Kalatoa 100% Pure SD Retic Progression (Pic heavy...)

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Originally Posted by jmcrook

Chatting more on the phone with my vet. She’s been talking about Phyllis with another exotics expert and they both seem curious if she’s just still hungry. She didn’t think Phyllis seemed overweight when I brought her in, which is a relief to me. I should have a box of 4-6lb rabbits showing up this week. One of them would be the equivalent of 5 leaner meatier rats all in one shot. Gotta find a local source though. Rodent pro ain’t cheap and monster feeders never responded after I placed an order. I won’t beg anyone to take my business if they are fine without it.

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Hmmmmmmm,,,,

And that's how I ended my quest with Monster Cages.

That's a bummer, but I am not surprised.

Just refused food for the first time in her life. And when she ate last week she didn’t even strike.
Hrmmm...


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Originally Posted by jmcrook

Just refused food for the first time in her life. And when she ate last week she didn’t even strike.
Hrmmm...


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Video or it didnt happen lol.

Well i dont really find it surprising with all the meds she is on. Rosey refused for her first time in like 6 years when she was on fortaz injections.

Snakes are weird. Today, i went to feed Gina and she acted like she didnt want food. Then the second i started to move the weaned rat away from her, she went bananas and lunged at it lol. And Luna finally ate a rat. Took me waiting for 3 weeks for her to get good and hungry and then she still struck it, coiled it and then smelled in and got scared. So it seems with her, if you come at her with a rat, she freaks out but if you lay it on a piece of cardboard, she will come over and eat it.

Then there is Dottie who hasnt eaten for 6 months yet just shed last night.....

And she’s still prowling the cage and still pushing. I could very well lose my mind at any moment with this activity anymore. I don’t know that I can keep dealing with this if this is how keeping this animal going to be.


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Originally Posted by jmcrook

And she’s still prowling the cage and still pushing. I could very well lose my mind at any moment with this activity anymore. I don’t know that I can keep dealing with this if this is how keeping this animal going to be.


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Man that sucks. I think the only thing you havent tried is a different style cage or maybe a christmas tree tub.

As much as i hate to say it, maybe it might be time to think about taking Daniel up on his offer to buy back Phyllis except that shipping her Delta is going to be kind of spendy. Then throw Gerald in the T25 and the boa in the T10.

There comes a point that you just gotta throw in the towel for the benefit of you your sanity and Phyllis' face. Although i know how hard that can be.....as you know.

I talked to a breeder about this and went through the full details and let him read most of the post. He said if a female is pushing like this the only thing that will help is food, food, and more food. Not saying he is correct but was his opinion. He said that he had one girl that was an exception and she was looking to breed. She was the only one he ever saw that pushed to breed.

I am not sure with everything and wish you the best. Keep caring for her. Get her well as you can. You can figure it out I am sure.

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Originally Posted by Skyrivers

I talked to a breeder about this and went through the full details and let him read most of the post. He said if a female is pushing like this the only thing that will help is food, food, and more food. Not saying he is correct but was his opinion. He said that he had one girl that was an exception and she was looking to breed. She was the only one he ever saw that pushed to breed.

I am not sure with everything and wish you the best. Keep caring for her. Get her well as you can. You can figure it out I am sure.

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Totally disagree.
Typical thought process of breeders that pump females to the gills. She is an adult and fed almost every 4 days. Some mammals in the wild don’t even eat that often.

Some retics just push. The fact JM can open the cage and she sits and chills signals something.
More and more food is a bandage that will cause another problem down the road.

She’s in good condition and has been cared for perfectly IMO.

Feeding stops pushing because of diverted energy to digestion.

That’s not the answer especially every 4 days.

If he was under fed she’d look a lot different.

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Originally Posted by Gio

Totally disagree.
Typical thought process of breeders that pump females to the gills. She is an adult and fed almost every 4 days. Some mammals in the wild don’t even eat that often.

Some retics just push. The fact JM can open the cage and she sits and chills signals something.
More and more food is a bandage that will cause another problem down the road.

She’s in good condition and has been cared for perfectly IMO.

Feeding stops pushing because of diverted energy to digestion.

That’s not the answer especially every 4 days.

