Culling Healthy Animals

Personally I would rather quit breeding all together than cull healthy animals simply because they are as you called them “ugly” ……….but again that might be just me :rolleyes:

There is a difference between breeding for food and doing what you are doing. You are using the breeding for food as a justification, if that make you feel better about it, good for you but what you do is not breeding for food, you are breeding and disposing of what you consider not being worth your time.

And I will add you can do whatever YOU want I am not hear to tell people what they should do with THEIR animals howeer personnally I would never support someone who does this which means no business from me.

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Originally Posted by MsPrada

I'd like to know why you would have no say so when its your animals to give, and where is your proof that low market value=low quality of life.

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I actually think that the people that spend $20 bucks on a normal male at an expo are buying a pet. They might actually get taken better care of in the long run.

I know of a few people that breed snakes to feed off to king cobras and corals that they can not get to switch to rats. I see nothing wrong with that. But alot of people want to get into snakes for the get rich quick theme and then they find thereselves with 100 pythons that they can not sell. And thats just something that you need to consider before you ever put anything together to lock up.

It sounds like you're expecting everyone to share your philosophy on "responsible" breeding. :confused: You don't want an open debate...you want to convince everyone that what you're doing is "responsible." Sorry, though...MOST of the folks who participate here (and on sites like this one) have a lot more respect for life than that.

You accuse them of being irresponsible because they don't choose the cheap and easy way out of raising, feeding, and marketing the "undesirables" in their clutches? Seriously???

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Originally Posted by MsPrada

I'd like to know why you would have no say so when its your animals to give, and where is your proof that low market value=low quality of life.

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You don't have to be a genious to figure this out. The price of something in dollars is a fairly good indicator of how popular (wanted) something is. I am not saying that normals don't make excellent pets, or that you should not give these animals away. All I am saying is that flooding the marketplace with them doens't do them, or us, any good. It's not a money thing, it's a "whats best for the animals" thing.

Any math nerds out there? I wish I could figure this out, but I am not a math guy. If you go back 20 years, and figure the estimated numbers of normal ball pythons that have come into the countryeach year, and still do...then add to it how many are produced each year...then figure that the average lifespan across the board should be 12 years (they can live for twice that, so to include for early death due to disease and accidents) how many balls pythons should be in the US today? I woud guess that it's tens of Millions, if not more. And those would be adults over 3 years old..not counting babies.

Do you really think there are that many? What do you think happened to them all? They are not valued they way you and I as snake nerds value them, and they are released into the wild (HR669 fighters), neglected, or flatly killed would be my assumption.

S~

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Originally Posted by JLC

It sounds like you're expecting everyone to share your philosophy on "responsible" breeding. :confused: You don't want an open debate...you want to convince everyone that what you're doing is "responsible." Sorry, though...MOST of the folks who participate here (and on sites like this one) have a lot more respect for life than that.

You accuse them of being irresponsible because they don't choose the cheap and easy way out of raising, feeding, and marketing the "undesirables" in their clutches? Seriously???

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No not at all. I am saying don't beat me up when I am doing what I think is better for the animals and the hobby. A debate means you guys argue your points, and I argue mine. I am supposed to try to convince you...that my job as the debator.

And I think the easy way is to take all your unwanted animals and blow them out for $10 to every kid who probalby wants a pythons when he's 15...but when he's 20...he can't get rid of it...then what happens? Thats all I am saying...there is life for these animals after they leave your possesion..that doesn't make you less responsible for them...you created them. So what happens to them begins, and ends, because of you.

S~

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Originally Posted by ShawnC

it's a "whats best for the animals" thing.

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On what planet is death better for a living creature than life?

Blessings,

-adam

I could swing both ways on this issue. I understand Adam's point and I understand the OP's point.

Pertaining to the OP post: Back when I used to keep Burms, my number one source of food was from a rabbit breeder. Not just any rabbit breeder, she bred for show. She felt that these animals had no worth to her if they weren't show quality(can you blame her). She was so caught up with maintaining show quality animals that she had no time for average looking animals, as long as the animal served life in some way it was ok with her.

As for Adams arguement: Why would you breed animals if you didn't have room in your heart for every single one of them? I myself, have created a place in my heart for every single one of my animals.

In conclusion, I feel that if you choose beautiful animals in the beginning, the majority of your offspring will have desireable traits. Especially if you choose to breed animals that you like, not what others like. You can't help but have some kind of bond with all of them. On the other hand, if you have other animals that NATURALLY prey on items that you are producing, then, why not give them a treat every now and then?

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Originally Posted by ShawnC

You don't have to be a genious to figure this out. The price of something in dollars is a fairly good indicator of how popular (wanted) something is. I am not saying that normals don't make excellent pets, or that you should not give these animals away. All I am saying is that flooding the marketplace with them doens't do them, or us, any good. It's not a money thing, it's a "whats best for the animals" thing.

Any math nerds out there? I wish I could figure this out, but I am not a math guy. If you go back 20 years, and figure the estimated numbers of normal ball pythons that have come into the country, and still do...then add to it how many are produced each year...then figure that the average lifespan across the board should be 12 years (they can live for twice that, so to include for early death due to disease and accidents) how many balls pythons should be in the US today? I woud guess that it's tens of Millions, if not more. And those would be adults over 3 years old..not counting babies.

Do you really think there are that many? What do you thinkhappens to them all? They are not valued they way you and I as snake nerds value them, and they are let go, neglected, or flatly killed would be my assumption.

S~

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Wow. Are you insinuating that my intelligence is low because I do NOT share your opinions? Because I've personally seen normals that are treated well? Again, under your logic if someone spends less on something they don't care for it as much? So, I pay $10 for a blender that does the same thing as a $50 one and I treat it like junk? Thats your logic, not mine. A normal to ME and LOTS of other people, who you apparently just don't know, does the same as a morph if its for a pet. Its a snake, its a BP, it has a great personality and is still very BEAUTIFUL, and we can pay less for it. Don't try and force your logic on me or anyone else just because you don't have the proof I asked for.

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Originally Posted by ShawnC

who probalby wants a pythons when he's 15...but when he's 20...he can't get rid of it...then what happens?

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Where I come from, responsible breeders let their customers know that any animal they produce is welcome back at any point. Selling animals comes with moral responsibilities and making sure that animals you produce always have a home must be at the top of the list.

You produced them, and inevitably you're responsible for their lives ... forever.

Blessings,

-adam