakes will sacrifice warmth in favor of a hide).

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Straight from the Caresheet

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Maintaining proper temperatures is essential to keeping your ball python healthy – failure to do so can lead to a host of issues from poor feeding to potentially lethal respiratory infections. For this reason you want to make sure you are able to measure the temperatures accurately. The sticker-type thermometers used in aquariums, and the little dials usually found in pet stores are routinely inaccurate and do little more than measure the temps of the glass to which they are adhered. Do yourself and your ball python a favor and invest in a digital thermometer. One of the most cost-effective and easily available is the Accu-Rite digital thermometer/hygrometer combo available at large stores such as Wal-Mart. These retail for less than $15 and include a probe making it possible to monitor the warm side and cool side temps as well as the humidity levels all simultaneously.

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again straight from the caresheet

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What can I do to help?
There are many ways you can help end the exotic pet trade:

* Do not buy exotic animals, including certain birds and reptiles, from dealers or pet shops.
* Refuse to patronize stores and websites that sell exotic pets.
* Educate family and friends about the animal welfare problems and safety concerns related to keeping exotic animals.
* Do not visit roadside zoos and menageries that breed or display animals for profit. Take a more active role in helping to end the exotic pet trade by working with the ASPCA to pass legislation that prohibits the sale or keeping of exotic animals. Stay up-to-date about current legislation to ban exotic pets by joining the ASPCA Advocacy Brigade.

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that is Straight from the ASPCA website this i knew i know that they openly fight Exotic pet trade but let me ask you who do you call to report animal Abuse? the Ghostbusters? i think not

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Are you kidding me? This is all about the snake not having the proper sized hide? You want to call the ASPCA because this snake doesn't have a properly sized hide?

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that's not it at all all i said was a snake who isn't properly cared for can and will die everyone knows stress can kill a snake it's mentioned a thousand times on this website and Ball Pythons are notorious hiders it's in their nature it makes them feel secure unstressed and happy giving a BP a small hide that it can't completely conceal itself in in a glass tank there is no question it's going to be stressed out and any "Newbie" can spot a bad Husbandry She even mentioned that she had received alot of help from this forum so taking her word that the snake was ill cared for after her going through the same problem isn't hard to grasp for anyone with half a brain

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I would strongly recommend that you spend several YEARS getting to know these animals and learning from them before attempting to give out advice.

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So your saying it takes several YEARS to spot bad husbandry? no i think not i might not be an "Expert" i doubt anyone here is but anyone on this site could spot "Deplorable conditions" and bad husbandry

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With people like you we don't need enemies. Think before you make comments on things you don't have a complete understanding about.

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So your saying because i care for the well being of a snake and wish it was better taken care of I'm a monster? an "enemy" to the Reptile world and your telling me to "think before commenting" maybe you should take some of your own advice

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Originally Posted by Byrdie

that's not it at all all i said was a snake who isn't properly cared for can and will die everyone knows stress can kill a snake it's mentioned a thousand times on this website and Ball Pythons are notorious hiders it's in their nature it makes them feel secure unstressed and happy giving a BP a small hide that it can't completely conceal itself in in a glass tank there is no question it's going to be stressed out and any "Newbie" can spot a bad Husbandry She even mentioned that she had received alot of help from this forum so taking her word that the snake was ill cared for after her going through the same problem isn't hard to grasp for anyone with half a brain

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Let me talk really slowly so you will understand. You do not know if the snake is being abused. You do not know. You may think you know, but you haven't seen the snake, the enclosure, nor talked to the owner of the pet store.
So how can you be so sure this animal needs to be rescued by the ASPCA?

You don't know.

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So your saying it takes several YEARS to spot bad husbandry? no i think not i might not be an "Expert" i doubt anyone here is but anyone on this site could spot "Deplorable conditions" and bad husbandry

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It does take some time AFTER you think you know it all, to actually know you don't. Particularly from several thousands miles away. Again, how do you know that the snake is being cared for in "Deplorable conditions"? You don't. so stop trying to paint a bad picture when you are clearly sitting in a dark room.

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So your saying because i care for the well being of a snake and wish it was better taken care of I'm a monster? an "enemy" to the Reptile world and your telling me to "think before commenting" maybe you should take some of your own advice

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No, but you are spewing bad mojo. Maybe if you had seen the condition of the snake or know of the pet store, we could take your recommendations more seriously. But since you seem to think you know what's best for an animal 2 thousand miles away and you know nothing about the situation other than by what a self described newbie described, we are not going to agree with you. Since you seem to know what's best, I'll leave you so you may better serve the reptile community.

But a little hint, by your own postings, you have shown many times that you are a newbie and do not completely understand.

Good Day!
Jim Smith