If he was under fed she’d look a lot different.

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I was just relaying information. I don't think he is doing anything wrong. I agree Kalatoa is healthy and looks great.

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Originally Posted by Skyrivers

I was just relaying information. I don't think he is doing anything wrong. I agree Kalatoa is healthy and looks great.

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I know. I saw you were just passing info. Not really directing that at you. More so at the idea that reptiles of this type are in need of constant food.

Hope you didn’t take offense.

Finally got the rest of my Ceftazidime for Phyllis from the vet. She hates all of this so much but is being as good a sport as she can. Also going into shed right now. Hoping for some good healing action during her shed cycle.
Also, Animal Plastics FINALLY got back to me almost a month after asking for a quote on a modular 8’ cage. They won’t/can’t do expandable/connecting cages. Guess I’ll eventually build Phyllis a mammoth enclosure 8’x3’x2’.


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Seems very strange as your not asking for some crazy design.

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Originally Posted by Stearns84

Seems very strange as your not asking for some crazy design.

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Right?! I think it has more to do with their current work load and lead times. I’d love to continue supporting their business but I want an 8’ cage and there’s no way in hell I can get that into it out of the snake room once assembled. Really hoping that once Phyllis’s face is healed up she’ll stop pushing so much and maybe I won’t need an 8’ cage.


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Have you checked out Serpentine Obsessions they have gorgeous pvc enclosure as well maybe they can help? Glad Phyllis is going along as well as can be expected, best wishes always ;)

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Originally Posted by C.Marie

Have you checked out Serpentine Obsessions they have gorgeous pvc enclosure as well maybe they can help? Glad Phyllis is going along as well as can be expected, best wishes always ;)

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Their cages are beautiful! However the 8 footers are significantly more expensive than AP cages and not offered in a 2’ height either. I’m going to try and hold off on cage upgrades until her face is healed and see if she even needs a much bigger cage. Gerald definitely needs a bigger enclosure so that I can give his cage to the boa constrictor though


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How Phyllis and yourself holding up?

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Originally Posted by Stearns84

How Phyllis and yourself holding up?

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She really hates the twice daily mouth cleaning. She’s pissed on me at least three times in protest. Still super swollen top lips but it seems, I think, that the lesions are healing up. Supposed to keep applying the silver silvadiazine cream twice a day until it’s healed. 5 more rounds of fortaz injections to go. Those are getting slightly easier but still are a challenge to do solo. She’s in shed right now and hasn’t really pushed much if at all since having gone to the vet.
Still a bummer to see her looking the way she does but at least she’s not activity destroying herself at the moment so I guess that’s a positive development. Once she starts taking food again, hopefully after she sheds, I’ll offer a sizeable rat and then I’ve got 4-5.5lb rabbits to offer as well. Chest freezer was a great investment


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Originally Posted by jmcrook

She really hates the twice daily mouth cleaning. She’s pissed on me at least three times in protest. Still super swollen top lips but it seems, I think, that the lesions are healing up. Supposed to keep applying the silver silvadiazine cream twice a day until it’s healed. 5 more rounds of fortaz injections to go. Those are getting slightly easier but still are a challenge to do solo. She’s in shed right now and hasn’t really pushed much if at all since having gone to the vet.
Still a bummer to see her looking the way she does but at least she’s not activity destroying herself at the moment so I guess that’s a positive development. Once she starts taking food again, hopefully after she sheds, I’ll offer a sizeable rat and then I’ve got 4-5.5lb rabbits to offer as well. Chest freezer was a great investment


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Happy to see some improvement. Best wishes bud.

How's queen Phyllis doing?

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Originally Posted by 67temp

How's queen Phyllis doing?

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Thanks for checking in. Just gave her the 4th of 7 rounds of fortaz injections right now. Man she hates those.
Aside from that I did find two broken loose teeth and pulled them. One on both sides of her top gums a few days ago when applying her silver sulfadiazine cream. Looks like things are healing up. She’s also deeeeep in shed and hasn’t pushed at all in like two weeks so that helps minimize some facial trauma from flaring up.
Hopefully after she sheds she’ll have an appetite again. I think her face just hurt too much to eat last time I offered. I’ll offer either jumbo or colossal rat, and then slowly work up to the 4lb rabbit I’ve got on deck. Want her to be pretty well healed before giving prey that bighttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...439852f8a7.jpg


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You have my respect. I know has been a tough road. Happy you have not given up on her.

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Originally Posted by jmcrook

Thanks for checking in. Just gave her the 4th of 7 rounds of fortaz injections right now. Man she hates those.
Aside from that I did find two broken loose teeth and pulled them. One on both sides of her top gums a few days ago when applying her silver sulfadiazine cream. Looks like things are healing up. She’s also deeeeep in shed and hasn’t pushed at all in like two weeks so that helps minimize some facial trauma from flaring up.
Hopefully after she sheds she’ll have an appetite again. I think her face just hurt too much to eat last time I offered. I’ll offer either jumbo or colossal rat, and then slowly work up to the 4lb rabbit I’ve got on deck. Want her to be pretty well healed before giving prey that bighttps://ball-pythons.net/forums/cach...439852f8a7.jpg


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Big girl shed yesterday and ate again for the first time in three weeks, with great enthusiasm I might add. Face is healing up but still a little puffy and swollen. I think she’d been in some pain up until recently. Would explain her turning down food two weeks ago and not striking her previous meal.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...f3f1e816db.jpg


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Is she finished with her injections?

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Originally Posted by Dxw425

Is she finished with her injections?

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One more tomorrow and one Wednesday. I’m also like halfway through the tube of silver sulfadiazine cream and was told to use that twice daily until healed. It’s looking much better after I found and pulled the two broken teeth. She’s definitely getting REAL sick of me grabbing her by the head twice a day to clean her and such. Hopefully not too much longer. Getting ready to get her an 8’ cage too


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Glad to see her healing well and still growing jmc. She's a beautiful girl.

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Originally Posted by EL-Ziggy

Glad to see her healing well and still growing jmc. She's a beautiful girl.

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Thanks buddy! Honestly I’m hoping she’s slowing a bit on the growing but she’s a very manageable snake for her size either way.


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Look at Phyllis looking all fabulous after a nice bath and fresh coat of paint, so happy to hear things are going pretty smoothly for you both, you deserve it:gj: not many people would put their own needs aside and work as hard as you have , you truly are an inspiration to those of us who long to get a reticulated python thank you so much for taking us along on the journey, best wishes always..

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Originally Posted by jmcrook

Big girl shed yesterday and ate again for the first time in three weeks, with great enthusiasm I might add. Face is healing up but still a little puffy and swollen. I think she’d been in some pain up until recently. Would explain her turning down food two weeks ago and not striking her previous meal.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...f3f1e816db.jpg


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I'm really glad she is doing better. I really wish I could get a small pool in my enclosure!

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Originally Posted by Stearns84

I'm really glad she is doing better. I really wish I could get a small pool in my enclosure!

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Thanks man! Now that she’s done being in shed she’s really starting to put up a fight about having her mouth cleaned and ointment applied. Not very fun for either of us.
Go with a 30” deep cage and these concrete mixing tubs from Lowe’s are perfect. I’m using one as a water bowl and another upside down with a hole in it as a hide.
Bonus pic of her colors fairly fired up before tonight’s topical treatments
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...eef8addbe3.jpg


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5 days past feeding day. Peed all over the hallway last night and then pooped in her pool and climbed into it this morning 🤮
Cleaned up the poop soup and gave her the final fortaz injection. Currently curled up in her pool. No pushing as of now. Hoping that having a large enough place to soak recently and having three broken teeth pulled from her face is solving the pushing issue. Cross your fingers with me


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Originally Posted by jmcrook

5 days past feeding day. Peed all over the hallway last night and then pooped in her pool and climbed into it this morning 🤮
Cleaned up the poop soup and gave her the final fortaz injection. Currently curled up in her pool. No pushing as of now. Hoping that having a large enough place to soak recently and having three broken teeth pulled from her face is solving the pushing issue. Cross your fingers with me


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That's great!

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She’s has now pooped in her water twice today. Never done this before in the 2.5yrs I’ve cared for her. No signs of pushing though so I guess I’ll take it lol


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Someone is trying her best to imitate a bird me thinks that what my cocktail would do every time I gave fresh water it was thanks for the drink poop :rolleyes: such a silly girl but yeah much better than mashing up her beautiful face.

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Originally Posted by jmcrook

5 days past feeding day. Peed all over the hallway last night and then pooped in her pool and climbed into it this morning ��
Cleaned up the poop soup and gave her the final fortaz injection. Currently curled up in her pool. No pushing as of now. Hoping that having a large enough place to soak recently and having three broken teeth pulled from her face is solving the pushing issue. Cross your fingers with me


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She's looking good! How long do you think the teeth have been broken? Was it lower teeth stuck in the upper jaw or was it teeth that had broken but were still being held in place by the gums?

I am seriously wondering if it was the broke teeth that caused the pushing or the pushing that caused the broke teeth. I know if I had a tooth ache I would be climbing the walls for relief.

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Originally Posted by 67temp

She's looking good! How long do you think the teeth have been broken? Was it lower teeth stuck in the upper jaw or was it teeth that had broken but were still being held in place by the gums?

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It was three teeth in her upper jaw still lodged in her gum tissue. One just kind of fell out when I was applying her silvadiazine cream, the other two were noticeably loose but had to be pulled with tweezers. Hard to say how long they’ve been broken but I feel like they’d been bugging her for at least a month. This was about a week ago that I pulled the third tooth. Seems to be well on the mend now.


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Originally Posted by Skyrivers

I am seriously wondering if it was the broke teeth that caused the pushing or the pushing that caused the broke teeth. I know if I had a tooth ache I would be climbing the walls for relief.

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Hard to say. What I do know is that she would almost always push as soon as she passed her previous meal and would keep pushing until fed again. She pooped yesterday and has not pushed at all last night! I really hope this means we’re in the home stretch


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I hope so. I’m really hoping your problems with her are over.

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Originally Posted by jmcrook

Hard to say. What I do know is that she would almost always push as soon as she passed her previous meal and would keep pushing until fed again. She pooped yesterday and has not pushed at all last night! I really hope this means we’re in the home stretch


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This makes me wonder if after feeding they are less sensitive to pain till they finish digesting? IDK. Just one of the silly things I think about in these situations.

Here is the complete thought here.

1. Issue with teeth hurt so she is going nuts.
2. Eats and food coma sets in and is less sensitive to the tooth pain.
3. Pain comes back and rampage begins again.
4. Gets fed again because of pushing and food coma provides temporary relief.


All speculation but it might carry some weight. I would add checking teeth or other painful health issues to check when pushing begins.

Best wishes with her.

Was pushing a bit earlier tonight. Sure, 7 days since last feeding and it was only a jumbo rat. Thawed her a rat right now, blatantly uninterested in food. Temps are 78-84. Humidity 75%. Has big hide and same size water bowl. Climbing options. You name it. No idea what her deal is. Only thing I still haven’t tried is breeding her or an 8’ cage which is on the way.


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Originally Posted by jmcrook

Was pushing a bit earlier tonight. Sure, 7 days since last feeding and it was only a jumbo rat. Thawed her a rat right now, blatantly uninterested in food. Temps are 78-84. Humidity 75%. Has big hide and same size water bowl. Climbing options. You name it. No idea what her deal is. Only thing I still haven’t tried is breeding her or an 8’ cage which is on the way.


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Is her face and teeth all healed up?

You will figure it out. Keep working on it.

I guess try the 8ft cage before breeding but who knows at this point? Breeding was my first guess but you have the cage on the way already and that doesn't require dealing with eggs or baby retics.

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Originally Posted by Skyrivers

Is her face and teeth all healed up?

You will figure it out. Keep working on it.

I guess try the 8ft cage before breeding but who knows at this point? Breeding was my first guess but you have the cage on the way already and that doesn't require dealing with eggs or baby retics.

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Nope. Still swollen. Wounds not as bad looking though.
Paired her and Gerald the other night. He was way into it. Her not so much. New cage should hopefully be here in a couple weeks


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If first time might take a couple of attempts to get her use to the idea of being close to another snake. What did she do? Hide from him?

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Originally Posted by jmcrook

Nope. Still swollen. Wounds not as bad looking though.
Paired her and Gerald the other night. He was way into it. Her not so much. New cage should hopefully be here in a couple weeks


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Hide from him?! Not hardly...
bucked coils, wagged her tail, gaping vent, peed all over. Very standard retic female signs of saying “nope”


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Originally Posted by jmcrook

Hide from him?! Not hardly...
bucked coils, wagged her tail, gaping vent, peed all over. Very standard retic female signs of saying “nope”


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Well that is a clear no! I think you can check that box off the list. Best wishes on solving this.

Third refused meal in a row. Won’t eat, won’t breed, won’t stop pushing... this is my hell right now. Seriously considering selling her.


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Originally Posted by jmcrook

Third refused meal in a row. Won’t eat, won’t breed, won’t stop pushing... this is my hell right now. Seriously considering selling her.


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Hey man,

Hold off until you get the new cage. If that doesn't change things, I fully support your thought to sell or place her. Maybe a trade for another?

Not that you need a go ahead from me, but I know somewhat know how you feel. I've been a bit irritated with Wallace since he hit his adult size. Lately his little, male brain makes him a bit loopy. He had a go at me today even after I tapped him with the hook. The situation was still my fault as I know I have to get him moving the other direction completely before trying to remove him.

I finally got hold of him, and he did his damn tail whip and emptied half the substrate out of his cage onto the floor.

After that, he was fine, however I started to wonder if the hassle of dealing with him was worth it.

I guess the point being here is this. We all have limits, and other obligations. Most of us, I would assume have other hobbies and other aspects of life to channel our energies.

You are still getting grounded in your teaching/educating career and don't have "helpers" at the dial of a phone.

If that new cage doesn't fix things, you've covered it all and should not have to have a hobby become a life stress inducing situation.

Good luck brother!

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Originally Posted by Gio

Hey man,

Hold off until you get the new cage. If that doesn't change things, I fully support your thought to sell or place her. Maybe a trade for another?

Not that you need a go ahead from me, but I know somewhat know how you feel. I've been a bit irritated with Wallace since he hit his adult size. Lately his little, male brain makes him a bit loopy. He had a go at me today even after I tapped him with the hook. The situation was still my fault as I know I have to get him moving the other direction completely before trying to remove him.

I finally got hold of him, and he did his damn tail whip and emptied half the substrate out of his cage onto the floor.

After that, he was fine, however I started to wonder if the hassle of dealing with him was worth it.

I guess the point being here is this. We all have limits, and other obligations. Most of us, I would assume have other hobbies and other aspects of life to channel our energies.

You are still getting grounded in your teaching/educating career and don't have "helpers" at the dial of a phone.

If that new cage doesn't fix things, you've covered it all and should not have to have a hobby become a life stress inducing situation.

Good luck brother!

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Thanks Gio. I talked on the phone with my vet earlier. She said she and her husband both have been trying to figure out what Phyllis’s deal could be. I mentioned my theory that it could be an infection in her jaw bone(s) that we just can’t detect without X-rays. She thinks it’s worth a look if that’s what I want to try. Will probably have to be the weekend after this upcoming one, with fall semester starting and me being in a new role at the university on top of the fact that this vet is a 2.5hr drive for me. She said she’d bring her husband to her clinic and we can all put our heads together and maybe try X-rays and such.
Shy of trying the huge cage I just don’t see how it can be husbandry related with how many variables have been addressed. If cage or X-rays can’t find or solve the issue I might just have to throw in the towel. I’d be devastated but this behavior is affecting every other aspect of my day to day life anymore, and I just can’t deal with it.
I still love the species but just can’t help but wonder if I just with my luck got the worlds most troublesome super dwarf.
I’ll keep ya posted


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How's Phyllis?

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Originally Posted by Stearns84

How's Phyllis?

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Still pushing and still won’t eat. Has only eaten one jumbo rat in the last 5 weeks. Going to offer food again tomorrow. Mouth still swollen and bruised looking. Off hours vet appointment Sunday with my vet and her vet husband. Something’s gotta give eventually, right?


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